Mom wants to dump her Lexus. Suggestions for a new SUV?

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Jesda
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The Lexus GX470 she bought new in 2006 has been unimpressive. It's narrow and awkward, the side-folding third row seats occupy cargo space, the side-opening rear hatch is terribly impractical especially on windy days or when parallel parked, the Mark Levinson sound system from that era is bland (and likes to choose its own volume as if a ghost is playing with the knob -- dealer cant figure it out) and it's riddled with strange electrical glitches. The navigation system is terribly dated, even when it was new.

The creamy ride, mostly high quality interior, and ultra-refined V8 are its saving graces. It has 91,000 miles now with a trade-in value of $20k-$23k.


IMPORTANT CRITERIA:

SUV with AWD or 4WD and ample cargo space with the second row up.
Luxury badge.
Rear seat entertainment.
Three rows of seating.
Reasonably attractive.
V8 engine strongly preferred.
Dependability.
Bigger is better.
Brand new, no CPO or used. Demo models and 2011 leftovers are okay.
Under $70k


NOT SO IMPORTANT:

Fuel economy -- Why would you buy a luxury car if you were a miser? Duh.



WHAT HAS BEEN RULED OUT:

Jeep Grand Cherokee -- Its awesome inside and out, but she doesn't trust Chrysler.

Mercedes ML -- Too small for the price.

Infiniti FX50 -- That second-gen face looks like a hideous deep sea creature. Years ago she considered a first-gen FX45 but the cargo space was too small for child strollers and everything else she lugs around town, and the same is true of the FX50.

Cadillac Escalade -- She's interested, but I know she'll dislike the cheap interior. It has the look and prestige she wants but lacks refinement, and that transmission is a turd. It would be a contender if she was into leasing, but she intends to pay cash and keep whatever she buys for 200,000 miles.

Audi Q7 -- Audi no longer offers a V8 in the Q. She doesn't trust Audi anyway.

Volkswagen Touareg -- That whole trust/reliability problem, and the badge.

Lexus GX460 and LX460 -- Ugly as sin. Interiors got noticeably worse with the new generation. Toyota apparently stopped giving a s***. The outstanding Lexus service experience doesn't make up for these rolling abortions.

Porsche Cayenne -- No third row. Smallish cargo space. Costs an arm and a leg for a V8 engine.

Lincoln Navigator -- The Lincoln dealers around here are terrible. The current generation's exterior styling looks as if a Ford Expedition got the Vatozone treatment.

Land Rover/Range Rover -- Style and prestige are high. Reliability is seriously lacking.



CONTENDERS SO FAR:

Acura MDX -- She's owned two first-gen MDXes; one was excellent (wrecked by some guy in a Saab) and the other was poorly made. If I can convince her that a 300hp 3.7L V6 is enough, its by far the best bang for the buck. That nasty silver beak is a bit of a problem. Also, no V6 engine, even as good as Honda designs them, is going to sound or feel like any V8. The local dealer Acura dealer offers excellent service, though the brand itself is lacking in prestige.

Mercedes GL450 -- Expensive, but sharp looking with a beautiful interior. Can be had with rear entertainment and a V8 for a hair under $70k, making it a bit expensive. Reliability is a question mark.

BMW X5 -- Quite expensive with a V8, but if she could settle for a twin turbo six, it would be the nicest driver of the bunch.

Infiniti QX56 -- It looks better in person especially in black (to hide the awful bulges), but overall, its spectacularly ugly. Outstanding interior, gobs of technology, 400hp V8, and arguably the best bang for the buck out there. Did I mention how f**king ugly it is? Holy hell, was Infiniti serious?





Any other ideas?


The second-generation Cadillac SRX is too small and doesn't *appear* to offer a rear entertainment system for 2011, nor does it have a V8. The first-generation SRX with the Northstar 4.6 and revised 07+ interior would have probably been the perfect car for her, but GM decided it wasn't appealing enough to the lip gloss crowd so they replaced it with the rolling equivalent of a woman's shoe.


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The MDX would be my first choice by far. I had steered my former boss to one and he loved it. Since your mom owned one, she should recall the comfort, space, and ample power with the V6. They have a good reputation for reliability so it;s surprising he had problems with one.

One not on your list she might consider:

Toyota Sequoia: Although it does not have a luxury badge (but is one of your favorite brands :chuckle: ), this might fit her bill. The top of the line "Limited" version is quite nice and the V8 is torquey. It's a tad bigger than the MDX but it might surprise you. It's also well made and dependable. Certainly worth a look.

An image conscious father of one of my son's friends has owned a few X5's including a current 2010. Extremely nice vehicle. If your mom tends to trade her vehicles before the warranty expires, (as that dad does), it's a very nice choice. But you don't want your mom to be an X5 owner when the it needs repairs after the warranty expires, well, unless she has a strong heart and bank account. Ridiculously expensive to repair. Oh, and the X5 is not his DD. Whenever he's concerned about the area he's driving to, he uses a Tacoma.

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frapjap
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Bubba1 wrote:The MDX would be my first choice by far. I had steered my former boss to one and he loved it. Since your mom owned one, she should recall the comfort, space, and ample power with the V6. They have a good reputation for reliability so it;s surprising he had problems with one.

One not on your list she might consider:

Toyota Sequoia: Although it does not have a luxury badge (but is one of your favorite brands :chuckle: ), this might fit her bill. The top of the line "Limited" version is quite nice and the V8 is torquey. It's a tad bigger than the MDX but it might surprise you. It's also well made and dependable. Certainly worth a look.
+1 for each of those. When I see a Sequoia I think, DAMN THAT THING IS HUGE, WHAT IS IT?

What about a Land Cruiser? They have a hell of an interior (IMO) and a reliable V8.

I'm a big fan of the QX not so much because it has a stunning exterior design, but because of the superb fit and finish inside.

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Volvo XC90? I know it doesn't have a V8, but it seems to meet the other requirements and the price is right, starting at $38,400 for the standard one and $41,200 for the R:

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I'd vote the the Sequoia too though, it's A LOT of SUV for the money.

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frapjap wrote:Image
LOL, well, Jesda did say fuel economy was not an issue...


How 'bout this? It meets most of mom's requirements....

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hannibal
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^ i guess strippers could be considered rear seat entertainment...

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Rex
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CPO Volvo XC90 R, here's 3 great reasons (#'s 2 & 3 are straight from Volvo's web site.

1. Someone else takes the new car depreciation hit.

2. 6-year/100,000-mile exclusionary CPO warranty*
The Volvo factory-backed CPO warranty fully covers every part not specifically excluded: including the replacement or repair of thousands of components, systems and operations. You can also purchase additional coverage equal to 7-years/100,000 miles or 8-years/100,000 miles.

3. NO deductible for CPO warranty visits
That’s right – you won’t pay a dime for service visits covered by the CPO warranty.

I know 2 ladies (on close to your mom's age) that just recently that absolutely love theirs.

If she went with a low mile 2009 CPO, they still offered a V8 and she can extend the CPO to 8yr/100k.

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Jesda
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So far, I think the retired shuttle is the best option. The problem is that its only available as a used vehicle and all of that atmospheric exposure means that the expensive heat-deflecting tiles are due for replacement.

I wish the XC90 still offered the Yamaha V8. I think I'll test drive one anyway.

Why the heck isn't there a Lexus version of the Sequoia? That would be PERFECT.


*cracks knuckles*

Looks like I have a day of test driving ahead of me. I have a feeling the value-priced MDX is going to be the winner here, unless she can stomach the looks of the QX.

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Jesda
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Rex wrote:If she went with a low mile 2009 CPO, they still offered a V8 and she can extend the CPO to 8yr/100k.
Iiiiiiinteresting! That might be too old for her though, but worth considering nonetheless.

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Dittoz7
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Since this has become a pissing contest...

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Rex wrote:1. Someone else takes the new car depreciation hit.
It seems Mom wants it for a status symbol as much as a vehicle, so she would probably prefer to pay the just to have the new car.

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Dittoz7 wrote:Since this has become a pissing contest...

International MXT
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Doesn't meet any of the requirements.

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As much as I dislike the exterior of the 2nd gen QX56, it does do almost everything else very well. Great interior, great chassis, great powertrain...
Jesda wrote:Why the heck isn't there a Lexus version of the Sequoia? That would be PERFECT.
Because there are no more letters to put in front of "X".

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Dittoz7
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frapjap wrote:
Doesn't meet any of the requirements.
Bigger is better? Sooo mine is the best. :gapteeth:

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Rex
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OriginalWheelman wrote:
Rex wrote:1. Someone else takes the new car depreciation hit.
It seems Mom wants it for a status symbol as much as a vehicle, so she would probably prefer to pay the just to have the new car.

Yeah, but there's "like new" XC90's with <25k miles out there for 15% below new and 40k more warranty.

Spend $500 a "make it look new" detail job and you still save $5k and get 40k more piece of mind.

Yes, I'm cheap, that's why I drive used luxury.

Jesda - I looked at the XC90 when I was wagon shopping and couldn't get into a V8 (post issue years) for my budget. They're NICE

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Jesda wrote:Why the heck isn't there a Lexus version of the Sequoia? That would be PERFECT.
De- and rebadge it. Don't tell her. My folks love theirs, and my sister and I had the opportunity to ride in the back of it, and we enjoyed the headphones that came with the car while we watched Top Gear on the DVD. :D

Is the GX the 4Runner? And the LX the Land Cruiser? Have her buy an FJ.

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Jesda
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Thanks everyone for the input, ideas, and suggestions!

After lots of looking and some test driving today, I have to say, I'm really impressed with the ugly-a** QX56. Its slightly less offensive to look at in person, at least in black, and if she can stomach the looks its by far the greatest bang for the buck ever on a luxury SUV.

The overhead-view camera is simply brilliant, making parking a breeze. Ride and handling are reasonably sharp for a house on wheels and the interior is simply exquisite. Infiniti did a very good job of picking out wood trim pieces and isn't ONE hard surface in the entire interior. The sales experience was particularly good. Bob Maher at Bommarito Infiniti in Ellisville MO was an absolute pleasure to deal with.

The Mercedes GL450 was sharp to look at and had a firm, sporty feel and a stout V8, but it was narrow inside and the doors had cheap hard panels that reminded me of the Escalade. The GL also lacked a touch screen, relying on a dated directional keypad to get around the menus. The second row seats were a PAIN to fold forward, requiring an unusually hard pull, after undoing the latch, to get it to flip. My mom spends half her day driving around town, and the monstrous QX is by far a nicer, quieter, and more comfortable place to hang out.

Infiniti already has a strong reputation for mechanical dependability, and the longer warranty coverage is a nice bonus. I'm not sure how I'd feel about my mother putting 100-150k on a Mercedes-Benz.

I'll put together a more thorough review later tonight or this weekend, but so far the QX56 is a winner, big time.

Size is probably going to be a major deciding factor. She already uses every cubic foot of her GX470 for cargo, and anything smaller is going to be counter-productive. This unfortunately rules out the BMW X5 which somehow manages to squeeze in a third row. The X5 and GL have diesel options but again, unless you're a "baller on a budget" [like me] trying to buy them used, who cares how much it costs to fill up?


I stopped to glance at the Acura MDX but didn't drive it. Its spacious inside, decent to look at aside from the beak and very reasonably priced but it doesn't feel like you're getting the deal of the century like you are in the QX.

I stopped at a Cadillac dealer but RAN LIKE HELL as soon as I could. The salesmen at Elco Cadillac are desperate vultures. "HEY! HEY YOU! LET ME GET YOU A CAR! HEY! STOP! WAIT! OH GOD PLEASE DONT LEAVE I OWE MY COKE DEALER A TON OF MONEY!"


Cadillac and Lincoln need to step up their game -- the retail experience ranges from outstanding to god-awful, with too much of the latter.


And of course, she could always just keep her truck and wait a few more years to see what's on the market. Her Lexus is glitchy and she's outgrown it, but it still starts and runs. Maybe the next generation QX will be as nice to look at as it is to drive?

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I would recommend the Cadillac first. Imo, they're the best value for luxury, full-sized, SUVs. They really are nice.

If I was to choose of your list, I think the X5 or Mercedes would be the best. I'm not a big fan of the new Infinitis and I don't really consider Acura a "luxury" car.

Volvo XC90s are GREAT vehicles. They have a nice interior and the reliability is great if you keep up with maintenance. However, I don't see them as a full-sized SUV. They have room in them, but nowhere near that of say an Escalade/Yukon.

Btw, I thought their Lexus had something crazy like 300K miles on it??? :confused:

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AZ89two4Tsx wrote:Btw, I thought their Lexus had something crazy like 300K miles on it??? :confused:
That's a different one, a 2004 LX470 with 330,000 miles (might be 340 now?). There's apparently a few of them serviced at the same Lexus dealer running around the metro area with over 300k. Its a bit bland inside and out but at least you can feel some of the "trucky" engine vibrations through the steering wheel, and the seats are superb. Unfortunately, since its a live axle genuine off-roader, I get vomity when I sit in the second row for too long. Because of that, I no longer ride with the rest of the family on long road trips and vacations, choosing instead to drive behind them in my Seville.

I hated it at first because its a bit cramped inside and looks a little bulbous (I prefer the Land Cruiser's styling), but its earned my respect over the years.

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Have you looked at the Armada? I know you don't get the premium sales experience, but they are quite nice. I like the styling much more than the new QX, although the technology is outdated. You don't get the AMAZING direct injected 5.6, you get the old school VK56 that's been around for forever. Its not bad, but just knowing there is a better version out there (more power, better efficiency) is just lame.

The only other thing I don't like about it is the lack of projector headlights.

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PS let me know if you go Nissan/Infiniti. VPP is in your future.

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Jesda
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PapaSmurf2k3 wrote:Have you looked at the Armada?
The interior is on the cheap side, which would make it feel like a downgrade from the GX. Lexus dealer service is pretty epic, in some ways similar to arriving at a nice hotel.


If it were for me I'd get another 03-06 Navigator or, without the luxury, a nice 4.0L Cherokee.

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PapaSmurf2k3 wrote:PS let me know if you go Nissan/Infiniti. VPP is in your future.

Oooooohhhhh! You're getting a PM.

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Just buy an NV and deck it out with shag carpet and all the other amenities.


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