new cars that Americans don't want to buy

[Bubba1]

According to Xfinity's 24/7 Wall Street column, although the car industry in general is kinda holding its own so far this year, there are some models that are not selling, based on the # days they sit at dealers before being sold. the article only considered vehicles with 2011 unit sales over 10,000. An interesting list given the high cost of gas. Only a few of them consume lotsa gas. Just one Nissan.
Here they are in reverse order with the avg number of days they sit before selling.

10. Dodge Ram Pickup 1500. 91 days
9. Cadillac DTS 93 days (I guess the old farts that buy these are dying off)
8. Suzuki SX4 93 days
7. Honda Element 96 Days
6. Toyota Matrix 97 days (was popular, but declining sales last 3 years)
5. Toyota Yaris 97 days
4. Mazda 6 100 days (Zoom Zoom performance but putt=putt sales I suppose)
3. Kia Rio 101 days (article cited crowded market with better choices)
2. Nissan Titan 106 days (article said high gas prices+poor mpg)
1. VW Routon 107 days (essentially a rebadged Chrysler mini van)

Thoughts?

[jmann]

Seems like a pointless list. If they sold more than 10,000 of them last year, then clearly some people want to buy them. How about let's call it, cars that dealers overstocked. I'm not sure how long they sit on the lot, but infiniti only sold 6000 or so EX35's last year, so clearly fewer Americans want to buy those.

[alms24sebring]

Im surprised at Mazda 6 being so high and sort of the Titan. I guess its the cost of petrol that is holding it back since it gets like 9mpg. I guess Im also surprised at the VW Crouton being #1, it looks very soccer mommish but I guess alot of mommys and whipped daddys are buying more used Caravans than new.

[nissangirl74]

I think a more important observation is who is not on the list. Hyundai and Ford, both of whom are offering incredible deals on extremely fuel efficient cars. Fords sales go back and forth but never underestimate the appeal of consumers wanting to support a company who fixed their financial problems themselves. As for Hyundai, I said it two years ago: the Koreans are coming....

[alms24sebring]

According to Top Gear, the Chinese are coming

[Jesda]

Mazda 6 has a sharp body but the interior isn't competitive with the Sonata, Optima, or Malibu.

Anticipation of the new XTS has put a dent in DTS sales, so the last batch of them are lingering.

[MinisterofDOOM]

Anticipation of the new XTS has put a dent in DTS sales, so the last batch of them are lingering.

This sentence made a little part of me die. "Anticipation of the new XTS..." People really are terrible. I hope everyone who buys an XTS ends up suffering "unintended acceleration" off a cliff.

[Jesda]

Me too.

[Mr1der]

the new 6 looks like d!ck.

That's my take. I like the Element SC but it's dated.

the rest of the stuff on that list can go f*** it's self.

[bigbadberry3]

Nothing on there I would consider.

[MinisterofDOOM]

I like the Titan and Ram just fine. Certainly more than the gaudy new chromified F150 or the "LOOK AT MY MUSCLES I AM A REAL TRUCK RAWR" trying to hard Tundra. And I'd at least test drive an SX4 if I were for some apocalyptic reason in the market for a brand new econobox. Which will never ever happen.

[Rev_D21]

Hyundai can't keep Accents or Elantras on the shelf. Most are sold right off the back of the delivery truck. Hottest cars out there today! It's nice riding that wave.

[themadscientist]

The speed with which Kias and Hyundais sell just confirms the sad state of style. Enjoy them, 'I'm not buying that crap. I'd take a Cadillac CTS or a 370Z, that's about it off the top of my head.

[frapjap]

I did not know the Element and Matrix were still being produced.

[MinisterofDOOM]

I did not know the Element and Matrix were still being produced.

The Matrix is in its second generation...as was the Vibe before the G6 GXP singlehandedly killed pontiac in 2010. The 2nd gen Vibe has a seriously bizarre hatch glass design. It's completely square and flat and entirely at odds with the shape of the metal around it.

[frapjap]

The 2nd gen Vibe has a seriously bizarre hatch glass design. It's completely square and flat and entirely at odds with the shape of the metal around it.

The kind where the slightest tap will make it shatter?

[MinisterofDOOM]

Heh.

Seriously. WTF?!



It's as though Pontiac engineers went out of their way to impair rear and corner visibility to as great a degree as possible. It looks like they used parts bin glass from an unrelated, very differently-shaped and -sized model and hoped no one would notice. Not only is it narrow, but it's HIGH...the low edge is at headrest level. No wonder every car needs backup cameras these days.

[frapjap]

Christ, thats an awful vehicle. It looks like a wagon-y prius. Why does it have two antennas?

[Bubba1]

Christ, thats an awful vehicle. It looks like a wagon-y prius. Why does it have two antennas?

The really short one is for the GPS.

[300ZXttZMAN]

I think a more important observation is who is not on the list. Hyundai and Ford, both of whom are offering incredible deals on extremely fuel efficient cars. Fords sales go back and forth but never underestimate the appeal of consumers wanting to support a company who fixed their financial problems themselves. As for Hyundai, I said it two years ago: the Koreans are coming....

Huyndai and Kia and I don't like it.

Its funny that alot of people think these Korean cars are soooo good. People that praise Kia and Hyundai may or may not realize that 10 years ago these cars were just crap absolute crap things started happening to them that shouldn't happen to cars for atleast 10 years. Things like the stupid sun visors falling not staying up.

People claim that they have changed their ways ect. I say just wait 5 years to make that judgement then in 5 years let us know what you think about the car..

[MinisterofDOOM]

Its funny that alot of people think these Korean cars are soooo good. People that praise Kia and Hyundai may or may not realize that 10 years ago these cars were just crap absolute crap things started happening to them that shouldn't happen to cars for atleast 10 years. Things like the stupid sun visors falling not staying up.

People claim that they have changed their ways ect. I say just wait 5 years to make that judgement then in 5 years let us know what you think about the car..

This is EXACTLY what everyone said about the Japanese in the 1990s. "Ten years ago they made crap." Ten years is a long time.

As for waiting 5 years to pass judgement...it's BEEN 5 years. There's a notable turning point beginning right around 2005 when Hyundai and Kia found themselves. It's been 7 years since then. They have proven their capability. This is not misguided hope. They ARE GOOD CARS. FACT. Build quality, fit-and-finish, materials, engineering...this isn't stuff that magically appears 5 years down the road. You feel it when you get in the car. You see it and hear it and feel it when you drive the car. From the first second to the last. You don't buy a car and find out 5 years later it was a pile of s*** the whole time. People didn't buy 1986 Hyundai Excels and think for 5 years that they'd gotten away with it. They knew they were s*** and they didn't care. It is not 1986 anymore.

Go drive a 2012 Camry, or a 2012 Civic, and then drive an Optima or a Forte. The Camry and Civic are cheap and bland and built precisely well enough to maintain existing reputations while moving as much volume as possible. Panel gaps are crudely disguised and ugly. Interior materials are crummy. The dash layouts in both suck, and they both feel like sitting inside a Hewlett Packard printer from 2003.

Fact is all the Japanese brands are so focused on moving volume to maintain their top-profit spots, they've stopped worrying about building the best cars out there. Kia and Hyundai don't have this problem. Neither do the cool-to-hate-them American brands. It's pretty clear that selling more Camrys is great for profit and bad for quality. Same with the Civic...even diehard Civic folk hate the 2012 model, which has gotten spectacularly cheap and demonstrates the poorest fit-and-finish I've seen in a Honda in all of history. But the Forte? Tight panels, great interior, fun chassis, sexy looks, and reliability that's far better than the "sell-sell-sell" Japanese can manage in the 21st century.
Then you've got crap like Nissan being determined to sell CVTs to everyone whether they like it or not, Toyota trying to stick 500lb of batteries in every car in sight, and Honda trying to put tiny four cylinders with no torque in progressively vaster cars. Not from the Koreans. The only line they're trying to push is the cars themselves.

That's what it comes down to:
Hyundai and Kia are in that sweet spot where they're successful but they're still selling CARS. They're not selling a brand or an image or a repuatation or some misguided version of the future. Just cars.
It's where Nissan was in 1994. It's where Honda was in 1998. It's where Toyota was in 1996. It's where General Motors was in 1969. It won't last, because eventually they'll get "successful" and they'll start to change their definition of success, and then they'll stop caring about the cars and start caring about spreadsheets. But right now they're building cars, and doing it well.

The 2005 Hyundai Sonata is better than the 2005 Accord by a million miles. Better than the 2005 Camry by twelve million miles. Not quite as good as the 2005 Altima, because that's right before Nissan LOST THEIR EFFING MINDS. And the 2012 Optima? Even with its refusal to fit 6 cylinders under the hood, it's ten times as nice and ten times as fun as any of these 3 Japanese cars.

[NolimitZ32]

MOD, I couldn't have said it better myself. Better buy up the Optima GDIs and Genesis Coupes while they are shining bright.

[hannibal]

Right on MoD!

[numbnuts240]

i won't disagree that korean cars are now being very well made, but, personally, i'm still not sold on the looks department. then again, there are very few new cars that catch my eye appearance-wise.

[Mr1der]

I'm not a fan of the Hyundai designs that first showed up in the Sonata.

The Kia Optima and Forte however, them's good looking cars. The Veloster...I dunno....it's wacky. But I'd take one with the turbo 4 when it comes out.

I <3 the Genesis sedan. That's just a nice car that's built to compete with makes wanting 10k or more for a similar ride.

[MinisterofDOOM]

I'm not a fan of the Hyundai designs that first showed up in the Sonata.

The Kia Optima and Forte however, them's good looking cars. The Veloster...I dunno....it's wacky. But I'd take one with the turbo 4 when it comes out.

I <3 the Genesis sedan. That's just a nice car that's built to compete with makes wanting 10k or more for a similar ride.

My thoughts exactly. Hyundai's new styling is not good. There's too much going on with it without achieving anything. Kia's, though... I honestly think Kia is building some of the best-looking new cars on earth right now. I've said many times that Kia's doing right what Acura's been doing wrong for the past few years. Kias look very much like Acura meets Audi. Which makes a lot of sense, considering former Audi designer Peter Schreyer was hired by Kia in 2006. Kias tend to hve nice proportions, clean shapes, and sharp details.

The Kia K9 looks fantastic. The Optima might be the best looking midsize sedan on earth. The Forte is at war with hotter Focuses for best-looking compact (lesser focuses with their Darth Vader masks are not in this fight, but the ST and other Aston-mouthed models are).

[Jesda]

I agree with MoD, as usual.

[NolimitZ32]

I agree with MoD, as usual.

I second this motion and move for immediate dismissal

[RicerX]

This is EXACTLY what everyone said about the Japanese in the 1990s. "Ten years ago they made crap." Ten years is a long time.

As for waiting 5 years to pass judgement...it's BEEN 5 years. There's a notable turning point beginning right around 2005 when Hyundai and Kia found themselves. It's been 7 years since then. They have proven their capability. This is not misguided hope. They ARE GOOD CARS. FACT. Build quality, fit-and-finish, materials, engineering...this isn't stuff that magically appears 5 years down the road. You feel it when you get in the car. You see it and hear it and feel it when you drive the car. From the first second to the last. You don't buy a car and find out 5 years later it was a pile of s*** the whole time. People didn't buy 1986 Hyundai Excels and think for 5 years that they'd gotten away with it. They knew they were s*** and they didn't care. It is not 1986 anymore.

Go drive a 2012 Camry, or a 2012 Civic, and then drive an Optima or a Forte. The Camry and Civic are cheap and bland and built precisely well enough to maintain existing reputations while moving as much volume as possible. Panel gaps are crudely disguised and ugly. Interior materials are crummy. The dash layouts in both suck, and they both feel like sitting inside a Hewlett Packard printer from 2003.

Fact is all the Japanese brands are so focused on moving volume to maintain their top-profit spots, they've stopped worrying about building the best cars out there. Kia and Hyundai don't have this problem. Neither do the cool-to-hate-them American brands. It's pretty clear that selling more Camrys is great for profit and bad for quality. Same with the Civic...even diehard Civic folk hate the 2012 model, which has gotten spectacularly cheap and demonstrates the poorest fit-and-finish I've seen in a Honda in all of history. But the Forte? Tight panels, great interior, fun chassis, sexy looks, and reliability that's far better than the "sell-sell-sell" Japanese can manage in the 21st century.
Then you've got crap like Nissan being determined to sell CVTs to everyone whether they like it or not, Toyota trying to stick 500lb of batteries in every car in sight, and Honda trying to put tiny four cylinders with no torque in progressively vaster cars. Not from the Koreans. The only line they're trying to push is the cars themselves.

That's what it comes down to:
Hyundai and Kia are in that sweet spot where they're successful but they're still selling CARS. They're not selling a brand or an image or a repuatation or some misguided version of the future. Just cars.
It's where Nissan was in 1994. It's where Honda was in 1998. It's where Toyota was in 1996. It's where General Motors was in 1969. It won't last, because eventually they'll get "successful" and they'll start to change their definition of success, and then they'll stop caring about the cars and start caring about spreadsheets. But right now they're building cars, and doing it well.

The 2005 Hyundai Sonata is better than the 2005 Accord by a million miles. Better than the 2005 Camry by twelve million miles. Not quite as good as the 2005 Altima, because that's right before Nissan LOST THEIR EFFING MINDS. And the 2012 Optima? Even with its refusal to fit 6 cylinders under the hood, it's ten times as nice and ten times as fun as any of these 3 Japanese cars.

Spot effing on. And the HP Printer circa 2003 analogy was an absolute gem. The MoD has spoken, ladies and gents.