Notice to All: 1994 Q Starting issue

[bravetex]

This happened: First key start ended quickly with odd sound like the starter was not engaging flywheel. Shortly thereafter a burning rubber smell eminated from under the hood. Two more attempts to hear it just spinning, like there was no compression. With help, I observed the fan spinning (thus the crankshaft) so I deduced it wasn't starter.Seemingly, no compression. No clunking sounds (like a broken timing chain.)Battery strong. Engine turns effortlessly.It's like there are no plugs in the threaded openings. [this was original posted problem]

OK, here's what happened. I did have an early Christmas!An infinity dealer mechanic told me it was a long shot, but there was a chance that the "hydraulic lifters" had bled down. He said that he had seen it once in his 17 years as an Infinity mechanic.

He suggested that the lifters were holding the valves open, thus no compression. And I tell you that the engine was spinning fast a freely when it wouldn't start. The crankshaft was turning, the camshaft was turning, but the lifters weren't moving the valves. The engine must have compression, fire, and gas to start.

His suggestion was to hold the gas pedal down, simulating the choke effect, and just crank the engine until the engine starts. And that it might take three to eight minutes to start.

So, the engine had been pronounced dead by timing chain suicide by five mechanics and had been down for five weeks. I was sick because I had just put 1800$ into new AC and alternator.

So I ran over to the shop late in the evening and turned it over two minutes before the battery ran down. At the last second I detected an firing event.We charged the new battery up next morning, and cranked on it for three minutes.By the Grace of God it started! Ran like nothing ever happened, like it did before, which is smooth as silk! The mechanic was duh..duh..duh all over himself.

Ok, so the lifters bled down. I still don't know what that really means, but it's the best Christmas gift of the year!

[Raxephon]

HLA's (Hydraulic Lash Adjusters) always have oil in them.

If they "bled down" , then they don't have enough oil.

[Q451990]

Well, I think your tech. got the right fix, but for the wrong reason! It's very, very, common for these engines to flood during cold weather if they aren't allowed to warm up properly after a cold start and then shut down. A typical scenario is someone starts the car to move it to a different space, then tuns the car off in less than a minute.

What's happening is the ECU is set up to send a very heavy hit of fuel to the cylinders while trying to start in cold weather. Esentially it's a choke - but instead of removing air, it adds fuel - same effect on the fuel mixture, but different route. But - if the car is turned off soon after start-up, all of that extra fuel is left sitting in the cylinders. Then it washes the oil off of the cylinder rings.... so compression is lost. "Flooring" the pedal during cranking is the ECU's signal that the driver thinks the engine is flooded so it shuts off injectors...

Heath

[pdqwrx]

Congrats and good info to know....

[elwesso]

Good info to know..... Thats what i usually tell peope to do when it wont start....

go redline the car and get all that extra fuel out of the oil and offthe spark plugs.

[bravetex]

Well, I think your tech. got the right fix, but for the wrong reason! It's very, very, common for these engines to flood during cold weather if they aren't allowed to warm up properly after a cold start and then shut down. A typical scenario is someone starts the car to move it to a different space, then tuns the car off in less than a minute.

What's happening is the ECU is set up to send a very heavy hit of fuel to the cylinders while trying to start in cold weather. Esentially it's a choke - but instead of removing air, it adds fuel - same effect on the fuel mixture, but different route. But - if the car is turned off soon after start-up, all of that extra fuel is left sitting in the cylinders. Then it washes the oil off of the cylinder rings.... so compression is lost. "Flooring" the pedal during cranking is the ECU's signal that the driver thinks the engine is flooded so it shuts off injectors...

Heath

Thanks for your input. Your explanation is understandable.

[jamesmost]

thats awsome but 5 weeks down for no reason and all thar grief sucks. I know how i felt when i blew my motor (prob. my timing chain) will know soon.I had a frozen injector (at least that is what i was told it was) 2 winters agoSAME FIX hold down gas and crank for 5 minutes. I was w/o my car for only one day for that event.

[qsiguy]

94 Q45, had mine do that before, exact scenario. Moved the car a few feet turned it off then wouldn't restart later. That's what the mechanic finally tried and it's worked since. Nice to finally know why it happened.