Has anyone done this?
I was wondering if a JWT ECU tuned for N/A applications will have any adverse effects on a turbo car w/ FMU. Like advancing the timing too much or something, I thought I heard of someone doing this but don't remember.
N/A JWT ECU w/ turbo and FMU
-
encasemyheart
- Posts: 634
- Joined: Wed Sep 25, 2002 1:29 pm
Yeah I probably will, but it's taking longer than I thought to get the fuel system together and everything else is about ready to go on. Plus JWT will take another 3-4 weeks (for $100 BTW) to get it back to me once they get it.
My friend gave me a deal on a brand new Vortech FMU, so I decided to take it and just upgrade my fuel system later. I guess I'll go back to stock ECU, after I give JWT a call that is.
My friend gave me a deal on a brand new Vortech FMU, so I decided to take it and just upgrade my fuel system later. I guess I'll go back to stock ECU, after I give JWT a call that is.
-
:: orion ::
- Posts: 1483
- Joined: Fri May 23, 2003 4:40 pm
- Car: '96 240SX, with KA-T @ 12psi...
- Contact:
I ran mine like that for 2 weeks, and of course, it blew the #4 piston.
The N/A ECU has WAY too much timing advance - I had the base timing retarded 3 degrees (17 BDTC) and with only 5.8psi I blew the motor. You live, you learn...
After that, I rebuilt the motor with a spare piston I had laying around from an old KA that was given to me, and I continued to run the JWT N/A upgrade with a Hacked-MAF for 3-4 months, base timing at 15 BTDC, with no major issues, but it was on the ragged edge. One bad tank of gas would've killed it...and continued beating on it was risky. I knew that the motor I had was going to be replaced soon anyway, so i gave it hell...
BTW - JWT is quick with 'chip swaps' - I called them last Friday (July 25th) and spoke to Ben, told him what I needed...let him know I needed it by the convention this last weekend,and it was here on last Thursday. $100 + $250 core for the old N/A chip...
But for some #s...
If you read the timing via a data-logger or MDM Techtom, you'll see the N/A chip gives 8-10 dgress advance at WOT, settling at around 28 total timing at WOT from what I've recorded. I've heard it can give up to 35...but haven't seen that myself.
The turbo ECUs act similar to the N/A chips under light throttle, but drop to 20-22 with a stab at the throttle, and continue to drop 'til 15 degrees total timing at WOT under boost.
This is all assuming a base of 20 degrees...
But you can see that a difference of 13 degrees at WOT is A LOT!!! And you think: "Well, I'll just back off the base timing to compensate..." - But you'd need a base of 7 to get it right, so off-boost driveability would be horrible, you'd pop and backfire A LOT, etc...it would suck.
Use the stock ECU for a week and do it right.
Mine is smoother, builds boost better, and is WAY safer with the turbo chip, even as compared to the stock ECU.
Later - Brian
The N/A ECU has WAY too much timing advance - I had the base timing retarded 3 degrees (17 BDTC) and with only 5.8psi I blew the motor. You live, you learn...
After that, I rebuilt the motor with a spare piston I had laying around from an old KA that was given to me, and I continued to run the JWT N/A upgrade with a Hacked-MAF for 3-4 months, base timing at 15 BTDC, with no major issues, but it was on the ragged edge. One bad tank of gas would've killed it...and continued beating on it was risky. I knew that the motor I had was going to be replaced soon anyway, so i gave it hell...
BTW - JWT is quick with 'chip swaps' - I called them last Friday (July 25th) and spoke to Ben, told him what I needed...let him know I needed it by the convention this last weekend,and it was here on last Thursday. $100 + $250 core for the old N/A chip...
But for some #s...
If you read the timing via a data-logger or MDM Techtom, you'll see the N/A chip gives 8-10 dgress advance at WOT, settling at around 28 total timing at WOT from what I've recorded. I've heard it can give up to 35...but haven't seen that myself.
The turbo ECUs act similar to the N/A chips under light throttle, but drop to 20-22 with a stab at the throttle, and continue to drop 'til 15 degrees total timing at WOT under boost.
This is all assuming a base of 20 degrees...
But you can see that a difference of 13 degrees at WOT is A LOT!!! And you think: "Well, I'll just back off the base timing to compensate..." - But you'd need a base of 7 to get it right, so off-boost driveability would be horrible, you'd pop and backfire A LOT, etc...it would suck.
Use the stock ECU for a week and do it right.
Mine is smoother, builds boost better, and is WAY safer with the turbo chip, even as compared to the stock ECU.
Later - Brian
-
encasemyheart
- Posts: 634
- Joined: Wed Sep 25, 2002 1:29 pm
[quote=" :: orion ::
If you read the timing via a data-logger or MDM Techtom, you'll see the N/A chip gives 8-10 dgress advance at WOT, settling at around 28 total timing at WOT from what I've recorded. I've heard it can give up to 35...but haven't seen that myself.
Mine is smoother, builds boost better, and is WAY safer with the turbo chip, even as compared to the stock ECU.
Later - Brian [/quote]
What datalogger are you using with this car?
If you read the timing via a data-logger or MDM Techtom, you'll see the N/A chip gives 8-10 dgress advance at WOT, settling at around 28 total timing at WOT from what I've recorded. I've heard it can give up to 35...but haven't seen that myself.
Mine is smoother, builds boost better, and is WAY safer with the turbo chip, even as compared to the stock ECU.
Later - Brian [/quote]
What datalogger are you using with this car?
-
:: orion ::
- Posts: 1483
- Joined: Fri May 23, 2003 4:40 pm
- Car: '96 240SX, with KA-T @ 12psi...
- Contact:
I was using a PocketLogger the 1st time (with the old N/A ECU) - It barely worked, though - only would read 1 parameter at a time, would occasionally freeze up, etc...
With the turbo ECU I used an MDM-100, and just did repeated highway pulls, and watched the output over and over again.
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
And I'd like to amend my previous post:
The JWT turbo ECU was better than my old setup in some regards, but only b/c I had the base timing knocked forward 6 degrees. Once it was back at 20 BTDC, it sucked IMO.
I'm back to the hacked MAF, partially due to JWT customer service, partially due to the fact that at less than 350rwhp, the JWT turbo chips gives so little timing that it's overkill...no power.
A KA24DE at ~8psi and a proper A/F trim can run 20 BTDC base with even a couple degrees advance under WOT, i.e. 22 total timing safely.
JWT retards 5 over the base no matter what the boost or airflow is. That's just too much for low boost - Perfect for big boost, but no fun for low. I lost and estimated 10rwhp by going to the JWT turbo setup over my Hacked MAF (which was lean, but has now been shimmed to fix it).
Later - Brian
With the turbo ECU I used an MDM-100, and just did repeated highway pulls, and watched the output over and over again.
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
And I'd like to amend my previous post:
The JWT turbo ECU was better than my old setup in some regards, but only b/c I had the base timing knocked forward 6 degrees. Once it was back at 20 BTDC, it sucked IMO.
I'm back to the hacked MAF, partially due to JWT customer service, partially due to the fact that at less than 350rwhp, the JWT turbo chips gives so little timing that it's overkill...no power.
A KA24DE at ~8psi and a proper A/F trim can run 20 BTDC base with even a couple degrees advance under WOT, i.e. 22 total timing safely.
JWT retards 5 over the base no matter what the boost or airflow is. That's just too much for low boost - Perfect for big boost, but no fun for low. I lost and estimated 10rwhp by going to the JWT turbo setup over my Hacked MAF (which was lean, but has now been shimmed to fix it).
Later - Brian