my setup

Post by **240marcuSX** » Wed Aug 13, 2003 5:50 pm

well ive started making plans for my own turbo kit, you experts out there think id be ok at 10 (daily) - 15 (track)psi with 370ccs, 255lph pump, s-afc, and JWT ecu, with a t3/t04??? im getting my head, and manifolds ported soon, id also like to get a z31 mafs. does this sound good, and if so what power would this yield? im looking to be in the mid-high 12s 1/4 miles, 300 or so rwhp. those are my final goals, if my plans above are stupid, can you suggest something that will put me at about 300whp, and/or mid 12 second 1/4 mile times. I have the sohc motor by the way. I realize the psi suggestion might be a little high, (wishful thinking?)

oh and i only want suggestions for this motor, boo sr, boo, and im building the drivetrain now as well.

your thoughts?

Post by **erich** » Wed Aug 13, 2003 5:50 pm

A couple of things. I think you mean a Z32 MAF, not a Z31. If you go with a JWT ecu you don't need the s-afc. 370cc/min injectors tap out at about 260-270 crank HP, unless you run the 4 bar program with an external FPR. Doing so will get you about 15% more fuel, so look for about 300 or so crank HP that way. With a T04x turbo you will max out 370cc/min injectors between 8-10psi at 3bar fuel pressure. Maybe 10-12 with the 4 bar program.If you really want 300 wheel HP you will need larger injectors, like the MSD 50lb/hr ones and a new fuel rail. I know because I have them sitting on my desk waiting for the 50lb/hr program from JWT!

Post by **:: orion ::** » Wed Aug 13, 2003 5:50 pm

Yeah...you're quite limited with 370cc injectors.

Expect maybe 260rwhp MAX (not crank), which is about 9psi from a T04E compressor (with stock fuel pressure).

I'm running 370s and 8psi on a T3/T04E (57trim, .63 A/R - Stage III) and making just over 250rwhp (based on 1/4 trap speeds of 104...) - Still have some fuel, not much.

Another psi will max these injectors with my setup...I'll know once I hit the dyno here soon.

Later - Brian

Post by **240marcuSX** » Wed Aug 13, 2003 5:50 pm

soo..... 50 lb/h injectors, 255lph pump, JWT ecu, with a t3/t04, Z32 MAF, what psi would i be looking at with this setup? 8 - 10?

and this should put me closer to the 300/ 12.5 sec. mark?

what fuel rail can i use??

"T3/T04E (57trim, .63 A/R - Stage III" i was looking at just about this same turbo. you think that would be a good turbo for my setup?

Post by **Nathan** » Wed Aug 13, 2003 5:50 pm

http://www.jgycustoms.com for a fuel rail, the 57 trim is inefficient, the 50 is much better, the 60 if you will run high boost. With that setup...you can easily run upwards of 300whp, and shoot for an easy 15psi of boost. Oh, and a good intercooler and exhaust is necessary for that as well.

Post by **240marcuSX** » Wed Aug 13, 2003 5:50 pm

how well does the 60 trim spool up? i would like to run about 10 psi daily and about 15 psi track. yeah, im definately getting an ic as well. Im looking at the nur spec and n1.

haha my bumper is on dgtrials.com

http://www.dgtrials.com/

(the burgundy) behind the brighter red FC.

Post by **erich** » Wed Aug 13, 2003 5:50 pm

:: orion :: wrote:Yeah...you're quite limited with 370cc injectors.

Expect maybe 260rwhp MAX (not crank), which is about 9psi from a T04E compressor (with stock fuel pressure).

I'm running 370s and 8psi on a T3/T04E (57trim, .63 A/R - Stage III) and making just over 250rwhp (based on 1/4 trap speeds of 104...) - Still have some fuel, not much.

Another psi will max these injectors with my setup...I'll know once I hit the dyno here soon.

Later - Brian

I dynoed 224 rwhp at 10 psi with a T3 (very little air over the intercooler so it should be a bit higher) and ran a 102mph trap speed. With a BSFC of about .47 @ 90% duty cycle gives you ~270 crank HP. This is what my car is running.

Go witht the 50 trim T04 if you want big boost. 50lb/hr injectors should let me max out my turbo (a 60 trim T3) at 17psi with a little fuel left over. With a T04 look for about 12-15 to max the injectors.My goals were to get really quick spool around town with the most efficient turbo for daily driving. I'll live with lower peak HP number for better midband torque.

Post by **240marcuSX** » Wed Aug 13, 2003 5:50 pm

how bad is the gas mileage with the 50 lb/hour injectors? and the driveability of the latest setup i posted? this car will be driven very often, but im sure there will be days where i dont drive it. i dont mind too bad of gas mileage like maybe 15-20 mpg. my mileage right now sucks anyway.

erichs got me thinking about a t3 now, what was your 1/4 time?

Post by **Nathan** » Wed Aug 13, 2003 5:50 pm

Cruising on the highway, out of boost, you should get gas mileage that is just fine....it's when you get your foot into it that you get 2 mpg.

Post by **240marcuSX** » Wed Aug 13, 2003 5:50 pm

50 lb/h injectors, 255lph pump, JWT ecu, Z32 MAF, jgy fuel rail. T3/T04 ( 50 or 60 trim, .63 a/r), 10 daily, 15 track psi.

thats my setup. thanks again for all your help gentlemen.

but one more thing, recommend any wastegates/ boost controllers? i was looking at the Tial 35 or 40mm. but i dont know at all what bc to get?

Post by **240marcuSX** » Wed Aug 13, 2003 5:50 pm

the JGY fuel rail says its for SR20DET, and KA24DE, will it work on the KA24E? and they also sell 50lb/hr injectors? are those good?

Post by **240marcuSX** » Wed Aug 13, 2003 5:50 pm

bump.

Post by **ftrs13** » Wed Aug 13, 2003 5:50 pm

it depends, the rails will be for side fed injectors, and if you plan on changing your setup to side feds then it should work fine. the stock rail works well though. if youve been reading then youve seen this http://www.nissaninfiniticlub....32755but then youd have to go with top fed injectors

to answer your question ... the rails are for side fed injectors and if the 50lb injectors that you upgrade to are side fed, then it should work fine.

Post by **Nathan** » Wed Aug 13, 2003 5:50 pm

Wrong...JGY's fuel rails are for top feed. But the KA24E is allready top feed. Will MSD injectors fit it? I dunno...I would think so, but might need modification as I think the top o-ring is bigger on the MSD style injectors. There would be no reason for JGY to sell side feed rails, the stock ones are more than adequate...they are top feeds.

Post by **240marcuSX** » Wed Aug 13, 2003 5:50 pm

yeah, ive read that the OE fuel rails are more than adequate, so i think ill stick with them, and slap some top feed 50 bl/hr injectors on those.

no one has any thoughts on wastegates or boost controllers?

Post by **:: orion ::** » Wed Aug 13, 2003 5:50 pm

erich wrote:I dynoed 224 rwhp at 10 psi with a T3 (very little air over the intercooler so it should be a bit higher) and ran a 102mph trap speed. With a BSFC of about .47 @ 90% duty cycle gives you ~270 crank HP. This is what my car is running...

I kinda don't see what you're saying here...

Are you saying the 370s will run out of fuel at less than 260rwhp...?

It looks like the #s agree, but many, many KA-Ts run ~250rwhp with 370s...that's almost 300 crank HP.

The math (using your .47 BSFC and 90%) says we need 412cc injectors for that power, but the dyno says otherwise...???

(And for an example - Tony in ATL runs 9-10psi from a Z31 T3 with a log mani and a Volvo intercooler - And calculated 97% duty cycle at redline and dyno'd just over 250rwhp)

Later - Brian

Post by **erich** » Wed Aug 13, 2003 5:50 pm

Running over 85%-90% duty cycle on an injector is looking for trouble. The fuel metering tends to go wonky, and the solenoid windings will eventually burn out. If you want the power AND reliability go with larger injectors.

Post by **:: orion ::** » Wed Aug 13, 2003 5:50 pm

I'm fully aware of that, but I'm saying that many others (Tony was really a bad example - He runs an AFC with LOADS of extra fuel up top, which is pushing the injectors) get away with 250rwhp at reasonable duty cycles...

I'll borrow a Techtom CMX-100 from a local SE-R guy and check mine here soon...

Later - Brian

Post by **ftrs13** » Wed Aug 13, 2003 5:50 pm

sorry about the mistake, I just saw ka24de and sr20det and assumed, when I went to check it out actually, I saw that they were top mount.

my bad

Steve

Post by **:: orion ::** » Wed Aug 13, 2003 5:50 pm

Allright...

Borrowed the Techtom...

At WOT in 2nd, 3rd, and 4th...highest duty cycle recorded was 88.7% (CMX-100 has a peak-hold feature).

This is JWT turbo ECU, 370cc injectors, and 8psi from a T3/T04E...which is about ~250rwhp.

Weird thing was...my MAF recorded 5.11 volts - I was under the impression it's maxed out at 5...but I haven't really done that much research on it.

And as for 85-90% being too high - I think that may be the case with some injectors, but it seems that Nissan side feeds are especially resistant to wearing out, even at 100% duty cycle - Lots of the KA-Ts on this board run FMUs...which puts the stock 270s maxed at 4-5psi, and then forcing more fuel through an injector stuck open at 100%...and even those seem to never have issues.

What do some of the other KA-T guys think???

(BTW - erich - I'm not trying to be argumentative - I'm trying to figure out why the #s are so far off by the BSFC HP formula, etc...I'll believe empirical evidence any day over the theoretical #s)

Later - Brian

Post by **erich** » Wed Aug 13, 2003 5:50 pm

No worries.From what I have read the MAF doesn't max out a 5 volts, the A/D converter on the ECU is set to read a max of 5 volts. When I get the car dynoe'd again after I put in the 50 lb/hr injectors I'll video the duty cycle, tach and boost gague. The I'll get some more real data and I'll post it up.

Post by **Nathan** » Wed Aug 13, 2003 5:50 pm

ftrs13, I dont think mistakes are acceptable around here, I'm going to have to ask you to leave now.

Ok, maybe not really...welcome to NICO!

Post by **240marcuSX** » Wed Aug 13, 2003 5:50 pm

ive been looking at other setups ok peep diss yo

Mitsubishi TE04H turboRealnissan manifoldSkyline R30 intercooler (side mount)Venom 400 performance moduleOBX short shifterWalbro 255 lph90' ECU

all that for about 1200 shipped. what do you think?? i dont like it that its a side mount IC, and a small Turbo but everything else im ok with. Id rather have the setup i listed before, but this is soooo much cheaper. ive been told that this can reach about 250 hp before the turbo gives out. and im guessing that the turbo is an internal wastegated. so if i was gonna switch the turbo to a external gate, id have to switch the manifold too.

and on a new note, looks like my SOHC might be a track car (after heavy modification).

Post by **240SXer** » Wed Aug 13, 2003 5:50 pm

Anyone know where I can buy a Techtom CMX-100?

my setup

my setup

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