[NY Residents - PSA] NYS to require legal tint during state inspection now...

[Ilya]

http://www.newyorkupstate.com/news/2016 ... :614969492

https://www.nysenate.gov/legislation/bills/2015/A4106

Thoughts?

My thoughts:

Anyone who says this is for cop safety is full of it.

1) If someone wants to open up on a cop, he'll do it anyway. Tint or no tint.
2) The only thing not having tint will do is allow a cop to see someone who is fidgeting before they leave their cruiser, etc.
3) If a person has a gun under their seat or in between the seat and center console, they could in theory already have it locked and loaded on their lap as the cop is walking up.
4) Only way a cop would see #3 is when he's even with the B pillar...TOO LATE. Cop dead.

Then there is the economic ramifications of such an asinine law:

1) Business who perform tinting will now either close (if they are 100% tint shops) or lose revenue (if they do other stuff like sound). This means less tax revenue for the state.
2) Towns and municipalities lose out on making extra cash on $150 tint tickets as the number of tinted cars, in theory, will exponentially decrease over the next year.

Evidently NY takes cop safety seriously and.....FL doesn't care? In FL limo tint is basically legal. I once borrowed a car from a friend when I was there on vacation which looked like the windows were spray painted black. I had to roll that crap down to see if I could pull out into traffic. No care in the world.

Why not, as a friend suggested on FB (and what I personally do when I get stopped), make the law that you have to lower all windows + turn on your interior lights when pulled over? Would achieve the same results without all of the stupidity.

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Anyone know what it would take to re-register my car in Vermont? I registered an old 1989 Kawasaki bike there with no issue using a NY address and NY insurance (although I got the insurance after the fact IIRC)...same for cars? I've read conflicting things.

[Bubba1]

I guess I'm full of it. . My view, it's not the bleak, dire, disaster- is-coming- Armageddon law that you're suggesting. NJ has had a similar tint restriction law on the books for decades. I got stopped many years ago by a NJ cop as he thought my then new car's tint was too dark. He quickly confirmed it was legal and no ticket issued. He also told me the NJ law came about as a result of officers getting killed during routine traffic stops where they had trouble identifying the danger inside due to the dark tint. I imagine the NY law has similar roots. You might consider doing some research before concluding that its not a police safety initiative, It probably is. But to offer some comments on your numbered points.

1. Nice generalization and untrue. It most cases, it's the exact opposite, if the danger is not detected by a cop, a perp is not normally just going to open fire. he's gonna let it go and escape. Think about that for moment. This ain't tv.
2. Another generalization. it actually allows the officers to not only see the occupants and their actions but what they're sitting with. You're right, an "all windows down during a traffic stop" can work too, well until people whine about having to do that in bad weather. The cold or moisture might (gasp) damage their Corinthian leather. You know that would happen. The tint option impacts a tiny percentage of the population by comparison, while roll down impacts everyone. (also don't forget not all cars have power windows. Could be impractical. while the cops might like it, majority of voters probably would not.
3. Yes, but every case is different. Another generalization.
4. So with that logic, I suppose an officer must get killed due to his being unable to see what's hidden by too-dark tint before something gets addressed. Oh wait, isn't that what happened in NJ?

Some thoughts about the "economic ramifications"

1. Shockingly tint companies still exist in NJ after many years of those laws. why? because the law restricts only how dark the tint can be, it does not ban tint altogether.
2. Yes, the law was not meant to be a revenue producer. In fact, fines are expected to drop as stubborn people eventually get tired of paying tickets.

As far as dark tint being allowable in FL (where the climate is significantly hotter) and not NY? States make up their own laws. That ain't changing any time soon. It's like state helmet laws. Some states require them. Some don't. It is what it is. In PA, you must wear a seatbelt in a 3 ton Ford Excursion, but do not need a helmet for motorcycle. Silly. But that's the state law. If I hated the law that much, there's nothing preventing me from moving to another state that has more logical laws. Same goes for tint, If the tint law bothers you that much, then move to FL.

As far as how it'll be enforced. Difficult to say. Have to wait and see. Short term, it appears it's only going to impact you for the next annual inspection. At some point, perhaps after all registered vehicles cycle thru inspections, police will probably issue tickets for those that choose not to fix it at the time of inspection. As for out of state vehicles? I'm guessing they won't issue tickets for out of state cars unless there's another infraction. But you gotta check the fine print to be sure. I'm not going to do it for you as 1. I live in PA, 2. I have 50 state legal OEM tint in all my vehicles, and 3. I don't care.

Regards.

[Ilya]

With all due respect, I feel like you skimmed over my post and didn't bother actually taking the time or effort to fully comprehend it. You just dismissed everything as a generalization lol.

Not sure how I generalized in any of my points.

1) What does TV have to do with anything? If you don't think a persons desire/ability/predisposition to open fire on a police officer isn't, for all intents and purposes, determined at the very beginning of the stop (such as them having warrants, etc.) then I'm not sure what to tell you. How is tint or no tint going to save an officer in the case where a perp has ZERO desire to be taken into custody or even questioned by the police? Go look at YouTube videos. There are lots of them. Some of those cars are untinted and the cop didn't know what was about to happen until he got right up to the window. Too late.

2 and 3) Having no tint does NOT let officers see what people are sitting with in their hands or lap. Not until he is up on them and at their B pillar. At which point the cop gets a few shots to the abdomen or chest if a perp so chooses. Can you see what I have in my lap if you're standing at the trunk of my car? Or near the fuel tank door? No. You cannot. That is no generalization. Go stand at the back of your car this very moment and have your wife sit in the drivers seat with a 'hand gun' (make a gun with your hand) and approach the window 10 times and tell her to vary her response from shooting and not shooting without telling you ahead of time which one it'll be. Report back how many times you saw her 'gun' and how many times you knew shots were coming. My guess is 100% of the time you'll have no clue. You will find out when you get next to the B pillar and by then she is inches away from you with a 'gun'. And your cars are untinted.

4) Again, cops have gotten shot while approaching untinted cars...so what's your excuse for that?

As for the economic stuff...

You are correct in that NJ law allows for ANY darkness on the rear side windows and rear window (BTW, who's to say that a rear passenger won't shoot a cop in that instance?). That still leaves a huge business opportunity for shops to cater to people with minivans, SUV's, etc. who want privacy for their kids, etc. Hence NJ shops still exist and people who choose to tint their front windows are subject to the discretion of the police. Meanwhile, the NY law has always been 70% (which is basically clear and not worth even spending money on) but now, instead of being up to the discretion of the police (I've been warned for my 25's five times probably - usually when they stop me just to see if I've been drinking or smoking after a sporting event in Albany and using tint as the reason for the 'stop' as I don't drink or smoke), it is now illegal and will cause me to fail my inspection. This effectively makes the tint completely illegal, unlike NJ. So apples to oranges.

Look at this image, what purpose does 70% tint (in NY's case) serve? It's basically useless. **Image is an estimation but should be close**



FL having hot weather and sun means absolutely squat to me. NY gets pretty warm in the summer when you're in a metal box. I want tint for the same reasons FL people want tint.

If you don't think tint laws, front license plate laws, things hanging from the mirror (got a warning for that once - for my graduation tassles), etc. are not revenue enhancers for the state and local municipalities, I have an oceanfront home in Wyoming to sell you. They are absolutely used as revenue enhancers and have zero to do with cop safety or even vehicle occupant safety. If tint was so vital to cop safety and would drastically limit the chance of police getting shot during stops, common sense would dictate that almost all if not all states would have similar laws on the books or hell, perhaps the Fed would even require them or police unions would push states to have them. But, you have states which don't require front plates (NY does - they even ban completely clear license plate covers lol), you have states that allow basically limo tint (NY does not), etc.

As for moving to another state...no offense but that is a dumb comment and a cop out (no pun intended) in regards to the entire conversation. Why even waste time on discourse if your only opinion is, "if you don't like it, leave." It's not easy for some people (me) who are well into their adult life and have many ties to the area (be it career, church/personal, family, friends, etc.) to just leave. I'd love to live in a warmer place with lower taxes, but I have other things to worry about too.

I want my politicians, instead, to talk to the people and put this kind of stuff up for a vote (amongst people, not the politicians) instead of willy nilly passing laws that few want but themselves (likely because some group paid them to push the bill) and that make little to no sense. AND laws that they themselves will likely not follow.

For the record, I donate to police unions and am MOST DEFINITELY pro-cop when it comes to the issues in this country the last 2-3 years. I have nothing against cops, but this law is BS...especially because I guarantee you the Governors motorcade will still be limo tinted while the peasants (me) can no longer do that.

[Bubba1]

I read your original post, but after seeing the sheer size of your nuclear response, I now officially regret offering my opinion on this topic. Carry on.

[Ilya]

lol...that should take maybe a 2-3 minutes to read.