Need help with 240sx

[SixRunner]

I was looking to buy a 1997 240sx. I went and checked it out yesterday. exterior looked really clean. Interior was nice, no rips on seats, didnt see cracks in dash, but its missing the radio trim which isnt a big deal.

Now for some bad things...
the drivers door doesnt open (shouldnt be to hard to fix)
ebrake doesnt work (i can fix that)
180k miles on chassis, 80k on rebuilt KA
it has the s13 motor so i guess the wires dont match up with the gauges or whatever.
feels like it rides a little rough, could be springs or something.

im not to worried about the engine because i will probably do a swap.

The guys is asking 4k firm, is that to much for a 240? keep in mind that where i live there are only 4 240's, 3 of which have over 140k miles. and those are around the same price as this one. so with the whole "supply and demand" thing, i figured this was a good deal.

Also, he lives 1 hour away from me, so i cant get any friends or my mechanic to go with me to check it out again. Could i just go to a shop near him and pay a guy like 30-50 dollars to come with me to check it out?

[numbnuts240]

if the engine runs well and you don't have to deal with emissions, for those few issues, 4k is a good price.

[SixRunner]

thanks for the quick reply. the engine does run well.
I talked to my uncle and he said he wouldnt trust a rebuilt motor. but he doesnt understand is that im going to do a swap in a year or two. He also thinks this car is as common as a ford focus and whatnot, lol. my mom wont give me my money unless my uncle ok's it, so i need to convince him somehow

[sx moneypit]

Where are you located,have you checked it for rust?

Welcome to NICO!


-Ben

[sx moneypit]

thanks for the quick reply. the engine does run well.
I talked to my uncle and he said he wouldnt trust a rebuilt motor. but he doesnt understand is that im going to do a swap in a year or two. He also thinks this car is as common as a ford focus and whatnot, lol. my mom wont give me my money unless my uncle ok's it, so i need to convince him somehow

The KA engine is bullet proof .

[SixRunner]

i did not check the under carriage for rust. i will definately do that before i give him my money though. I live in michigan so there is a possibility, but he did mention that he was trying to make it "cherry" so i assume he took good care of it. i know its never safe to assume while buying a car but at least it gives me an idea.

[PapaSmurf2k3]

Wait, someone isn't letting you have YOUR money?

[SixRunner]

@PapaSmurf2k3

ha yeah. plus im 18! but my mom said i can get my money back to get a car when i get a job, so i got a job and now they are making BS excuses. my mom said "i dont really want to deal with this right now". and my dad says "dont buy the first one you drive, and look for awhile". well ive been looking on craigslist for a few months now. in michigan, as well as the surrounding states. have not seen any that werent abused or had low miles. as for the "dont buy the first one you drive", well i guess i could go test drive the ones with 150k+ miles on them before i drive this one, but that wouldnt really make a difference, since im getting this one anyways.

My mom wants my uncle to check out a car with me so i dont get screwed again. but nobody seems to understand that im either getting a 240sx or im just not gonna drive. they want me to get a newer car, which i cant afford and a ford focus and a jeep dont really compare to a 240.

somehow i need to get my uncle to check out this car with me, or i need to hire another mechanic to check out the car with me.

/end rant

[numbnuts240]

after reading that, i kind of have to side with your parents. 18 year olds with limited funds and project cars are a dime a dozen, and very few of them get around to making their car resemble what they envisioned. idk what kind of job you have now, but chances are, in this economy, and at 18, it isn't paying all that well. bs repairs will always pop up and drain you of cash. performance parts aren't cheap, never mind the total amount you would spend on a swap (sure swaps are relatively easy with a 140, but you will get nickel and dimed to death). your folks are just looking out for what's best for you at this time in your life. maybe a year or two with a focus (reliable, and easy/cheap to repair) will allow you to save up a decent car fund so that you can work on your project vehicle at your leisure and not have to depend on it running at all times to get where you need to go.

you will always be able to find another 240. find a good dd for now and when you're ready to actually tackle a project, it won't matter how many miles, or how good the engine is. you can start from scratch, so long as the body is clean and straight. i've never been there, but i imagine that nothing sucks more than having to sell your work in progress because you got in over your head and couldn't afford it anymore. parents suck sometimes, but they're more caring and wiser than you think.

[OriginalWheelman]

240s are cheap if you buy a half finished project. Hell I literally just got home from giving away an S13 shell. Just be patient, and learn to drive on something else. Otherwise you will destroy the thing you spent all your money on. Swapped 240s are best left to 2nd car status. There is no such thing as a simple swap or a dependable car with 180k on it. Even if it's perfect now, you will get in it and with your lack of experience, break everything that is weak on the car. I know a guy with a '34 Dodge Fluiddrive. It has had the same rod knock for 18 years. If am inexperienced driver hopped in it, no matter how nice they thought they were being, they would blow that engine. The money you envision yourself saving will be spent on repairs, until you end up selling it for less than you have into it, to someone like me and I'm not going to care what parts you replaced. Just because a car is in good order now, doesn't mean it will stay that way. What happens if the rear main seal lets go at 200k and you're out of money?

I know it's hard, but trust your parents. They have the right idea.

[SixRunner]

i wont be doing anything major to it for a few years. i currently have 4000 to spend on a car. and im making about $200-250 a week.
and i really dont think i will find anymore decent 240's in my area, only 2 came up in a matter of 2-3 months. my mom said to get one from down south so that it wont have rust, but when i found a nice one, she said your getting getting a car from out of state. they arent making ny sense at this point.

i know i should listen to my parents, but im 18 and i can make my own decisions, and if that decision turns out to be a bad one then i can handle the consequences. and ill have money for repairs and stuff

[SixRunner]

also, what can go wrong on a chassis that has 180k miles on it? just the seals and stuff? maybe the struts that give out or something? idk

[OriginalWheelman]

also, what can go wrong on a chassis that has 180k miles on it?

The short answer is, everything.

[numbnuts240]

^ beat me to it.

[Dattebayo]

250 a week is not enough to sponsor a half-finished car project that won't pass inspection because the gauges aren't hooked up, not to mention all the other stuff that it will need to pass that you don't know about.
You are also forgetting the cost of tax, tags and title that you have to pay for at the DMV, not to mention insurance.

If you're really set on it, you will probably need to save up another 1000 before it's gonna be feasible.

[Bubba1]

^ beat me to it.

Me too. You appear to be looking at this car with your heart instead of your head.
All details you've described are big warning signs that the car lived a rough life and the previous owner(s) deferred maintenance on it. 240sx's are known to be durable with engines that'll last 250K+ miles but not when they're beat on or not maintained well. That car you're looking sounds like a money pit waiting to happen.

Yes, there are some areas of the country where 240s are a tad scarce. That just means you need to expand your search to include areas where they are more plentiful. I live in eastern PA, where they are more plentiful, and the guy who purchased my old 240SX came all the way from Indianapolis to buy it.

Be patient and I'm sure you'll find a nice one.

[SixRunner]

Im getting the car inspected sometime this next week.
Insurance will be around $350/ 6 months

i cant get a car from out of state because i currently cant leave the state.

there was 1 other 240sx in my area that i was looking at. it had 144k miles, big dent on quarter panel, clear coat is peeling off. its also a '95 and automatic trans. im in love with the kouki front end. so by time i fix the dents, and paint it. ill have a few grand into it. plus if i ever want to front end swap and manual swap it, theres some more money being poured into it.
The '97 that im looking at, isnt really a project car. looks good, runs alright, might need a little maintenance right now but i wont know until i get it inspected.

i dont feel like a 240 will just pop up on craigslist just because i want one, im not that lucky. been looking for a few months and only seen one decent one (the one im looking at right now)

[SixRunner]

kouki - $4000
http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/17 ... c6n66.jpg/

zenki - $2500, could probably get for 2000-2200
http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/81 ... c6ic5.jpg/

again, the zenki has 144k miles on it, and will cost a few grand to make it look somewhat decent. mechanically it is fine, or so i think.

those are basically my only 2 options

just comes down to this one question. If I save a couple grand, do i want to spend it on appearance or mechanics.

also, if i get the kouki, i will do most of the work myself, because i want to own my own custom auto business or whatever, so i want some experience.

[SixRunner]

fixed

[Razi]

That's cause you tried to use a link to a webpage, not an image.
Use Photobucket, it's easier.

[SixRunner]

im either going to get a scion tc, or a chevy sonic. thats 15-20k for a new car, which would be nice as well. but why not get the car that i want, then i could spend the 10-15k that i saved to fix it up and whatnot.

[nissangirl74]

You don't ever want your DD and your project car to be the same vehicle. Ever. I know you have your heart set on this car but I don't really think you are seeing the big picture. You said there are only 2 or 3 more 240s in your area for sale. I'm guessing there's a reason for that you aren't considering: in your climate, they don't last. Odds are, the three of them that are there all have cancer to a certain degree. Here's my advice to you.

1) Buy a dependable car for your daily, you do NOT have to buy a brand new one.

2) Start socking away cash. When you have enough play money set aside, THEN you start looking.

3) Look in places like Southern California and Arizona because this is where the jewels still exist.

4) Stick around here, pay attention, and make friends. Ask nicely and those of us that live out here might actually go check one out for you if you find one that looks promising.

5) Do your research to find out how much it would cost to ship it to Michigan.

6) Do your research here on the site. Look at the build threads. Read them thoroughly. We're pretty blunt and honest when it comes to revealing the costs of our builds. Projects are never cheap. If you think it will cost $5K, budget $10K.

7) When doing a swap on a 240, whether it is a Z or an SX, whatever can do wrong WILL go wrong and HAS and it is all documented here.

I hope you will heed our advice, stick around, and learn a few things. We'll be glad to help, as long as you're willing to listen.

Good luck!

[SixRunner]

i see what your saying, but i dont see this as being a project car. only thing thats really wrong with it is the miles on the chassis.

its to the point where im either driving a s14 or im just not gonna drive. i would get another fiero, but theres no room for my sound system.

i figured that 240's were pretty rare, so thats why i couldnt find many. ill look in california and arizona like you said. but even if i found a nicer one, i dont see how i would be able to buy it.

i plan on being on this site for a long time, mind as well learn more about 240's since the info is right in front of me

[OriginalWheelman]

Let me start off by saying I've owned 5 240s, and if I had to pick between the cars you post based solely on what you have told me and the pics, I would go with the 95, and here is why.

The 97 has cheap aftermarket wheels and a NISMO sticker. Those to me yell ABUSE. It's got 180k on it, the last owner had to have worked it hard, and I bet they are trying to get out of it before something bad happens.

The 95 has a dent, but it's not bad. It's also an auto, while I'm sure you don't want an auto, the fact of the matter is the motors bolted to them last longer. From the ride height, it is also still on stock suspension. This also indicates that the car has had an easier life, and is less likely to break. Add that to less miles, and almost 2k less to buy, and IMO the 95 is a far better option.

In my opinion, you aren't looking at this objectively. You say you have all kinds of plans for a swap etc in the first post, then say it's not going to be a project car... well which is it? If you think you're going to pull it into the garage one day, swap an SR20 in and go down the road the next, lol good luck. More experienced men than you have tried.

i cant get a car from out of state because i currently cant leave the state

This statement alone makes me think your mom is right in holding onto your money. Apparently you got into some kind of trouble?. The fact that you're willing to spend 2k more on a car with 40k more miles because it's manual and has the front end you like. And the 240 or die! mentality... you don't seem mature enough to make this decision objectively, IMO

[orangeNblue]

As another person who's been through several 240's (and several others as well) I understand your thought process. My parents weren't as thoughtful as yours and with my first car and my own money, I made a decision on one that I "knew" was in "great" shape, "reliable", and it was exactly what I wanted. I ended up losing $3k in the car and sold it for less than I paid for it (with all of my investments included) just to get rid of the hassel.

to kinda toss some suggestions out there, you are right about the 97 vs the 95...if you can find a good one then then it would be better, bc it'll cost quite a bit to do the kouki front end right then it would be just to get the 97 outright...but that is the only thing you're saying that I agree with. You really need to look at this first from a daily driver aspect, then a fun aspect. The best piece of advise I can give you, and please write this down...do not buy someone else's project as your daily driver!!!! this never, ever, ever works out, no matter how bad you want it to. personally I would avoid the 97 because of the bad you named:

the drivers door doesnt open (shouldnt be to hard to fix)
you shouldn't have to fix this...there are several good cars out there with doors that open!!!
ebrake doesnt work (i can fix that)
could be a hard fix, especially if it broke or if there's a brake swap
180k miles on chassis, 80k on rebuilt KA
the KA is built proof, unless it hasn't been taken care of...the reason i think it may be bad, see two problems above (i mean honestly)
it has the s13 motor so i guess the wires dont match up with the gauges or whatever.
the s13 motor will swap straight in, so my guess is the owner didn't really care about his car, or just did it to sell it....
feels like it rides a little rough, could be springs or something
it could be anything really....DON"T BUY THIS CAR!!


seriously, this 97 isn't the car for you. If you're a patient person, sit and wait it out. If not the 95 probably wouldn't be a bad purchase. If your parents will help you get something newer then go for it. but the same stuff applies, be careful what you get and keep your eyes open for stock cars.

[SixRunner]

alright, i guess i have no choice but to listen to you guys haha. you guys have far more experience, and have owned one or more 240's.

honestly, i guess i wouldnt mind the 95. i got the dent quoted already and they said it would be about $700, only went to one place though so ill go to a few more. the whole paint thing isnt my ideal color but ill have to put up with it for awhile. i could also plastidip it or get a maaco paintjob until i save some money for paint.

so as you said, the 95 probably hasnt been driven hard, based on its stock look and stuff. so how many miles can a KA handle? cause i want to do a swap but not for a few years.

heres the craigslist ad, tell me what you think of it..

For sale 95 Nissan 240sx se
144,300 miles
Ka24de automatic
5 lug, vlsd, and clean underbody

Car has all power options- windows, locks, mirrors, antenna, sun roof pop up and slide. All work!
Heat and AC work as well
Clean interior no cracks in dash!
Sony head unit with stock speakers front and aftermarket rear. Jvc?

Mods
Injen intake, aftermarket header, z32 fuel filter, ngk spark plugs, dual tip muffler.
Drilled and slotted rotors with pads in front installed last July also have rears new in box.
New rack and pinion with energy suspension rack bushing and new OEM sway bar end links installed last July as well.
Also have new adjustable tension rods in box for the car.
Also has a new battery march 2012

The bad
A few scratches and chips as expected with a car its age. Some clear peal as well.
Car has a dent in the passenger fender and the driver side quarter pannel. There is rust on the passenger rocker pannel.
Tear in driver seat
No back seats but I do have an excellent fitting carpeted board with 4 speaker cutouts 6x9 I believe.

The car is very solid. Runs and drives good. The frame rails are clean! Only rust on the car is the passenger rocker pannel.
Asking $2500. Blue book value is $3150 in fair condition.

ill contact the owner again to see if i can check it out.

[OriginalWheelman]

If the quarters are rusting, I'd give it 3 years tops before winter kills it. You may be tempted to get a winter car and store it, but if the rust is already that far, I'd just save your money for a southern shell. With that said, I think that would be a solid start for you, and if you do decide to buy another 240 later on, you can use all the aftermarket parts you put on this one. I generally firgure $1,000 / year for a used car. If you get two out of it, which should be easy for a 140k auto, you'll be doing good. Buy the 95, learn to drive in it while the chassis rots out, then if it turns out to be mechanically sound, you can buy a southern shell in a couple years for a couple grand (figuring trip and tow costs) and swap your known good parts into it. I'd say buy the 95, let it teach you how to drive while it rots out, and use it for a donor for the next one.

Oh, and offer him $2,000. If he complains remind him it's an auto.

[SixRunner]

the rust could always be fixable, depends how far along it is. guess ill wait and see.
i texted him and he said there was a pending sale, i will find out if its still available tomorrow

[nissangirl74]

the rust could always be fixable

If you get a chance to go look at the car, look very carefully for rust: engine bay, trunk, floorboards, inside the fuel door. There's a reason we refer to it as 'cancer'.

[PapaSmurf2k3]

240s suffer mainly from strut tower and rocker panel rust, as well as under-spoiler rust on S13 hatchbacks.

I didn't read everyone's responses, but I would be pretty pissed if someone wouldn't let me have MY money. I don't even know how they are doing it.