My VLSD always drift to the right in snow

[Scuffed_ChukiCoupe]

not really a waste, it depends on the price and its kinda hit or miss

between $300 to $350.

[gumby74]

This made me a bit curious. As I was about to leave work, I had one of the warehouse monkeys stand behind the car and then let me know what happened.I did me a nice little peel out, the tail did in fact pull to the right, both wheels hooked up pretty much off the line.It kicked over about a foot smoothly, and then it was all straight. This is with an S15 helical on a stock KA E, and one pissed off clutch.I only did it the one time. My tires are waaaay to wide and sticky for what the engine is putting out.

[elpiar]

I was talking to my Mechanical engineering prof today and he explained to me briefly:

In most RWD cars, The engine is upset clockwise (assume front view of the car) since the crank shaft rotates counter-clockwise and therefore the whole body of the car dynamics affects the traction each wheel has. As a result, the rear right has less traction due to having less normal force compared to the rear left. This is inherent to longitudinal-engine-RWD cars.

In the case of open diff, this is mainly due to the fact that the ring gear in the diff is on the rear left axle, therefore the power goes to the rear right first and if there is no LSD there is no way to transfer the torque to the left side. Open diff always puts out the same torque for both wheels.

[Chukidori]

I'm in ohio and this morning we got our first snow shower.

I got J30 VLSD diff. with kumho ecsta asx tires

My tail always drift to the right when I lose traction. It seems to me that the right side spins faster than the left.

I am also suspicious cause when I bought the car last year the right rear tire is all bald while the rest is still at 50%.

Is this inherent to VLSD or something is wrong with my transaxle?

First of all a transaxle is only on FWD and AWD vehicles, your 240 just has a transmission and rear differential.

And about your VLSD. A VLSD only works AFTER initial slip has taken place. The more one wheel slips, the more power is transferred to the other wheel...One wheel has to Slip first in order for the difference in rotational speed to "spool" up the viscoud fluid and lock the clutches..the more one side is slipping the greater the locking on the opposite side.

[BOOM_STICK]

First of all a transaxle is only on FWD and AWD vehicles

lol, my mr2 has a transaxle and it's RWD!

anyways, have you ever seen a drag car with a locker and stock suspension (sp?) launch? it always sits back on the right rear tire, even tho both tires are spinning at the same speed. it has a lot to do with the engine's rotation and its effect on the chassis.

at least i think so...

[Emperor_Tha]

so a helical or clutch type is better in the snow

[redtop91]

I'd say Helical because if one wheel is completely without traction, torque will be immediately transferred to the wheel with traction. Save you a few seconds of revving LOL.

[Didderson]

It's most likely because of the crown of the road. Roads aren't made flat, they have a slight crown to evacuate water to the gutter/ditch.

Pull onto the wrong side of the road and try spinning em.

Exactly what I was about to say. +1 man.

Either that or it's the force of the spinning crank and drive shaft that create rotational torque and throw the car to the right/left.

[Didderson]

the drive shaft is spinning towards the pass sidethe torque from your drive shaft causes right wheel to burn or for the wheel to get better traction

or something like that

Well i'm glad your avatar text says you don't own a 240 yet, because you're wrong. The engine/trans spin clockwise when looking @ the crank pulley from the front of the car. Thus the rotational force would want to spin the car clockwise also, giving more traction to the drivers side rear wheel.

It's like a helicopter motor. They have to use those little propellers to keep from spinning around with the torque of the main rotor.

Edit: OK let me clarify something, since the drivers side wheels get more forces applied by the rotating driveshaft and other ****, this causes the passenger side to have less downward force applied. With and open differential you have to remember the power is transfered to the wheel with THE LEAST traction, spinning the passenger side wheel.That is all.
Modified by Didderson at 8:21 PM 12/6/2007

[jtothed]

Hey I'm from Canada... so yeah there's snow. My almost completely stock S13 w/ OEM VSLD kicks to the right in the snow when losing traction, all over a flat parking lot.

Diff fluid is good, VLSD deff. works as it should.... I checked

[Didderson]

I'd say Helical because if one wheel is completely without traction, torque will be immediately transferred to the wheel with traction. Save you a few seconds of revving LOL.

Sorry to keep posting but I guess I can't add quotes while editing. You're almost right man. I've got a helical and did much research on this. Helicals are commonly used in 4wd or off-roading systems. In the owners manual for hummers, it tells the owner that if they get stuck even if one wheel is on the ground and another is completely up off the ground or on ice (meaning it has no resistance to torque) the other wheel won't spin and you'll have an open diff affect. HOWEVER, if you apply the brakes in this situation the other wheel will have resistance and your torsion differential will transfer the torque to the wheel with more traction.

Hope that explains it. There's threads on nico that say the same thing. Helicals are great as long as both wheels are on the ground

[murda-c]

I was talking to my Mechanical engineering prof today and he explained to me briefly:

In most RWD cars, The engine is upset clockwise (assume front view of the car) since the crank shaft rotates counter-clockwise and therefore the whole body of the car dynamics affects the traction each wheel has. As a result, the rear right has less traction due to having less normal force compared to the rear left. This is inherent to longitudinal-engine-RWD cars.

In the case of open diff, this is mainly due to the fact that the ring gear in the diff is on the rear left axle, therefore the power goes to the rear right first and if there is no LSD there is no way to transfer the torque to the left side. Open diff always puts out the same torque for both wheels.

i thought the ring gear was on the differential case, not one of the axles, and power gets to the axles through the side gears in the case.

[Didderson]

^ Bah i didnt read that yet. I'll have to think about this a lot lol. I didnt think about the normal force man. now i'm confused. only one way to find out. get a muscle car w/ the clockwise rotating shaft and see which way it rocks to.

[Scuffed_ChukiCoupe]

Everyone keeps saying the passenger side tire is the one with less traction, but no1 has answered why my driver side tire is the one ALWAYS spining? Does it matter that the rear of my car is completely stripped?

[Chukidori]

To the MR guy...Yea..your car does have a transaxle, because your drive wheels are right by your engine...A transaxle is like a compact transmission/differential assembly.

[elpiar]

^ Bah i didnt read that yet. I'll have to think about this a lot lol. I didnt think about the normal force man. now i'm confused. only one way to find out. get a muscle car w/ the clockwise rotating shaft and see which way it rocks to.

normal force is the same as what you call downward force. So we're talking about the same thing. Everything you write is exactly correct.

Also, murda-c, after some reading, the ring gear is NOT attached to any side of the axle. Both axles are connected to the side gears as you said. I stand corrected.

The traction a tire get of course is proportional to the downward force it experience. This is why I'm sick of losing traction in my supercharged integra and get a 240.

[elpiar]

Sorry to keep posting but I guess I can't add quotes while editing. You're almost right man. I've got a helical and did much research on this. Helicals are commonly used in 4wd or off-roading systems. In the owners manual for hummers, it tells the owner that if they get stuck even if one wheel is on the ground and another is completely up off the ground or on ice (meaning it has no resistance to torque) the other wheel won't spin and you'll have an open diff affect. HOWEVER, if you apply the brakes in this situation the other wheel will have resistance and your torsion differential will transfer the torque to the wheel with more traction.

Hope that explains it. There's threads on nico that say the same thing. Helicals are great as long as both wheels are on the ground

If you do google on "torsen differential" you'll get many links with good explanation. a torsen will multiply whatever torque you have on the slipping wheel with the bias ratio to the other side. So if you got only 50 ft-lb on the slipping tire, and the bias ratio is 4, then the other side will get 200 ft-lb at this instant.

But consider a case when the slipping tire is up in the air or on a very very slippery ice. The torque is zero or near zero. Multiply zero by 4 and you get zero. Hence, no movement. Apply the brake and you get some torque, and things will start moving.

[White Comet]

tom u just keep digging a hole, lol no more posting for u until u get ur story straight

[homeslicej2]

Glad you got your mech. eng. prof to tell you about powertransfer. You seem to know more than you let on as well You testing us?

[elpiar]

Glad you got your mech. eng. prof to tell you about powertransfer. You seem to know more than you let on as well You testing us?

Yea i learn a lot from his explanation. Also, everytime I ask a question I keep on looking around for info while waiting for replies. When i found additional info, I share it here. That's the whole point of forum, right?

no i'm not testing, seriously

[homeslicej2]

^coolness

[White Comet]

Yea i learn a lot from his explanation. Also, everytime I ask a question I keep on looking around for info while waiting for replies. When i found additional info, I share it here. That's the whole point of forum, right?

no i'm not testing, seriously

good way to use the forum, better than some of the post whores around here

[Mero]

Hey I'm from Canada... so yeah there's snow. My almost completely stock S13 w/ OEM VSLD kicks to the right in the snow when losing traction, all over a flat parking lot.

Diff fluid is good, VLSD deff. works as it should.... I checked

same here, and that made me wondering if the Vlsd still works...