Our stimulus money given to... Microsoft?

[OriginalWheelman]

Yes, because they needed the $11 mil.

Should a bridge that would connect two campuses at Microsoft's headquarters be funded with $11 million from the federal stimulus package?

Critics of using stimulus money for the bridge say it would give the software giant a break on a pet project. They also say it serves as a warning sign of how some stimulus money is not being used to finance new projects but is being diverted to public works already under way.

Supporters argue the bridge is an ideal public-private partnership that will benefit an entire community while fulfilling the stimulus package's goal of getting people back to work.

"It's going create just under 400 jobs for 18 months constructing the bridge," says Redmond Mayor John Marchione. "It's also connecting our technical sector with our retail and commercial sectors so people can cross the freeway to shop and help traffic flow."

Marchione applied for federal stimulus money after costs jumped on the project from $25 million to $36 million. Marchione says the increase in costs were due to a rise in construction prices and because the bridge will be built on a diagonal in order to connect Microsoft's original East campus with a newer West campus that are split by a public highway.

Microsoft is hardly getting the bridge for free. The company is contributing $17.5 million or a little less than half the tab of the $36 million bridge, which would be open for public use.

http://www.cnn.com/2009/US/03/...ories

[smockers83]

Microsoft isn't getting the money, the city of Redmond is and coincides with the cost increase.

[OriginalWheelman]

The project is Microsoft's and they were footing the bill entirely until this point. They surely would have finished the bridge either way. There are much cheaper ways to build that bridge than the one pictured.

[dusred]

Critics slam Microsoft bridge as waste of stimulus money

What!?

The whole damn stimulus package is a waste of money. Why are they whining about a measly 11 million? I'll tell you what was a waste of stimulus money the couple BILLION they gave to ACORN. Why are they boobing about this? Because Microsoft is another one of those greedy greedy rich companies that is stealing all our money.

People are just plain stupid.

[smockers83]

Uh, where did it say Microsoft at one point was footing the whole bill?

The original bill was $25 million with Microsoft putting up $17.5 million. Then it jumped to $36 million yet Microsoft is still putting up $17.5 million. So who's paying for the rest of it? Oh, that's right, the city of Redmond.

C'mon, do a little reading. The mayor of Redmond on behalf of Redmond applied for the money, not Microsoft.

There's going to be criticisms on virtually every project. The point of stimulus money is to dump money into the economy and give people jobs. Had it not been for the $11 million, the project would be on hold, some number of people wouldn't have a job to do, and infrastructure wouldn't be built. Wasn't that the big thing, or at least supposed to be the big thing of the stimulus, infrastructure?

Back in the day, the government built golf courses and dams and what have you.

It began as a public-private project and it still is a public-private project.

[OriginalWheelman]

Yeah but it wasn't MY money being spent to build their bridge. If Redmond and Macrosoft want to build a bridge let them. Why the hell should I, someone ON THE OTHER SIDE OF THE CONTINENT have to pay for their bridge?



That's a hell of a long drive to get to use my bridge.

[dusred]

Dude, the stimulus money is being used nationwide. You'll never be able to partake of all the stuff built by it.

[smockers83]

Oh, well, all the s*** in California that's being built because of the stimulus package, when in the hell am I going to use all of that? Never. Or how about in Texas? Florida? Alabama? Oregon? Colorado? Michigan, I may hardly ever use the projects designated to receive funding in my own state if at all.

Get real, we cannot draw up a million different stimulus packages and figure out who lives in each of those million areas to determine who's money should go towards their respective areas.

There is criticism and then there is complaining with excessive criticism that makes no sense. This is the latter.

Oh by the way, you paid roughly 4 cents for that bridge. If you want to drive there to use it to make your 4 cents worthwhile, by my guest.

[OriginalWheelman]

Oh, well, all the s*** in California that's being built because of the stimulus package, when in the hell am I going to use all of that? Never. Or how about in Texas? Florida? Alabama? Oregon? Colorado? Michigan, I may hardly ever use the projects designated to receive funding in my own state if at all.

Exactly why the stimulus as a whole was BS.

Get real, we cannot draw up a million different stimulus packages and figure out who lives in each of those million areas to determine who's money should go towards their respective areas.

Or we could have done nothing. Which, according to a congressional committee, would have been better anyway.

There is criticism and then there is complaining with excessive criticism that makes no sense. This is the latter.

It's another example of how this fast legislation was passed under the guise of helping America only to really be more pork barrel crap.

Oh by the way, you paid roughly 4 cents for that bridge. If you want to drive there to use it to make your 4 cents worthwhile, by my guest.

And so did every other tax payer. My Mom paid 4 cents, so did my Dad, my brothers, a bunch of people in Florida, all the oil well workers in Texas paid 4 cents, everyone paid 4 cents. All of us paid 4 cents so that soem people in Washington could have a nicer commute? If you had asked everyone in the country to donate 4 cents to this project, I bet a lot wouldn't have bothered. Now the government comes along and DEMANDS 4 cents from me to pay for it, and if I DON'T pay my share for Redmond's bridge, I go to jail. That is not fair. That is not why the government is in place.

[dusred]

The Government needs to look at money like you and I are right now which is spending each dollar as if it was our last and if it isn't going to make you money you simply don't do it. If that was the mentality in Washington this Country would coast right through a recession.

[smockers83]

You can't stimulate an economy without spending nationwide.

Who said we'd be better off if we didn't stimulate the economy? They have forgotten how much we've learned over the years and how much more stable we've made our economy. If we do nothing, in the ups and downs, we will see high volatility in the economy, which isn't good. An economy is much better with lower volatility or in other words more stable.

[OriginalWheelman]

And just how many times have I paid 4 cents? How many projects did we all have to pay in taxes instead of buying a new TV or new clothes, or paying off bills, things that would actually help the economy?

[smockers83]

TVs and clothes are made overseas.

Here's the thing with government spending. Government spending has what is called a multiplier. If the government spends money directly in the economy, that money is then spent directly elsewhere, possibly creates jobs, and creates more spending, hence the government multiplier. If the government hands out checks in the form of tax deductions and what not, some of the money is saved, reducing the stimulating effect of the money put out and it creates no jobs.

If we don't pay the 4 cents for this project and that project, how will these projects even become projects in the first place? Nearly every road you drive on has public money in it, whether it came from funds generated by mills, state taxes, or federal taxes, or a combination of the three. The whole interstate system was built with federal funds. You pay a national tax, that tax can be used anywhere in the nation, it does not have to get returned to you or used for you. Just as your state tax does or even your local taxes.

[OriginalWheelman]

Your examples are irrelevant. The road tax is part of my local taxes, and the interstate highway is beneficial to the whole country. Don't forget why it was built, for troop deployment. Neither of those is a bridge being built 2600 miles away.

As for the government multiplier, that sounds suspiciously like trickle down econ.

[intermilanrox]

TVs and clothes are made overseas.

so what.... If he buys clothes the store gets a profit, the more clothes people buy, the more money the store makes, the more money the less layoffs would occur, which would insure their employees would have job security. If they have job security, they are more likely to go out and spend more money, than someone who is in danger of losing his/her job. It's a giant circle. On top of that the gov't gets part of that from taxes to help fund NECESSARY projects.

He also stated that people could pay off bills. This would result in the same way as the clothes example. He pays a little more on his car payment and that money goes to fund a person's paycheck who might have been fired otherwise. Now if it's something like a loan/mortgage, the banks would get more money to invest and stabilze the economy.

[WDRacing]

Ahh, yet another thread about the stimulus package not being spent correctly...or just being upset that it exists at all.

Get over it people, it's not going away and you're vote doesn't count for what it's going to be spent on. The people elected this administration, now sit back and watch the debt pile up.

The great hope is here...and he's spending your money. What we need is 11 million worth of motivational brainwashing...I mean speeches from Obama so we can all smile and sleep better.

America decided our course of action. Fueled by a majority that recieved it's opinion from the media. Well sit back and walk down the chosen path. Don't worry about the debt, 4 generations from now can float the bill.

[telcoman]

Exactly why the stimulus as a whole was BS.

Seems to me like it is beginning to work.

My 401k plan is up compared to Jan 20th when Bush left

Or we could have done nothing. Which, according to a congressional committee, would have been better anyway.

What congressional committee?

Who were the members?

It's another example of how this fast legislation was passed under the guise of helping America only to really be more pork barrel crap.

I seem to remember this one.

http://www.reuters.com/article...80901

Telcoman

[smockers83]

For the love of god, trickle down economics does not exist!!!!!!!!!!

How many times do I have to say it?

If government spending is trickle down economics, then your spending and my spending is trickle down economics. If people can't grasp that people and institutions spend money and then people/institutions spend money after that with the money they were paid, then I don't know what's wrong with the world. It's an economy, money flows!!!!!!

The government multiplier actually comes out of Keynesian economics.

So, I-75 is beneficial to you? And I-94, 96, 70, 35, 89, etc.?

Federal road funds do not come out of state taxes. At the local level, taxes applied to gasoline fund the federal road trust fund, go to DC and then are returned to the states based on a formula. With gasoline there are federal and state taxes applied. If a municipal decides to build a road, they will use funds generated from local taxes and also apply for grants at the state and federal levels.

My examples are irrelevant? What example did I give? Your examples were irrelevant as they were things made overseas. Yes, jobs are created selling the things.

Also, the users of the English language need to learn the difference between insure and ensure. This is one of my biggest pet peeves as of late, this isn't directed at you intermilanrox, just a general rant because of you. They are essentially synonymous but there are times where you used one or the other.
Modified by smockers83 at 5:35 PM 4/1/2009

[WDRacing]

Ease the F up bro...

99% of us don't have ANY formal education in finance like you do. We simply go on what things have been called in the past and whether or not they have worked.

You saying there is NO SUCH THING is false in our opinions because it was friggin called Trickle Down...

So have seat, drink a beer and relax.

[smockers83]

Sorry, apologies.

It's just frustrating when someone says trickle down economics and every time that happens I have to prove it wrong.

It existed/exists as a political theory, but even the people that created the term say it doesn't actually exist.

Unfortunately I'm out of beer. But I will calm down.

Again, sorry.

[smockers83]

So, I-75 is beneficial to you? And I-94, 96, 70, 35, 89, etc.?

Eh, wrong side of the country to make this applicable. My bad. How about the interstates on the west side of the country?

[WDRacing]

Sorry, apologies.

It's just frustrating when someone says trickle down economics and every time that happens I have to prove it wrong.

It existed/exists as a political theory, but even the people that created the term say it doesn't actually exist.

Unfortunately I'm out of beer. But I will calm down.

Again, sorry.

No worries homie...

Just calling it out

[OriginalWheelman]

So, I-75 is beneficial to you? And I-94, 96, 70, 35, 89, etc.?

Don't forget why it was built, for troop deployment.

And I said "sounds suspiciously like trickle down econ" I didn't say it was the same thing. The core argument is that spending will create jobs and create spending.

[smockers83]

So if the Chinese army is on the west campus threatening to pirate all of Microsoft and the US is on the east campus, without the bridge the US can't deploy troops. The Army engineers would have to come and devise a way to get troops across. But if the bridge was already there, no need to worry about it.

The government can also deem it as a postal route. I'm sure a USPS truck will be going across that sucker.

[Urabus GodofTraction]

Sorry, apologies.

It's just frustrating when someone says trickle down economics and every time that happens I have to prove it wrong.

It existed/exists as a political theory, but even the people that created the term say it doesn't actually exist.

Unfortunately I'm out of beer. But I will calm down.

Again, sorry.

I'm STILL waiting for you to prove it wrong...

[smockers83]

Yeah, I did that months ago. Go find it.

[Urabus GodofTraction]

Yeah, I did that months ago. Go find it.

You blah blah'ed about some economic messiah and went all circular logic on us.

If I recall, I pointed out that Milton Friedman and Robert Mundell disagreed with you, and the thread went nunza.

[mcheddadi]

microsoft is the backbone of modern america.

it should get one BILLION dollars not cheapo 11 millions

[dusred]

microsoft is the backbone of modern america.

it should get one BILLION dollars not cheapo 11 millions

[miltonbradley]

They deserved it.

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