Hey all.

Newbie to the Nico club forum and there is alot of very good info on here. I'm currently Driving a R32 GTR and a Ford Falcon ute with a 351 Cleveland in it.I am considering retiring the old clevo as they are near on impossible to get go fast bit for down here in Oz and far out does it use some fuel for a every day car. So I was considering putting a VH 40 or 45 in it and going to twin turbo it. Not looking for massive Horse power as long as it make more than the old Clevo I would be happy. Its putting a bit over 350 rwkw at the moment. So If I could get one to make around the 400 mark and still be reliable I would be real happy.So I was just wondering what the best way to go is in the sense what are the best year model to get. What is stronger VH 40 or 45 . What if any are the problems these engine have. how much boost can they handle. I have heard the later models went away from VVT. If this is true WHY? I have also heard the 45 has nearly a bullet proof bottom end but have some timing chain probs. Is this true. And what is a good price for a engine trans and wiring harness package. Keeping in mind you have to get them imported from Japan in Oz.

Any help would be great.

Cheers

Craig.

Sorry guys Put this in the wrong forum. Meant to go in the VH45DE forum.

Should be able to get 400 rwhp out of a vh45de, yes - boost of 4-6 lbs.

The 1991 engines are favorites. Only the 1996 eliminated VVT, just before the 1997 model change.

6 bolt mains on the bottom of the VH45.

The 89-93 models had plastic-backed chain guides - bad oil eats them up, eventually. No big deal to replace them along with other rehab when the motor is out of the car.

Many sources for JDM VH45s. The trick is to personally inspect them until you find one you like. Check ebay and JDM importers for pricing - not terribly expensive.

Welcome to NICO!

moved to the VH forum.

Cheers Mate.

There's the VH41DE and the VH45DE, they are 4.1L and 4.5L respectively. There are various versions of each motor.

Here are Nico, we are most familiar with four main versions of these engines.

JDM VH41DEUSDM VH41DEPre '94 VH45DEPost '94 VH45DE

The JDM VH41DE and the post '94 VH45DE are the most desirable out of the four.

All four have the same strength internals and are largely built the same, with the exception of some crucial details, as follows:

* USDM VH41DE lacks main bearing beam, which was put in on the other motors to reduce NVH & add rigidity to the bottom end. USDM VH41DE also has smaller & differently angled oval intake ports, and doesn't have the nicely designed spider style manifold. I believe it also doesn't have sodium filled exhaust valves, which the other motors have (to be confirmed.)

Furthermore, it runs a timing chain setup with four chains, utilizing an idler on each side (rather than the 45's long chain setup), but only with single row/simplex chain. This motor is effectively the **** version, steer clear.

* Pre '94 VH45DE has chain guides made from plastic, that eventually get worn and break, dropping pieces into the sump. It also retains the main bearing beam, stiffening up the bottom end slightly.

The VH45DE runs a single simplex timing chain per bank, from the crank sprockets up and around the cam sprockets... this direct drive setup results in very large camshaft sprockets.

This version also has siamesed intake ports where the manifold bolts up, two circular ports per cylinder, rather than a single oval port which splits. While reducing overall flow capacity to a very small extent, this port style can serve promote air velocity at low engine speeds. When flowbenched, oval port & siamesed port heads show very little difference anyway.

* Post '94 VH45DE has chain guide issues fixed, with metal backed versions available from Nissan as standard. These guides can be put into the pre '94 version to remedy the issue. This motor also retains the main bearing beam. This version however, has the oval ports rather than the siamesed intake ports. This is the most desirable VH45DE.

* JDM VH41DE has no chain guide issues, has a main bearing beam, oval ports, spider intake manifold, and basically all the best bits from the other engines, combined.

Furthermore, it runs a timing chain setup like the USDM VH41DE, with a single chain on each side going up to an idler, and then a chain from the idler around the cam sprockets.... however, with the JDM engine, the chains around the cam sprockets are dual row/duplex chains, which are 190% as strong as simplex chains.

The other benefits to this setup are that the ratio is changed at the idler, making the camshaft sprockets a whole lot smaller in diameter, drastically reducing the width of the front cover of the engine. This is where the common misconception comes from that the VH45DE is bigger... it's not, the block and heads are almost identical (totally not interchangeable though), but the timing chain area on a VH45DE is just way wider and takes up more room, as well as being weaker & more prone to stretch over time. Let it be known though, that this is hardly an issue, because having timing chains at all is overkill, let alone duplex ones. The VH45DE isn't exactly going to have issues with its chain setup, but it's still important to note the differences.

The alternator on a VH41DE is mounted at the top/front of the engine, rather than off to the side, and this helps because on the VH45DE it can cause chassis rail interference issues.

Also, JDM spec engines typically have the starter motor on the same side as cylinder 1/3/5/7 (this is the driver's side on the US, it's passenger side for Japan and NZ etc). This is an important fact, because when fitting a VH into some vehicles, the starter motor part of the bellhousing, or the starter body itself, can interfere with your steering column if it's on the same side. I noticed this when a guy from NZ tried putting a VH45DE into an S15.

There is one more difference that stands out to me. The way VTC works between the '41 and '45. The VH45DE has a solenoid valve on the end of the VTC drum that bypasses the oil pressure when required. On the VH41DE, there is a solenoid that screws into the side of the head and blocks/releases the oil feed through the actual gallery in the head. This further reduces the size of the VTC mechanism on the VH41DE.

The heathens will tell you that the VH45DE is better due to the extra 400cc... My reason would be due to the better bore/stroke ratio making the VH45DE achieve a faster intake charge velocity and increased cylinder pressure at intake valve closure as a result.

In my opinion, the JDM VH41DE is in fact the best base motor, and anyone who disagrees is just jealous their market isn't flooded with the superior JDM VH41DE in their country

I hope this helps.

Welcome!

And just ignore Mettler. He's just mad that his thing is smaller than ours.

Heathens....lmao!!

I believe the sodium filled valves in the VH45 were dropped after 93. The post-93 motors also have double-row chain.

Aren't the valves and siamesed ports preferable? Build quality on the earliest engines (89-91) was better, too, according to anecdotal experience.

96Qowner wrote:The post-93 motors also have double-row chain.

Really? Are you sure? Pics please, not cos I don't believe you, just cos I haven't seen it and would like confirmation before I overwrite a section of my brain with unconfirmed information. I've only ever seen simplex chain on VH45DEs.

I was leaning toward the 45 just cause it has more cube's. Sorry always been some one who thinks cubes do count. So the post 94 VH45 is the way to go. What kind of boost can these handle. I believe they are around the 10:1 compression ratio. And what Kind of power figures would expect to see. It will getting bigger injector and a after market computer. Do apexi do a power FC for them. ??

gtrob wrote:I was leaning toward the 45 just cause it has more cube's. Sorry always been some one who thinks cubes do count. So the post 94 VH45 is the way to go. What kind of boost can these handle. I believe they are around the 10:1 compression ratio. And what Kind of power figures would expect to see. It will getting bigger injector and a after market computer. Do apexi do a power FC for them. ??

If you plan to build a motor, you could always do what I'm doing and put the 45 crank and pistons into the 41 base motor, to get the best of both worlds. They have the same deck height and bore, the internals swap straight over. ^_^

VH45DE is 10.2:1 comp ratio.

The standard injectors are fine for the standard cams and breathing. Once Mettler cams are available, you may need to upgrade to some S15 440cc side feed injectors to handle the new power, as well as tune the ECU some. I wouldn't bother with an aftermarket computer, as you can retune the stock computer.

Mettler wrote:If you plan to build a motor, you could always do what I'm doing and put the 45 crank and pistons into the 41 base motor, to get the best of both worlds. They have the same deck height and bore, the internals swap straight over. ^_^

VH45DE is 10.2:1 comp ratio.

The standard injectors are fine for the standard cams and breathing. Once Mettler cams are available, you may need to upgrade to some S15 440cc side feed injectors to handle the new power, as well as tune the ECU some. I wouldn't bother with an aftermarket computer, as you can retune the stock computer.

I can get a THG50 President in Brisbane for $2000 Aust with 120,000km (Front cut) is that about the going price for one or not. Hes not sure what yr model it is though. Is there any way you can tell the yr from the engine or vin number.

Mettler wrote:Really? Are you sure? Pics please, not cos I don't believe you, just cos I haven't seen it and would like confirmation before I overwrite a section of my brain with unconfirmed information. I've only ever seen simplex chain on VH45DEs.

Do NOT overwrite. It appears I am wrong. My apologies. Just had this (faulty, apparently) image in my mind.

The VIN will tell you the year:

L = 1990 M = 1991 N = 1992 P = 1993 R = 1994 S = 1995 T = 1996 V = 1997 W = 1998 X = 1999 Y = 2000 1 = 2001 2 = 2002 3 = 2003 4 = 2004 5 = 2005 and so on.

So that letter will be at the start or the end of the vin number. Also what are the dimensions of these things. Height, width, length. and also weight. I have found some dimension on the net but its saying they are nearly a meter long. Which I find hard to believe.

Here's a picture from Nissan's engine display 'museum' thing in Japan that has all their awesome motors on stands for visitors to check out (including the VRH35Z).

Tell me, out of all the VH engines, why would they proudly display the JDM VH41DE with clear covers etc, rather than the VH45DE hmmmmmmm ?

Mettler wrote:Here's a picture from Nissan's engine display 'museum' thing in Japan that has all their awesome motors on stands for visitors to check out (including the VRH35Z).

Tell me, out of all the VH engines, why would they proudly display the JDM VH41DE with clear covers etc, rather than the VH45DE hmmmmmmm ?

Because their USDM VH45DE is still running in their daily driver car.

In all seriousness, everyone knows they developed the VH45DE first and contemporary with their VRH35 series race motors so don't knock it 'til you've tried it.

SSDwellah wrote:In all seriousness, everyone knows they developed the VH45DE first and contemporary with their VRH35 series race motors so don't knock it 'til you've tried it.

Haha yeah, so one could argue this version is an update to the design, with improvements. Meh :p JDM VH41DE for life, fools!

The VH45 is definitely wider than a Clevo. This might give you an idea on size zerothread/266156 Look what I had to do to get one to fit in my Mercedes. Bastard of a job. What model Falcon is it?

RichZilla wrote:The VH45 is definitely wider than a Clevo. This might give you an idea on size zerothread/266156 Look what I had to do to get one to fit in my Mercedes. Bastard of a job. What model Falcon is it?

Geez that is a tight fit under the bonnet of a merc. Its going into a XE ute and then to make matters worse I want to twin turbo it as well. Got a old wrecked XE that I am going to do a dummy fit into first . IF I go ahead with it. Would love some dimension for one of these.

gtrob wrote:So that letter will be at the start or the end of the vin number. Also what are the dimensions of these things. Height, width, length. and also weight. I have found some dimension on the net but its saying they are nearly a meter long. Which I find hard to believe.

Geez sorry I just realized we are getting off topic and nobody is answering your question. I was going to say the 9th digit but I am glad that I looked them up. It's actually the 10th digit. See here for details http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vin_number

I'll get a couple of measurements on Monday if I remember. Now the Lexus V8 (1UZ) is pretty much 600x600x600 give or take 100mm here or there. I've done heaps with 1UZ's and can easily say that they are way smaller than the VH45. You may have a drama with your steering box depending on where it sits on the rail. The Merc one is massive and there's no room for proper exhaust manifolds in there let alone two turbo's.

Cheers Mate.

RichZilla wrote:I'll get a couple of measurements on Monday if I remember. Now the Lexus V8 (1UZ) is pretty much 600x600x600 give or take 100mm here or there. I've done heaps with 1UZ's and can easily say that they are way smaller than the VH45.

Well I measured across the heads of a 1UZ (edge to edge) and they're 640mm wide, the VH41DE (and the 45 too, if you discount the really wide front covers) is only 680mm. That's only a 40mm difference in width.

What about length and height ??? Also Am I right in saying that If I get a engine out of a President they don't VVT where as the Q45 do ????

As far as I know all VH engines have VTC, it just works differently between the 41 & 45.

Dunno the length and height sorry, but it's no longer than about 700mm. Height is higher due to a deep sump & intake manifold being pretty high.

All the ones I've seen here have been out of Q45's - well seem to be. They all had infinity badges on top of the inlet manifold.

Oh, and sorry, forgot to get measurements. Had a massive amount of work on today.

Here's an important measurement of the VH45. Width from alternator to oil filter (since they sit in between the chassis rails on my car) Approx 735mm

Length not including clutch fan approx 600mmBest spot for crossmember (sump clearance) is about 400mm from front of engine - front of engine being crank pulley for these measurements.

Also take in to consideration that the auto is fairly large on these.

Why not hop up the 351C? You want the increased displacement of the 4.5L over 4.1L, but don't like the fuel economy of the cleveland? How about some good upgrades along with EFI for the cleveland? It's such a great engine and it's already set up to fit in your car.

The clevo is making real good power already. I just want to try some thing new. I Dont know any one with a flacon ute with a VH45 in it so I thought I would give it a go. Don't worry the clevo won't be forgotten. Have plans for it already.

Once again not knowing alot about these things. What car would I find a JDM VH41DE in. Also can you tell the year from the engine number.
Modified by gtrob at 9:50 PM 10/22/2007