No brake lights

[BadQ45t]

I found out on my way home in my new (old) 92' q that both brake lights are out. I assume that both of them going out at the same time isn't going to be bulbs, what else to check???

While I'm at it, this car is only a few miles from losing the extended warrenty which I hope will cover the brake lights too. The transmission will not shift into drive by pushing the brake, you need to push in the little button. So what else should I have the shop check for to get fixed before I lose this warranty????

Jeff L.

[DAEDALUS]

There are actually 4 bulbs, so the odds are quite slim thay're the problem. A year ago I would have said it's impossible, but I actually have a friend who let all 4 rear bulbs burn out on his Corolla. But 1 bulb passed a continuity check (intermittent) and troubleshooting the car became an excercise in patience and near-futility.Check the 15A fuse on the bottom of the right fuse column.The bulbs and the shifting problem might be related; the 2 systems are related from a circuitry standpoint. Maybe it's a bad ground, though I would think you would have other problems.Not sure what accountability the shop has in regard to the warranty, but if they're the ones that sold it to you I doubt they'll find you need many repairs. You will want to have a list of things on hand that you suspect need repair when you go in. (Add the chain guides and see what they say!)

[greg_atlanta]

It's the sensor attached to the top of the pedal. I had to replace mine about a year ago. Part is about $10. DIY item, but requires some yoga-like positions to get under there.

The same sensor overrides the shift lock mechanism, so that's definitely the problem. It's about the size of a spark plug, has a little button that moves in and out when the brake is depressed.

[BadQ45t]

I'll check out the fuses tomorrow, thanks for that tip. I will be taking into a dealership in the Bay Area that will only want to find stuff that is broke to bill the insurance company, so that shouldn't be any problem.

Thanks for the tips!

[Q451990]

I've had the bad brake lamp switch (fuse OK) and bad sockets that take out the fuse. Check the fuse first. If the fuse is gone you probably have a bad socket from overheating of the brake lamps. Pull the bulbs and look for melted lead tips. The socket assemblies are about $15 each. Using OEM bulbs tends to stop the problem.

Have you ever heard a "pop" in the radio when you press the brakes? If so it may be the switch Greg mentioned. I had a "pop" on the first or second time of hitting the brakes after start-up (especially in cold weather).

Heath

[BadQ45t]

The fuse was blown and I replaced it with a fresh one. That seemed to fix the situation up, but than I got a message on the little info screen saying Brake Light Inop. It went off when I braked and than came back on several miles later. Than it went off again, but the weird thing is that the whole time the lights were working.

Since I've only got 1.5k left on my dad's extended warrenty I'm thinking of taking it the dealership anyways, any ideas what the heck is causing this???

[Q45tech]

"any ideas what the heck is causing this???"

Normal bulb abuse by not performing preventative mainteance on your bulbs and sockets, allowing moisture vapor to remain in the lens assembly where it corrodes the button base contact point on the lamps.Not replacing a single burned out bulb letting the system run on the spare for an excess number of days.

Each bulb must be removed and the bottom examined along with all sockets.

When ever you have a blown fuse on a Q the real work starts, don't just replace the fuse and go on your way as all the fuses are large compared to the typical current flow. A blown fuse means something significant will need to be replaced.

In a few cases the fuse may be too large [they come in 5 amp steps] and failing motors [fan motor/fuel pump] just overload and smoke something else [fan control module/fuel pump controller]...............well the brake lights have a brake light sensor module which will fail if you don't change out defective bulbs and sockets!

[DAEDALUS]

One thing I've learned over the past few years of owning this car, based on my experience and that of so many others on this board, is that it's best to just replace all 4 brake bulbs with brand new ones if there are any problems. At least as a first step; I think this usually solves 90% of the brake lamp problems out there. The Sylvannia LL bulbs are about $3/pair--for $6 they can save a lot of aggravation. I will continue to replace all 4 as a set at the first sign of trouble.Definitely check the sockets for burn marks and melting, as suggested. The springbase in one of the sockets on my car was cracked at one point due to age and heat and the plastic around the terminals had begun to melt, making things worse.

[911/Q45]

Sometimes the small phillips screws on the sockets come loose, resulting in arcing and tail lamp warnings. Prophylactic tightening can save some aggravation and expense.

[Q451990]

When the fuse was out, were you able to put the car in P and then back in D? On mine the shift lock solenoid was controlled on the same circuit and when the fuse was out it didn't sense that I was pressing the brake pedal and wouldn't let the car out of Park. The dangerous part is that the "brake lamp inoperative" message only comes on for a minute... then it comes back as "OK" - but all of the bulbs are out at that point. I'm just happy I didn't get killed in a rear end collission!

In any case, I'd check the socket assemblies for corrosion or blackening on any of the contacts. Also look for melted bulb tips, etc. Just replace the socket assembly and replace with OEM or Sylvania LL bulbs (as mentioned earlier).

Heath

[Q451990]

Forgot to mention... this is a VERY common problem! When I bought my replacement socket assemblies (back in 1999) TJ had sold about 30 that year.

Heath

[BadQ45t]

thanks, it is going to the mechanic and I'll hopefully get him to replace all that stuff under the warranty! I was just anxious to get it working for my 400 mile trip.

[Q45tech]

The number one cause is using non oem bulbs [even some dealers use Mexican/Chinese clones].............Toshiba or Sylvania LL are all that are acceptable.

[BadQ45t]

Okay, so my plan was to take it into the dealership and have it checked out. They want $120 to touch the car and to determine if the problem is covered by the warranty or not. Is this something that a very novice DIY could do to at least see if the bulbs are the problem?

[911/Q45]

Access the taillight assemblies through the pull out panels in the trunk. The entire assembly comes out easily, then you can check all the stuff we've told you about.

[Q451990]

The assemblies just plug in... $15 - $20 each for parts - 10 minutes labor max.

Heath

[BadQ45t]

Wow, I'm gonna try that and see what it looks like in there. For the $125 that the dealership wants to touch the damn car I'm willing to spend some time trying to fix this myself.