No aftermarket cats after 1/1/09 in California

[Q45tech]

http://www.arb.ca.gov/msprog/a...t.htm

I missed this since I try to ignore CA but with the durability problems now on 2000+ models important to understand it is even illegal to advertise on internet if someone in California can buy your product. If you sell it to someone out of state and they bring it into CA for the purpose of installation you become part of crime without a suitable disclosure and warning.

"This means that no used converter can be legally advertised for sale, sold, or installed in California after this date."

In theory advertising on internet is advertising in California if you sell it there or it ends up there. Why junkyards won't sell used cats now if they understand the law.

http://www.arb.ca.gov/msprog/a...a.pdf

http://www.arb.ca.gov/msprog/a...y.php

[goody90q45]

Woe is us. I'm going to have to go to a library in Reno for their internet access and have the package delivered to the UPS Store on the strip if I ever have to replace a cat.

And our lawmakers wonder why businesses and people are leaving the state.

[TOPHER1987]

Cali legal sucks!! lol

[Q45tech]

The point is they will be looking under the car for cat violations NOW and the $10,000 fine will help the state's budget.

Roving bands of new inspectors paid only from violator's fines [they catch and ticket] no salary no benefits other than free bullets.

I could make a fortune at $500 [5%] per head in just a few towns.

[silver2k2]

what if you already had the cats installed, Couldnt you just say you bought it that way? How would they know the purchase date. I have had aftermarket cats and there was no date stamp

[gammer_ghn]

have you ever been pulled over? Sate needs money and the don't give a duck if you bought it that way. yes i did say duck.

[goody90q45]

Roving bands of new inspectors paid only from violator's fines [they catch and ticket] no salary no benefits other than free bullets.....

If we don't get a budget soon they'll be rationing bullets too.

Why do the feds and states care what controls are on the engine as long as what comes out the tailpipe is clean and meets the standards. I think the automakers might be able to come up with better solutions if they weren't be forced to install archaic emissions devices.

[Q45tech]

That's the rub aftermarket cats DON"T clean as well as oem cats PERIOD .The typical aftermarket cat brand new acts like an oem cat with 80,000 miles of use.A performance high flow cat may be like an oem cat with 200,000 miles of use.

If you read all the CARB info you will see the list of the very few models which will equal 4 years and 50k warranty and companies that cannot comply and dropped out of marketplace.

95% of them are cheap low quality junk masquerading as cats.

Hopefully the rest of US will follow CA at least in this regard and get the junk out of marketplace.

[Q45tech]

Remember their focus is on OBDII vehicles [1996 and +] as prior years standards are lower and if they pass the dyno test they pass the dyno test and are ok until the next time.

[silver2k2]

have you ever been pulled over? Sate needs money and the don't give a duck if you bought it that way. yes i did say duck.

Pretty sure you are innocent until proven guilty in a court of law. They can write the ticket but the burden of proof is on the prosecuter.

[Q45tech]

Hopefully they will abuse people enough so they just follow law rather than hire attorney, experts, and technical witnesses to try to fight the charges in court. Not being able to drive vehicle while you wait. Impound the offensive polluter until after trial.

Like others Feds you can plead guilty, turn in a few friends, and reduce fines by 75%............or pay the $10,000 if you lose in court. Your choice!

Bring up a good point it is Felony Fraud to sell a vehicle that has been emission tampered or the attempt to submit a passing test on a tampered vehicle.....................why many take them to Arizona/NV to sell to avoid the potential for backlash.

These are Administrative sanctions rather than criminal charges so they can confiscate/impound vehicle and your driving license to protect the public.

[Jesda]

This is gay.

[Bstrd240SX]

so if im here in NY, advertise a cat for sale, its sold to a guy in colorodo, and he gives it to his buddy in cali, im in trouble in california?

send me all the fines and sumons you want cali, ill file them next to the letters from my crazy ex gf !

[Romeo5k]

No wonder everyone from Cali is moving to Houston TX. Dang.. Its is rough out there.. Bad enough they said no state income tax for you guys.. ol well, better Cali than TX. Cause i dont think we would abide by this law.

[Q45tech]

Remember when Nissan/Infiniti saw things coming and relocated corporate to Nashville before the housing bubble exploded.

[Jesda]

Nissan didn't move because of housing. They moved to be closer to manufacturing operations in TN and MS and cut costs.

There was no magic real estate 8-ball on Ghosn's desk.

[bullittandy]

California really is like a different world. Their rules are ridiculously strict but that's the side effect of having no rules for so many years (with the resulting worst air quality in the nation).

Side effect is that when gov't forces a change like this an others, after a period of doomsday predictions by the business community about going out of business they are somehow able to figure out a creative way to solve whatever problem exists. Catalytic converters, we all should read what car people said about cats in the 70's-apacolyptic stuff.

[Jesda]

California really is like a different world. Their rules are ridiculously strict but that's the side effect of having no rules for so many years (with the resulting worst air quality in the nation).

Side effect is that when gov't forces a change like this an others, after a period of doomsday predictions by the business community about going out of business they are somehow able to figure out a creative way to solve whatever problem exists. Catalytic converters, we all should read what car people said about cats in the 70's-apacolyptic stuff.

They solve it by charging us more. There's no mystery to how they do it, MSRPs go up or something else gets cost-cut.

[Q45tech]

Maybe no Crystal Ball but deciding to move out of CA by end of 2006 sure looks like Holy* Intervention to me forcing those to sell out at the absolute peak of housing boom..............those smart enough to move [900] had Nissan buy their CA houses for market value.

"As one of the most affluent communities in Tennessee, Franklin is home to executives, business owners, music moguls, and other Nashville area elite. Median household income for the city is about $64,000 (2005 estimated), and median home value is about $237,000 (2005 estimated). The city was named one of the Top 100 Places to Live and one of the Top 10 Places to Retire by Money Magazine,......................."in Franklin, Tennessee is nestled in one of the largest family-friendly communities known as Fieldstone Farms. Its more than 2,115 homes are built in a wide range of impressive styles and prices span from the mid $100,000's to the upper $500,000's."

Those that said YES should kiss Goshen's feet.

* Holy does not reference any particular religion. Arda Fravash (Holy Guardian Angels of Zorasteria). Each person is accompanied by a guardian angel, which acts as a guide throughout life. They originally patrolled the boundaries of the ramparts of heaven, but volunteer to descend to earth to stand by individuals to the end of their days.

[slybydesignq45t]

The laws out here do suck. It also sucks that I haven't received my money, and honestly I don't expect to get it either. Another thing they stopped was giving free temp tags to cars that don't pass. On average you can spend over $100 now plus $50 thats $150 every time you want your car to pass smog. It sucks big time.

[unknown007]

Like any other thing that's illegal.People will continue to buy and install. Ca is going down hill with all these pointless laws.

[carnal_c30]

actually I somewhat agree with this for the most part, you still can buy aftermarket cats from approved sources like catco magnaflow etc

its not so bad besides on car forums there will always be availability of used cats... so hush hush shhhhhh hahaha

[bullittandy]

Good point on the quality aftermarket exceptions.

I just re-read the notice that tech posted and aftermarket cats that have a ARB exemption are allowed which means you have a lot of choices.

[goody90q45]

With 5 cars in the family I go through a lot of smog inspections and always pass the emissions portion on all my cars (good maintenance). My two Honda Accords with the VTEC engines always pass with practically zero emissions. Would the Honda engines burn clean without cats or are they a necessary evil?

[RyanH]

Wow, our incompetent state government keeps on reinforcing our decision to leave this place. It seems every time I have some doubts about our planned move, someone comes along with something like this, or no state income tax returns (not that its a big deal, cause it isn't much, but still, it shows just how bad a job our politicians are doing) and its like a pat on the back, and an, "It's okay, you've made the right choice."

[Q45tech]

No IC engine is clean enough without functioning cats especially at idle when there is little O2 control = just the RECENT memory of what happened previously at cruise to go by.

These are minor problems just wait until Carbon [CO2] capture from automobiles becomes US law or a $2 per gallon penalty tax is substituted.

[maxnix]

These are minor problems just wait until Carbon [CO2] capture from automobiles becomes US law or a $2 per gallon penalty tax is substituted.

But it is the breaking of the C and N bonds (among others also) that yeield so much energy.

4% of the world's population produces 25% of it's wealth. It there any wonder why we consume energy? Think there could be a correlation?

[flyin280zx]

cali can suck it hard. Its one thing to make people abide by common sense and have a cat but its a bunch of bs though when a cop pulls you over in an old zed and ask for you to pop the hood with a smile and then have him tell you that the l28ett you installed looks an offly lought like this here picture of an sr. 1 hour later a lought of cussing and threats of legal action later i find myself regretting coming to backwards place. I find these types of scams sickening and thats all it is to the local police a scam for your money. Last time I ever go there

[subtle_driver]

I live in california, i work at a smog repair/general repair shop. I hate dealing with all the stupid laws. it just makes life harder for us. every few months a new stupid test or check we have to do so a car has a higher chance of failing. and certain cars, older, they raise the bar so much, that even if you had a certain car from the 80's with zero miles and ran the smog, it would never pass. the car was never designed to pass. I wish they kept doing the 30 year rolling smog exemption. its not like there are alot of cars on the road that old anyways. I don't want to buy the new crap being made now.

rant...



ok i'm done.