NarrowBand Air/Fuel Ratio gauge completely useless???

[driftin8ez]

Just picked up an Autometer Ultra lite AFR gauge for $20. It was cheap so i decided to buy it. Now i have read that they are completely useless is that true? I would think it would at least give me some type of idea, Or at least show me when i'm in closed loop while cruising.

[float_6969]

People will disagree with me, but for $20, I think they're better than nothing. Certainly not a great tuning tool, but it will tell you if there is a problem.

[The_Chosen_One]

to understand why they are useless you have to understand how the narrowband and wideband sensors work. A Narrowband sensor only has a 0-1volt signal and wideband 0-5volt signal. Obviously a wideband is more accurate because the voltage spectrum is wider.

The problem with the narrowband gauge is it reads Rich, Stoich (14.7), Lean the problem with narrowband sensor and gauge is that it doesnt exactly tell you HOW Rich or HOW Lean you are. For example you could be running something like 13.8 and it will lean further to RICH and you usually want to be richer when in boost. So if its only what you got make sure you ONLY use it for under 3500rpms.

[themadscientist]

I set my fuel with an Apex turbo timer that displayed the OEM 3-wire narrow band O2 sensor signal. When I chacked it against my new wideband I didn't need to make any changes to the fuel settings. That being said they are not as accurate as a wideband but they are better than nothing. I would always check to see if the spark plugs were agreeing with the NB.

[dash]

back when into modifying buick GNs, most were tuned by $100 chip, O2 volts and knock sensor monitoring. Some full weight airconditioned daily drivers turned solid 10sec ETs on unopened 150k mile motors.Today you'd think life is impossible with everybody barking at ya, "you need a wideband... get it on a dyno".Yet the vast majority of 'such' cars couldn't come near accomplishing what GNs did on the regular.

Over a certain range, wideband net you no gains anyway. I'll run a narrowband with O2 volt readout, in conjunction with a wideband, for the sake of curiosity.Dawes offered an inexpensive narroband led meter featuring different colors to indicate, with an interesting description.

I see alot of my buddies having issues" with their wideband and/or sensor life/reliability

[driftin8ez]

good to now. I would just rather have one to make sure at least it goes "rich" when at wot and doesn't read "lean". At least i will know im somewhat safe that way. I use quotes around rich and lean because it can be such a wide range when reading it on a narrowband.

[driftin8ez]

Another quick question...Anyway to tell what voltage or afr it's reading from this gauge. Dead center im assuming is 14.7/1 but how can you tell when it's not dead center? Or is this gauge nearly useless?

[driftin8ez]

Ok i got it. It reads in .05v increments. So two line from the center would be .6v?



Ok i found this little write-up on it. So at about .85v i should be around 12.5/1 AFR. .85v should be about 7 ticks over from the center. Seems as if this could turn out to be quick use full after all.



Also I'm assuming every narrow band o2 sensor for all manufacturers follows this voltage table.
Modified by driftin8ez at 8:30 PM 7/7/2007

[float_6969]

to understand why they are useless you have to understand how the narrowband and wideband sensors work. A Narrowband sensor only has a 0-1volt signal and wideband 0-5volt signal. Obviously a wideband is more accurate because the voltage spectrum is wider.

The problem with the narrowband gauge is it reads Rich, Stoich (14.7), Lean the problem with narrowband sensor and gauge is that it doesnt exactly tell you HOW Rich or HOW Lean you are. For example you could be running something like 13.8 and it will lean further to RICH and you usually want to be richer when in boost. So if its only what you got make sure you ONLY use it for under 3500rpms.

LOL! How long do you think I've been doing this? I'm aware of EVERYTHING that you just stated, but I would treat a narrowband gauge kinda like an idiot light. "If I'm in boost, and I see ANYTHING but green, GET OUT OF IT NOW!".

Is it a great tuning tool? No. Is it better than nothing? Yes. Can we argue about this all day long? Yes. Will either of us persuade the other to change his mind? Probably not....

[The_Chosen_One]

Float read it again, you will see that my response was not for you, and my last part clearly states if its the only thing what he has than to take the precaution.

my post to show WHY the wideband is better not to just say its better, I actually explain why its better and how it works.

Theirs no one arguing, he asked for info I just went into detail.

Reading Comprehension > You