NASA Cup / SCCA ITS Update! Everyone Read!

All over the world, Nissan products are involved in road racing, track days, time attack and autocross.
Nismo_Freak
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RedSVTFlareside wrote:I have no problem obeying rules, its part of the competitiveness of the sport. I don't want to have the fastest car and win every time. I want there to be some type of competition.
Limit HP, and the larger engines produce a much wider powerband.

Limit turbo size and the heavier cars can't keep up.

Limit power output period and you dull the series down with people scrounging and/or cheating for the little things

Honestly, there will be a number of people that are going to be on budget setups just the same as you and I. 98% of the Nissan owners out there aren't gonna be out there on $50,000 S-chassis cars that are 10 cents short of a damn GT Enduro car.

Perhaps in the "higher echelon" groups like PCA, and other higher end cars will you see a large number of mega money cars.

I personally think we should run the class purely on safety for the first round or two, and evaluate what needs to be done from there.

Again, the car isn't everything.


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RedSVTFlareside
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yes, but I was trying to accomodate these drifto cars that people say would be interested in a nissan challenge series as above mentioned. They would definately out class anyone who doesn't have backed team and such.

I was trying to explain that the high horse power cars can be in an unlimited class. Maybe only 2 classes are needed then.

The other class(budget class? haha) can be anything that wants some type of competition and doesn't mind following some rules to make things interesting. I think that stock SR internals and limiting peak boost(i'm not saying stock, just not 20psi) or limiting turbo to T25 for this class is plenty of HP to keep things interesting and competitive. It would be a race car and you would have to comply to the rules in order to run. be it saftey or limiting a part of your car's performance, rules must be made to make cars safe and competitive. If a driver wants to further increase his car's performance to exceed the limits of a class, then he would move into the unlimited class.

but yes, I agree. At first it will be small and have to build. maybe only a few 240's racing. race them together and bump them up a class. then if you win, you can say you've won an unlimited class race in a budge class 240.

Modified by RedSVTFlareside at 8:54 PM 8/30/2005
Modified by RedSVTFlareside at 9:00 PM 8/30/2005

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justmerging
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I think the easiest way to regulate the cars would be the hp/weight ratio. That pretty much levels the playing field for the most part. This will put the focus more on the tuning aspect of racing. By tuning I mean the power band, suspension setup, weight distribution etc. It would also emphasize the point of driver skill. Having to better your driving against another driver as opposed to who can dump the most $$$ to make the car faster. That's what alot of these classes are meant for in the first place. I think if they add a few more classes to the se-r cup with the only major restrictions being power/weight ratio and susp./tire modifications, it would make for a very competitive series.

Just look at the classes now. anything more than a 16:1 ratio(IIRC) bumps you into srx with all the high dollar race cars. Start with a bone stock car, run it on a dyno(after approving various dyno facilities), officially weigh it and consider which class it fits into. consider minor modifications to figure out various classes using power/weight and your off.

I may be new to the road racing thing but this theory seems logical to me.

Very simply put. Nissan Cup, 5 classes

NC1-Mostly Stock cars with upgrades to tires and brakes.NC2-bolt-ons/more powerful stock cars with tires/brakes/stock replacement susp.NC3-some motor swaps/mildly built n/a motors/fast stock cars, tires/brakes/coiloversNC4-No more stock cars, limited engine work, unlimited brakes/susp/dot R compound tiresNC5-All OUt unlimited everything.

All required safety equipment of course being considered.

Also, I don't know the power levels of everything. That's why I suggest the power/weight ratios to determine what class it will put you in first and foremost. It will level the playing field across the board power wise. How that power level is achieved shall be up to the tuner.

these are just ideas that popped into my head. feel free to add your 2 cents at will. I'm still learning also and constructive critizism is always appreciated.

Nismo_Freak
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Way too many classes.

I think we need to stick to Mike's plan to make this work.

It will be plenty competetive.

Joe
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Nismo_Freak wrote:Way too many classes.

I think we need to stick to Mike's plan to make this work.

It will be plenty competetive.
i agree and i really like your suggestion of just playing it out for a season or 2 and seeing how it goes.

Nismo_Freak
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Kamin wrote:i agree and i really like your suggestion of just playing it out for a season or 2 and seeing how it goes.
Yeah, it's better than just slapping arbitrary regulations down on everyone.

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justmerging
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It's gonna end up being a battle of the bankroll. As it stands right now a stock sr swap is gonna be put in the unlimited class. I don't see how that will end up being competitive.

I realize that what I suggested may not work right off the bat but you have to start somewhere. If you start with everything unlimited as it is now you will probably scare away alot of interest. I sure don't want to run my car against a built z and am sure many others don't want to either.

It costs so much to race we want to make it worthwhile to go out there. I sure don't want to drop the $$$ just to go get lapped.

This is why the power to weight ratio is so important. What you have under the hood shouldn't matter.

It all really depends what happens but I may end up not going with it for a few more years(when I can afford to run a full race car with stupid amounts of power). We shall see.

Nismo_Freak
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justmerging wrote:It's gonna end up being a battle of the bankroll. As it stands right now a stock sr swap is gonna be put in the unlimited class. I don't see how that will end up being competitive.

I realize that what I suggested may not work right off the bat but you have to start somewhere. If you start with everything unlimited as it is now you will probably scare away alot of interest. I sure don't want to run my car against a built z and am sure many others don't want to either.

It costs so much to race we want to make it worthwhile to go out there. I sure don't want to drop the $$$ just to go get lapped.

This is why the power to weight ratio is so important. What you have under the hood shouldn't matter.

It all really depends what happens but I may end up not going with it for a few more years(when I can afford to run a full race car with stupid amounts of power). We shall see.
You can't have that attitude bro, you will just get fustrated because there is ALWAYS someone out there that has spent twice the money.

You will lose years of experience, for the chance of running even with someone that has twice the lap time, and twice the budget. To me thats just a lose lose situation.

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justmerging
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Nismo_Freak wrote:
To me thats just a lose lose situation.
Exactly

Don't get me wrong though, I'm not afraid to lose. I'll still do HPDE's when I can. I just won't take it too seriously until I can finish my car.

You and I both know that competitive wheel to wheel racing experience will better prepare any driver than HPDE's or Time Trials. It's a whole other ballgame with everyone else on the track. Without it it just turns into a supersized autox.

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sr20goofus
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ok guys, i have just read through all 3 pages of this, and i believe i have gotten the idea of what all the discussions are about, the rules that want to be changed, regulations that shoudl be implimented and such along all those lines of discussed topics.

I have been doing HPDE's for about a year and a half now in my SR S13 and i have been working towards getting my competition license so i can run in SRX eventually.

From what i gather here is that there will be 3 classes to the SE-R Cup (NC1-NC3). But from what i have read form all the old rules (2005 SE-R Cup rules) is that SRX is almost unlimited in ever part of the cars setup and long as it meets all safety requirments and has wheels no wider than 10". I know peopel on here are talking abotu this being a budget race, deepest pockets wins type thing. It seems there would be way too many ways around running an almost stock SR on the track, lil things can be changed and tweaked, boost cant be regulated, weight can be enforced and dyno runs can be made before a race in an attempt to enfore power:weight ratios. But if you think about people runnign RB's have a power advantage over peopel with SR's, SR's have reliability over a turbo KA, but RB's have more weight on the front end of 240 over both SR and KA-T. You setup your car a certian way to handle alot of power and still stick to the track.

I know personally i plan to run 275 series tires, 360rwhp, 8pnt cage and a stitch welded chasis. I know what i need to get to that point, and no its not cheap, and i can deff be competative before i do all that. As long as all safety requirments are met, anyone should be allowed to race. Just because there will eb heavier cars and more powerful cars out there, doesnt mean thay willall last for 20+ min of strait track time.

The drift guys i talk to back home, all stay away from track racing becasue they know the cars wont last the amoutn of time a single HPDE session lasts. All thsoe guys are good drivers, and i have tried to egt a few of them to switch over, but they need to go through the whole competition licenes thing just like the rest of us, D1 has no regulations on a licenes.

I have been setting my car up slowly over the years to be reliabel on track and to be competative as it is now. I know i plan to change alot for hte bigger power stup, for more speed, and for more traction as time goes on. If you can affor dot setup a car and do events throughout the year you can afford to do mroe power options, or more traction opritons.

All racing is spending lots of money, everyone should realize that by now. Without sponors its all out of your pocket. The guys that spend $50 ona cars setup with 500hp, you haev to realize the engiens wont last all season, and thay are spending alot of money on replacement parts. Thje deepest pockets dont always single out the best drivers.

The new clases sound good to group everytogeather better, good idea Mike. I think that areo body imporvemetns (side skirts, front lip, splitters, wings) should be allowed to help the faster moving cars (turbo cars) have a better airflow over the body, to help traction at those higher speeds.

This is all just my 2cents, i have been reading into SRX for along time, i dont mind other more powerful cars being allowed, they have their disavantages and advantages on and off the track, im not worried. SRX was created originally to allowed cars to have alot fo power and other options over the very regulated SE-R Cup cars, it was unlimited before for a reason, so far i dont see a real need to regulate anything at all.


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ale89se
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smartbomb wrote:Hi From your friendly series director.

I am trying to write the rules to encorage particpation form the 240 comunity. There are so many caged 240's out there used in drifting and stuff and the car is such a natural for it, I am trying to redo the rules so more 240's can come out.

I am open to suggestions, what would you like to see?

Mike
i see i am a little late to this thread. i am now a subscriber to GRM and would love you help you out in any way possible during this offseason. i just got out of the military after 8 years and am "foaming at the mouth" for a chance to go to one of your events! if you need any help at all from licking envelopes to calling people/companies for various reasons let me know. i hope to attend and eneter a couple of hpde events next year with my car! congrats on the position and good luck with the se-r cup classes! my ka24de would love to be fully abused on the track!

veilside180sx
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I just want to know when NASA is going to run stuff in the Northwest, so I even have a chance at running events. As of right now I have to drive down to No. Cali to compete.

In the end I still want my car to run SERX, as my cage is being built within those specs. I think the NC setup Mike is proposing in the best way to get as many people as possible on the track and having fun while keeping it competitive.

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ale89se
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quick question. sorry for the thread jacking but i just joined nasa and was wondering about the hpde's. how long do you get to run for, for the $150 fee? thank you. also anyone going to the event on feb 11 @ buttonwillow?

HardcorePS13
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ale89se wrote:quick question. sorry for the thread jacking but i just joined nasa and was wondering about the hpde's. how long do you get to run for, for the $150 fee? thank you. also anyone going to the event on feb 11 @ buttonwillow?
That depends on alot of factors.

- What races are taking place- Number of participants- Hours in the day (winter hours are shorter)- Etc.

You won't regret spending the money.

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ale89se
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like i said i'll be going to the feb 11 event to go and watch and help if i can. anyone else? thanks for the info.


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