my genius ideas

[vvaffle]

alright these two idea might not be genius at all but i think they at least sound interesting.

1. i presume that a turbocharged car works pretty much like a NA car until it hits an RPM high enough that there is boost. in other words, that 3 inch exhaust that is great for the turbo might not be so great before 3k-4k RPM since many NA cars rely on some back pressure. now this might be totaly unnecesary, but wouldnt it be possible to put in something similar to a throtle body into your downpipe or elsewhere in the exhaust system to control the amount of backpressure based on the rpm? would more backpressure at lower RPMs increase spool time?

2. iv never driven a car with a significant turbo lag (only cars with stock turbos) but from what iv heard, noone likes turbo lag. so what i was thinking is a way to get your turbine to start spinning before the exhaust gas causes it to. now this idea "idea" is even less developed than the previous one so dont laugh too hard. it might be possible to make the housing the turbine or the shaft an electromagnet of sorts. you would have to run insulated wire through or around either of the housings and time the electric pulses in such a way that it causes the turbine to spin. you would somehow hook this up to your battery and turn it on some 500-1000 RPM before your regular boost comes in. then you would have to turn it off so that your turbo is not charging your battery.

sorry if both of those sounds totaly incoherent but i was bored and decided to think about random car ideas.

now that all of you think im an idiot, i might as well ask the most newbish question of the century, and im seriously not sure about this: does the clutch connect the engine to the transmition, or the transmition to the driveline? anyways, i expect alot of these : but i hope that i have at least somewhat entertained you.

[hannibal]

Clutch connects engine to transmission...

[crzycav86]

1. I don't think turbo guys are very concerned with back-pressure off of boost. You're always going to get a lot of backpressure with that turbine blocking everything. That is until the turbo starts spooling

2. I'm not really sure about that too. Even if you could get this electromagnet to work, it would have to spin super fast to be very effective.

Although your ideas are probably destined to fail.. it's good to see people being creative and coming up with new things. Keep it up.

[keepingthe240]

*** i'm bored and yeah your a goof A clutch connect the engine to the transmission. Question 1..my answer A ball bearing turbo would have less lag(500 rpm less). You'd have to have a big a/r to have that much lag as what your talking about. Question 2. I'd go with nitrous to get your engine going under 3k. If you don't like lag , go with a "instant boost" setup. There is a setup listed in scc a few years ago for a 2200-2600cc engine for 250hp. Boost comes on @ 2200rpm.

[keepingthe240]

In the july 2002 sport compact car there is a article . Pick your turbo (without math) There are 2 general setups (2200cc-2600cc) covered...Fast response .. builds boost @1,500-2k and hard at it @ 2,500-3k with a boost range of 7-16psi weekend warior.. comes on @ 2,500 and rocken hard @ 3,500. Also listed are "junk yard dogs" and what donor cars you can find that turbo in.

[Red-KAT]

I think I saw someone working on the electric assisted turbo already. Not a bad idea.

Anyways the less backpressure I have the faster my turbo spins up. so my 3" is awsome for my low end.

[Craving4Boost]

Turbo lag isnt always a bad thing, it can help u gain traction. it's also a courteous head start =P

[TrunkMonkey]

it doesn't matter if you're N/A or boosted, backpressure is evil. remember that.

-demetrius

[Xero]

^correct, it's exhaust velocity that you want, bakpressure is bad, velocity good

[pr240sx]

I think that Rally cars dump raw fuel to make the turbo spool faster.I saw that on one forum a waaay back ago

[vvaffle]

it doesn't matter if you're N/A or boosted, backpressure is evil. remember that.

-demetrius

So how come I have heard that putting a huge exhaust on a N/A car will actually rob the car of horsepower? Either way, the throtle body in downpipe idea seems totaly pointless because as someone said, the turbine is already blocking airflow until it starts spinning. Regarding the electrically assisted turbo, it might not be the best way to do it, but getting rid of turbo lag is not just to get rid of the feeling. Let's say that you race cars as a proffesion, the smallest advantage at any RPM range is still an advantage over the competition. Though, I'm sure someone is already working on that since by the time I thought that a transmition with a continually variable ratio would be a nifty thing, they had already been researched for years, I just didn't hear about it.

So how would I get to the old articles from SCC? Another question, what would you guys say is the best car magazine? By the way, thanks for answering my newb question guys. I thought it was engine to transmition to engine but I wasn't too sure.

[PapaSmurf2k3]

1. Not for a turbo car, however that would be beneficial for an NA car, seeing as how with more backpressure they somehow make more torque down low or something. But still, you want as little backpressure as possible when your hammering on it @ 4000 rpm or so. They already have this invention, its being implimented on the new Z06 Corvette, they are basically butterfly valves in the mufflers that open up @ 3500 RPM and bypass the mufflers or something. I read that in motor trend or Road and Track.

2. As someone els said, its not neccessarilly (sp?) bad to not have that power down low, that way its more docile around town driving, and its easier to keep traction. usually when launching most cars have more than enough power to burn tire off the line anyway so, there really isnt a point. But if you still want it to spool low for some reason (i dunno, maybe your on the highway and dont want to downshift), why wouldnt you just run a twin turbo setup in parrallel or something (Small turbo ----> big turbo).

Overall though, not bad ideas. But I think I can do you one better. Who here has ever had a few drinks and gone to bed w/ some girl and started making out/fooling around. If anyone els is like me, your mouth gets WICKED dry after a while, but sometimes you dont really feel like getting up to get a glass, or your afraid youll knock it over/spill, so I think im going to someone mount a camel back (hydration pack that bicycle riders use) to the head board or something, so theres always a drink right there, and its spill-proof/leak-proof. the only problem is you have to remember to fill it up before you start drinking/doing stuff. lemme know what you think.

[vvaffle]

Overall though, not bad ideas. But I think I can do you one better. Who here has ever had a few drinks and gone to bed w/ some girl and started making out/fooling around. If anyone els is like me, your mouth gets WICKED dry after a while, but sometimes you dont really feel like getting up to get a glass, or your afraid youll knock it over/spill, so I think im going to someone mount a camel back (hydration pack that bicycle riders use) to the head board or something, so theres always a drink right there, and its spill-proof/leak-proof. the only problem is you have to remember to fill it up before you start drinking/doing stuff. lemme know what you think.

I walk away in shame after being defeated. You are the TRUE genius.

[madbouncy]

Backpressure isn't what you want in any engine, you want velocity and flow. If you could get an exhaust that kept the gas moving faster than a small 2" but flowed as much as 4", that's what you'd want to use. You want the exhaust to get the hell out of the car as fast as possible. If you add a huge exhaust, the exhaust will be traveling pretty slow at lower rpms.

The less energy the engines wastes on the up stroke pushing the exhaust out, the more horsepower you'll squeeze out. Lower rpm = less flow, so you want a smaller tube to eep vkelocity up, higher rpm = more flow so you want a bigger tube because you need the flow but you'll still want the velocity up.

Modified by madbouncy at 3:09 PM 1/28/2005
Modified by madbouncy at 4:03 PM 1/28/2005

[TrunkMonkey]

Backpressure isn't what you want in any engine, you want velocity and flow. If you could get an exhaust that kept the gas moving faster than a small 2" but flowed as much as 4", that's what you'd want to use. You want the exhaust to get the hell out of the car as fast as possible. If you add a huge exhaust, the exhaust will be traveling pretty slow at lower rpms. However, the worst thing you can do, is have a 2" pipe and then go up to a 3" cat back. It causes a sudden pressure change and the air will cool down when it goes into the 3" pipe and expands, when it slows down it'll cause back pressure, it's like having the small flow volume at the beginning and then slowing the exhaust down at the end. The less energy the engines wastes on the up stroke pushing the exhaust out, the more horsepower you'll squeeze out. Lower rpm = less flow, so you want a smaller tube to eep vkelocity up, higher rpm = more flow so you want a bigger tube because you need the flow but you'll still want the velocity up.

Modified by madbouncy at 3:09 PM 1/28/2005

nicely said, but not completely correct. immediately going from a small diameter tube to a large one will not cause backpressure. backpressure only occurs when there's a restriction in the system. it could be going from one diameter tube to something smaller, a sharp bend, catalytic convertor, or a turbocharger (hehe). the exhaust gases will reach the restriction, build up, and even flow backwards.

-demetrius

[madbouncy]

I'll edit my post then, I was just hinking that if like PV= nRT, then if volume goes up then then the pressure will drop and the temperature will drop as well. Plus with more exhaust touching the outside wall, it would cool down faster slowing down the exhaust. I'm still new to this though, I just researched it because I couldn't finda reason why backpressure would ever be good, then I read and found out people were just using the term wrong.

[D Money]

using nitrous below 3000 rpm=blown motor

[TheOne]

try dumping fuel into the turbine.....i'd only recommend that for race only applications as that tends to damage turbos.(they do it at rally events.....but they also say it damages the turbo)

[keepingthe240]

I wasn't talking about running a 50hp spray. A "sneaky pete" would give enough spray to spool up the turbo. Oh, and they do use n20 to spool turbos on 8-9 sec drag cars An idea would be to use compressed air to spool up the turbo. Dodge used a varible noozle to minimize lag in the '80s

[skylndrftr]

I think that Rally cars dump raw fuel to make the turbo spool faster.I saw that on one forum a waaay back ago

its called antilag systems, there are a couple ways of doing it. you most common is to use a seriously delayed ignition spark so that the exhaust valves open as the combustion event is still in progress. and using straight compressed gas to spin a turbing is a very bad idea because as the high pressure gas comes out, it expands and cools very quickly (think can of compressed air for cleaning your computer) and the thermal shock will probably crack somethingvariable nozzles were pioneered on F1 1.5l turbos making upto 2000hp and using variable nozzles and variable vanes

[kaptainkrollio]

The new GT-R supposedly has electrically assisted twin turbos, so that where you probably heard it from.

[vvaffle]

its called antilag systems, there are a couple ways of doing it. you most common is to use a seriously delayed ignition spark so that the exhaust valves open as the combustion event is still in progress.

would this be plausible in a street car? or does it make the car far less reliable?

[skylndrftr]

all of that depends on what you call reliable... those turbos last a whole wekend in a WRC events so they are doing somethign right, they also have an off on switch for transit stages. It is plausible with two iffs1) you have a good set of exhaust valves and manifold that can take pure combustion heat2) your have a diverter valve or it'll destroy your cat..literally oftentimes the fuel air is still exploding as it crosses the turbine.

i guess the best i can say is its less reliable it all depends on how much you use it and how strongly you decide to use it, you can adjust it....its a lot more complicated than just that also plus its gonna require an aftermarket ecu (good one meaning motec or autronic, maybe tec3 or hondata) plus you gotta figure a way to get extra air in the engine to burn