non working links

[phanatikz32]

there are a lot of links in the suspensions section that do not work, it says they can not be found or have been moved or something. is there anywhere else i can find a write up on coilover installation and camber, caster, toe explanations and effects on ride?

[adrianfromthecastle]

well as far as suspension arms go.. zerothread/286065*its just a quick run down really, dont take it for like a bible or anything. It really gets more technical than that.Rear upper control arms control the rear camber, and camber plates control the front camber. As far as caster goes, you'll want inner and outer tie rods (aftermarket), cuz the stock tie rods aren't caster adjustable.

Coilover installations pretty easy. The only tools you'll need are:wrench set and breaker bar.Front:1. Lift whole front end (both wheels off the ground)2. take off wheels.3. remove the 3 nuts off the strut tower (top under the hood/ 3 per strut).4. carefully lower the wheels till the spring is loose5. take off the 2 studs and screws (iirc 14mm ones) that hold the strut to the knuckle6. replace with coilover.

Rear:1.lift rears wheels off the ground (support car by differential) 2. remove wheels3. remove the 2 nuts on top 4. carefully lower the struts till the spring is loose.5. remove the big nut at the bottom of the strut holding the strut to the knuckle6. replace with coilovers

I'm not sure if the socket sizes i said were the exact ones, it was just off the top of my head, but you don't need any fancy tools or anything.

If this is the first time removing the nuts, it may be tough, so use the breaker bar or rubber hammer method to get the nuts loose.

[phanatikz32]

i already know most of the arms and how they connect, i replaced most of my suspension components myself a few months ago, what i really want to know is how camber, caster and toe work and how they will effect your handling, ride quailty, tire wear etc.

also in the coilover installation what do you mean on step 4. for the front? do you have any pics?

[adrianfromthecastle]

i already know most of the arms and how they connect, i replaced most of my suspension components myself a few months ago, what i really want to know is how camber, caster and toe work and how they will effect your handling, ride quailty, tire wear etc.

also in the coilover installation what do you mean on step 4. for the front? do you have any pics?

camber is the angle of the tires. When you lower the rears, you'll see that the camber will dramatically increase (negatively), which results in less tire to ground contact (the inside will get more tire wear than anything else). This problem (depends on if you consider it a problem) can be fixed with rear upper contol arms.

caster angle is the rotational angle at which the front knuckle is at. It has more or less to do with "bump steer" (which isnt good), but can be corrected with aftermarket tie rods (tie rod ends). bump steer is basically the road bumps steering your wheel, instead of your hands, making it harder to control.

toe angle is just basically the directional angle at which the wheels sit at when facing forward. toe will probably affect your tire wear the most.

Just understand that when you lower your car [dramatically], you affect the geometry of everything.

I'm no super suspension guru, so hopefully someone else can either correct me or add more.

as far as step 4, I don't have any pics, but understand that when you take off the 3 nuts (per strut) up top, there will be nothing suspending them, so they will drop down. It's easier if you lift both wheels off the ground at the same time.

[nismofly]

as you go through a corner the compression of the suspension causes positive camber, the idea behind increasing negative camber is to make the tire "stand up" in the corner from the gained posi camber and in effect make for the largest contact patch in the middle of the corner, generating peak cornering ability

that amount of camber gain is the camber curve, and caster basically affects the camber curve, so that if you run more caster you wont have to run as much negative camber when the car is static, meaning the tires will be more stood up in a straight line, giving you better braking performance and straight line stability

the natural suspension compression caused by lowering increases negative camber by itself, which increases toe out...its this toe out that causes the uneven tire wear so many people mistake for camber wear, it can be corrected during the alignment process

more toe out will cause the car to be more responsive but also less stable, whereas toe in will increase stability but decrease response

seeing as you have a Z im not exactly sure what numbers to tell you to shoot for in an alignment, the way these things are affected are a lot different on a Z than the S chassis because of the different suspension designs

[adrianfromthecastle]

oy! for some reason, I felt you were asking for an S chassis.Just an FYI, my installation steps were for a 240, I've never touched a Z before... so I'm not sure what the difference would be in the installation process.

[phanatikz32]

more toe out will cause the car to be more responsive but also less stable, whereas toe in will increase stability but decrease response

so then if i were to tune my car for drift i would want to toe in in the front and toe out in the rear and a negitive camber in the front and rear to compensate for the extra + camber in the turns? also how would - and + caster effect the camber curve, for example does a - caster cause the camber to be - in the turn? also how does caster effect my handling, and i didnt quite understand what caster was, is it the angle of the coilover or......

[audtatious]

Gentlemen.....

Can we get any broken links fixed or recreate the information please?

Thanks, carry on....

[nismofly]

a typical setup would be 0 toe in front (no in or out), a tiny bit in in the rear (maybe 1/16th or 1/8th), a lot of caster (9-10 ish) and camber around -2 to -2.5 front, -1.6 to -2 in rear

again these are S chassis numbers, i know the camber will be less for your Z, but how much im not sure

Gentlemen.....

Can we get any broken links fixed or recreate the information please?

Thanks, carry on....

chet's stickies need work bad, ill talk to adrian tomorrow about that, been meaning to look at it for a while, just like ive been meaning to clean up the stickies and a bunch of other things

[audtatious]

Thank you sir. You are a Gentleman and a Scholar

[Nismo_Freak]

camber is the angle of the tires. When you lower the rears, you'll see that the camber will dramatically increase (negatively), which results in less tire to ground contact (the inside will get more tire wear than anything else). This problem (depends on if you consider it a problem) can be fixed with rear upper contol arms.

Tire wear is more a function of the toe that isn't corrected, but the focus of heat / pressure on the unladen / lightly laden interior edge aids it.

For the Z32 you can buy front upper control arms, and rear upper control arms. Both can be purchased at http://www.SPLParts.com

caster angle is the rotational angle at which the front knuckle is at. It has more or less to do with "bump steer" (which isnt good), but can be corrected with aftermarket tie rods (tie rod ends). bump steer is basically the road bumps steering your wheel, instead of your hands, making it harder to control.

I think what you are trying to explain in the first part is King Pin Inclination. KPI is the incline in degrees of the knuckle compared to the absolute vertical axis at the center of the knuckle. When the wheel pivots from steering input the inclination has an effect on the height of the car. That's why your car raises itself when you are at full lock. It is not easily adjusted as it would require a rebuild of the spindle design.

Caster angle is the measured angle between the centerlines of the hub (absolute vertical) and the suspension. Running more caster will draw the control arm forward towards the front bumper. To simplify caster just know you should run as much as you can get without causing clearance issues. It has some dynamic benefits to geometry, and it's only downside is increased steering effort which is marginal with such a heavy steering assist in Nissans powersteering systems.

toe angle is just basically the directional angle at which the wheels sit at when facing forward. toe will probably affect your tire wear the most.

Yep.

Just understand that when you lower your car [dramatically], you affect the geometry of everything.

You also are altering the starting point in your dynamic camber / toe gain curves. Meaning that next inch of travel will bring you larger changes in camber and toe. This excessive gain in toe and sometimes camber (which can alter align-torque minimally), is referred to as bump steer. It's a ****ty thing to have for any performance car. That's why aftermarket links are made, especially the "traction rods". By altering the length of the rod you adjust it's dynamic profile as the suspension compresses (or "bumps").

You can measure bumpsteer in a somewhat accurate method by getting your car on an alignment rack, and then putting weight in it. You can open the hatch and put sand bags in it, water buckets, fat friends, etc. You can measure the compression of the spring with calipers and from there derive your curve as you add more and more weight. Figure on adding about 300 - 500 lbs. of weight to derive a good idea of bump steer. Watch how the arms move and you will see how it affects the dynamic alignment. You can then see where approx. the arm is in relation to the curve and be able to predict those points you haven't / cannot measure.