Nissan's New sportscar lineup

[dareo]

Hypothetical, if i was in charge of Nissan's american fleet, here's what i'd do.

350z's low end trims are elimated, you want a Z? You get one thats 30k+ and has the good stuff on it.

RPS13 is sold, with an SR20DET engine, 16" alloys, powersteering, recaro seats, and thats about it. Very few standard options, very lightweight design in mind. Simple, practical, powerful, very driftable and the classic 180sx look. Sells for under 20k. Call it whatever you want.

Skyline GTR is brought to the US showrooms, with the RB26DETT and everything. This car is totally all out money is no object style, sells for over 50 grand.

I know Nissan doesnt have the balls to sell some serious Turbo cars anymore, and by that i probably mean to say money. Getting said turbo's to pass all the emissions and stuff would cost some serious dinero. Its not like an RB26DETT is cheap to produce in the first place. Who would buy a 350z if a Skyline GTR and a 180sx were also in the showrooms? Those are the reasons why i think Nissan doesnt do it.

Feel free to comment on my little Hypothetical thread of antiboredom.

[Onizuka]

you do know they we already have the skyine here right? Take a guess what the G35 sedan and soon to be released G35 AWD sedan sells as in japan...

The nissan/infiniti GTR will be released here too in a few years.

I do think there is room for a sub 20K compact RWD car though, i doubt nissan will ever make it though, RWD has to become a market selling thing for young people.

[MrFox]

The bottom line is that none of these cars can make the bottom line.

The SR and RB are obsolete. The basic design can no longer meet tightening emission standards in all of Nissan's potential markets (USA, Japan, Europe) without huge development budgets. Can Nissan justify the cost given the very limited # of applications that will still use these powerplants?

Similarly, the S13 and R34 chassis are outdated. They have always been niche market vehicles with relatively low sales volume. The Silvia and the previous GTR can exist because they share engineering, production, and components with other more pedestrian vehicles in Nissan's line up: ie Lepoard/J30 and Skyline R34. These cars are no more.

The only way a niche car can make it into production is to base it off a large volume platform. Perhaps a 4 cylinder, bare bones back to basics design based on the FM chassis can serve as the inspiration for the next Silvia.

[[Zero-S]]

FM chassis?

[Onizuka]

front midship platform, what the 350Z and G35 coupe use

[Checkered-Member]

Skyline GTR is brought to the US showrooms, with the RB26DETT and everything. This car is totally all out money is no object style, sells for over 50 grand.

Actually they are going to use, either.

VQ45DEOr VQ35DETT

[[Zero-S]]

No. He meant the R-series skyline, not the V.

And most likely the nissan gtr will be vq35dett

[dareo]

Yeah thats the sad truth, awesome cars and engines like RB26DETT just arent cost effective anymore. And emissions just ruin the plan even more. But seriously, how cool would it be to have a dirt cheap brand new 180sx with a turbo motor? I may be biased, but i love the S13 chassis and the inline 6 turbo engines. I'm gonna drive my '89 till the end of time. Here's why, its a simple car, small but not too small, and everything is easy to get to. I love the balance and controll of the layout, is there really another car that can compare that was made after the 240sx and sold in the united states?

[MrFox]

RPS13 is sold, with an SR20DET engine, 16" alloys, powersteering, recaro seats, and thats about it. Very few standard options, very lightweight design in mind. Simple, practical, powerful, very driftable and the classic 180sx look. Sells for under 20k. Call it whatever you want.

Heres my take on the next US-spec S-car

S-16 SilviaStripped down FM Chassis2+2 InteriorFew standard features15" Steelies$22k, competitive with RSX/Celica

Engines choices: (drumroll please...)KA24DE or VG33ER

Flame on!

[Mr1der]

where's Johnny Storm when you need him....

I think we need to start using "It's Clobberin' Time!" instead of flame on.

on the subject sorta, what's the VG33ER?

I'm a tard...

[jdmfreak]

Yes please enlighten me on what th VG33ER is.

[InstantRice]

isnt it one of the engines available in the frontier?

[InstantRice]

actually im almost positive it is. its his way of jabbing at the ka24 in the current incarnation of the 240.

[MrFox]

Yep. The supercharged V6 from the Frontier.

Reasoning: product placement (safely below 350/G35), emission certification, price, RWD layout, comparable output with competition (210hp), low risk development (QR mess)

[Onizuka]

Yes please enlighten me on what th VG33ER is.

SOHC 3.3 liter V-6, Electronic fuel injected, supcharged

you guys need to learn how to read nissan engine code.

[Onizuka]

Heres my take on the next US-spec S-car

S-16 SilviaStripped down FM Chassis2+2 InteriorFew standard features15" Steelies$22k, competitive with RSX/Celica

Engines choices: (drumroll please...)KA24DE or VG33ER

Flame on!

good idea, bad engine choice though.

the way i see it:

(x)16 250sxstripped down FM chassis2+2 interiorcloth interiorfew high price options16inch standard steelies, 17inch optional alloys$19,000-$23,000 price rangeQR25DE in RWD format

[MainEvent212]

steelies are a thing of the past...all sporty cars rock alloys...period

and it has to have a leather option, n make sure the cloth is something "sport inspired"

i say they should probably stick w/ something smaller like a altima engine setup for RWD...the 2.5L se...or is that the QR25DE?

lol i feel stupid now

[MrFox]

good idea, bad engine choice though...

QR25DE in RWD format

Elaborating, should Nissan be risking development funds to develop a long mount QR? The transverse mount QR is having quite a bit of trouble as it is. Not to mention there aren't many other platforms that can use such an engine (Unless the Truck line swiches over to the QR also)

steelies are a thing of the past...all sporty cars rock alloys...

Can you do this standard, and not price yourself out at the same time? This segment is very price competive - remember the WRX.

[skydragoness]

With Subaru and Mitsu/Chrysler, and Mazda offering turbo versions of their high selling cars, i don't think emissions is so much of an issue.

it's really about what Mr.Fox described. Nissan is in the process of getting back on its feet. i'm glad they came back with the 350z, and if they could somehow improve the se-r b15's engine, that would be great. Financially Nissan is getting back on it's feet... the b15 in the USTCC is a good show. hopefully nissan will make something in between the b15 se-r and the 350z, but who knows at this point. they're playing it safe for now before they make any ventures. but considering what models they offered a few years ago, to how many models they offer today---enough progress will eventually be made so that they can make the sports car to fill the slot between the se-r and the 350z. maybe... a 250z?

[Onizuka]

Elaborating, should Nissan be risking development funds to develop a long mount QR? The transverse mount QR is having quite a bit of trouble as it is. Not to mention there aren't many other platforms that can use such an engine (Unless the Truck line swiches over to the QR also)

well, it cant use a V6, that would step into 350Z territory,

Nissan has only 3 base motors they really use any more (in transverse and longitunenal configuration):the VG35DEthe VQ45DEthe QR25DE

they also are ading a 5.7 liter V8 for the titan and its SUV variant.

the KA is only availible in 3 of 12 trim levels in the pickuptruck and one of the three Xterra trim levels, and isnt held to the same emmissions standards as engines found in cars. They will probably drop the engine all together in a few years.

[MrFox]

well, it cant use a V6, that would step into 350Z territory,

Not even a SOHC 210hp V6? Its a pretty unattractive engine - enough to discourage those who can afford the 350, while fending itself against competitors at the $20k price point.

the KA ..... isnt held to the same emmissions standards as engines found in cars. They will probably drop the engine all together in a few years.

The emission standards for Light Duty Trucks are pretty similar to Light Duty Vehicles (Passenger Cars). http://www.epa.gov/otaq/cert/veh-cert/b00001a.pdf

The Nissan truck line has stuck with the VG and KA for a long time (since 86 I think). I don't have much love for either engine actually, just playing pretend Nissan parts-bin engineer.

[dareo]

Well if they dont want to engineer a turbo that will pass the modern emissions standards *glares at the state of California* then how about a QR variant of the RB25DE, all alumanum, high compression ratio, and a high redline? an alumanum I6 with an 8k redline would be an awesome car, and nissan could sell them tuned to 220hp or so, and not infringe on SE-R or 350z territory. Oh, and give it a durable 5 speed transmission, 6 speed can be saved for the Z. This car should be overbuilt so as to last a quarter million miles, and have people seeking after it 15 years later to supe up. It should be built in such a way that by simply installing a Nismo ECU, intake, and a nice full exhaust system you could have a 9k redline, and close to 300whp. A well balanced and designed 2.5l I6 N/A should be able to push that with bolt ons and the Nismo ECU exchange. Bring car to dealer, swap ECU, pay like 400 bucks, everybody's happy.

Combine that with a FM platform and 2+2 cloth seating, maybe a trick 3rd door kind of thing. This time, design it so you can have an inch of headroom if your in the backseat and almost 6 feet tall.

Going for a durable, efficient, sporty hatchback coupe. Not luxury but able to go fast all day long every day.

Or, they could do another KA24DE rendition, but this time totally design the car to allow for a Nismo turbo kit (240hp). That would be so dope. Totally bolt on install, it could even be a DIO (dealer installed option). Of course it would come with some cool Turbo and Nismo decals for the car. They could sell a car, and make money, then sell a turbo kit and make some more money.

As for the lights, go pop-ups. What car actually has pop-ups these days? It could be a new fashion statement. pop ups and a hood thats a bit longer than the S13, its gotta be to fit that pimp I6 revver in it.

One key feature that would be standard absolutly no matter what is a helical LSD or VLSD.

[Nathan]

I like the idea of a smaller, revvy I6...but I dont think they'd let it get close to 300whp with just factory available bolt ons...it'd seriously infringe on the 350z at that point. I think something more around the lines of 240hp after bolt ons, 210-220 before and about 2900 lbs. would fit perfectly into the lineup, being a rear wheel drive car that is small and sporty at about 20k BASE, 21k how you'd actually want it and 23k loaded or something.

[dareo]

Yeah it will be the 250z, with an alumanum I6 engine with over 200hp. Do a good VVT setup that would provide very smooth easy streetable power till about 5k when all hell breaks loose and the engine goes mad with power for another 3krpms. I would think that with basic aftermarket bolt ons, and a Nismo performance ECU upgrade it deserves to put down slightly better than stock 350z numbers. If they started selling this car as a 2005, there'd be plenty of boosted 350zs out there holding their own.

[toki]

Here is what I see:

They bring back the s13 hatch like mazda is bringing back the RX-7, bigger and badder.

Except make it a real sports car this time. Engine of choice would be something completly new. 2.1-2.2L turbo charged 4 cyl with VVT. Lightened up chasis with something to bring the weight to a true 50/50. 16" alloys. 5 lug ofcoarse, something comprable with the 300zx brakes. Oh. FACTORY TUNED. No dumb 2" exhaust system or boxed up intake or ghetto fuel maps. Adjustable suspension comes stock...i mean c'mon if porsche could do it in 88 why can't nissan do it now.

Like someone said before, car companies have no balls.

If any company hit the market with a 300hp N/A semi raced prep 4 cyl, that would be balls. It's not exactly that hard either from the standpoint of a car company. But that will never happen.

[dareo]

As for pricing, i think a $21,800 base MSRP would be a good place to start. And if its going to have a stereo, be the first carmaker to stop dinking around and just factory install an Alpine MP3 capable deck. That would be a nice place to spend a couple hundred bucks. Don't even think about putting some typical paper cone factory speakers in it either. I mean, dont even bother with putting in a radio if your gonna put crappy speakers in. Bust the extra 50 bucks and use 4 decent quality speakers. Its not that hard!

[dareo]

aahahaha YES! Toki's got it! As much as i love that kind of a car design, who would ever buy their 350z with that out? Its gotta be cool, but not so cool as to make the 350z look like expensive crap. a N/A Inline 6 is sounding like the best option for this class. pun intended.

[MrFox]

If any company hit the market with a 300hp N/A semi raced prep 4 cyl, that would be balls. It's not exactly that hard either from the standpoint of a car company. But that will never happen.

2 words: Kit Cars

[dareo]

While im head designer of this car, another rule, DO NOT PULL A DODGE on the interior. You may walk the fine line between Cheap and Inexpensive but make it a nice interior. If it ends up being some plasticy looking crap i'm gonna be sad. No rattles, go for a clean, quality look. Plastic is okay but be tasteful and spend the extra 50 cents on some good plastic. If it ends up with a 2002 Spec V kind of tacky interior, there will be jobs lost.

Engineer a new type of Oil sensor, capable of accuratly displaying total volume of oil, oil condition and oil pressure. While were at it lets make a little LCD display in the dash that will tell us all sorts of cool information. Check Engine light? yeah ok, but with a few buttons the LCD screen tells us exactly wtf is going on. No tricky diagnostic stuff, and no need to ask the dealer whats up. Code 39, O2 Sensor error. Display that on a gameboy type LCD screen, can that be so difficult/expensive? Give this screen an Indiglo style backlight, but nothing super bright. Full adjustability, the screen can readout anything from MPG to MPH, to RPM, to a simple 7:28 P.M.

[TachyonS14]

I hope Nissan doesn't bring another silvia/240sx here because I like when kids pull up next to me and a stop light and woo and ahh at my car, or plain just don't know what kind of car it is!