max boost on forged internals

Information on the naturally-aspirated KA24E and KA24DE engines.
User avatar
WDRacing
Moderator
Posts: 15983
Joined: Mon Nov 25, 2002 2:00 am
Car: 95 240SX, 99 BMW 540i, 01 Chevy Express, 14 Ford Escape
Location: MFFO
Contact:

Post

The mani wouldn't concern me as much as the AR flow like you said. I changed turbines on my HKS mani(log style) and noticed alot of difference in top end flow. What I would do is a good port and polish. Atleast a good hand port and gasket match. I picked up 37hp by hand porting my RB20 head.

What compressor and trim are you using right now?

WD


User avatar
C-Kwik
Moderator
Posts: 8070
Joined: Thu Aug 01, 2002 9:28 pm
Car: 2013 Chevy Volt, 1991 Honda CRX DX

Post

The big advantage to forged internals is that it can withstand more abuse. By abuse, I am referring mostly to detonation. Control detonation and the peak load on the parts will not get so terribly high that it will kill even stock rods. Forged internals can withstand a bit more detonation than stock parts. Though, no internals currently out there can withstand any amount of sustained detonation. Even forged parts.

The choice of turbo can have a large effect here as well. 15 psi on a T25 is vastly different than a T4 from both a power and detonation standpoint. To get the same boost on a T25 as a T4, the T25 will need to keep have higher exhaust manifold pressures and would likely be out of it's efficiency range if boosting at a level the T4 is within it's efficiency island at. With both higher exhaust pressures which requires more power to push the air out of combustion chambers, and higher intake temperatures, detonation is more likely.

I'd say conservitavley, provided you have enough fuel and the right timing, and a well matched turbo, I'd say 20 psi would not be a problem on a KA. The compressive loads on the piston will be spread out through the piston's stroke, so the peak loads would not be twice as high just becasue the motor makes twice the power or sees twice the pressure ratio. Assuming you keep the redline the same, the tensile load on the rods would not increase. I doubt you'll see problems with the ringlands unless you detonate. They aren't that small on the KA.

User avatar
C-Kwik
Moderator
Posts: 8070
Joined: Thu Aug 01, 2002 9:28 pm
Car: 2013 Chevy Volt, 1991 Honda CRX DX

Post

Just an additional note, fuel is of importance here. With lower octane fuels(91) it is progressively harder to control detonation as you increase boost. But assuming all conditions do not lead to detonation, the stock bottom end can probably hold up to some high amounts of boost.

User avatar
WDRacing
Moderator
Posts: 15983
Joined: Mon Nov 25, 2002 2:00 am
Car: 95 240SX, 99 BMW 540i, 01 Chevy Express, 14 Ford Escape
Location: MFFO
Contact:

Post

You know me C-Kwik, I'm all about some alcohol injection.Good post though...

WD

Stuntman240
Posts: 198
Joined: Tue Aug 05, 2003 9:01 am
Car: 91 coupe

Post

stupid question, but deonation is caused in part by heat,no? therefore we use an intercooler. heres my question has anyone tried to use 2 intercoolers to push off detonation to high boost numbers?

Stuntman240
Posts: 198
Joined: Tue Aug 05, 2003 9:01 am
Car: 91 coupe

Post

and dont steal my idea if it is original

User avatar
huguetpj
Posts: 996
Joined: Mon Aug 19, 2002 7:54 am
Car: 93 KAT Coupe

Post

I think getting a single, more efficient or bigger IC would be best. Less of a press drop.

User avatar
C-Kwik
Moderator
Posts: 8070
Joined: Thu Aug 01, 2002 9:28 pm
Car: 2013 Chevy Volt, 1991 Honda CRX DX

Post

Cars like the TT Stealth/3000GT and the 300ZX both came OEM with twin intercoolers. Though it is one I/C per turbo.

A twin I/C system whtehr in parallel or in series would be rather complicated for what should be a simple system. Unless there was no room for a single FMIC, or you wanted to use two SMIC so you don't block air to the radiator, that would be valid. Otherwise it's pointless. When looking at an intercooler, you should keep pressure drop in mind and mass. More mass allows more heat to be absorbed before heatsoak is experienced. Heat dissapation is important, but depends on application. You don't need as much for drag racing or street use. Road track racing may require more since it will have less dead time when you are off boost. Keep in mind, when off boost, the intake air also helps to cool down the I/C.

AND WD, regardless of how you get there - alcohol, nitromethane, water injection, whatever - keep detonation from occurring and your motor will love you. For myself, I can't justify putting more money into gas than reasonably necesary. So I'll build my motor within the confines of the gas that is available to me. There is certainly nothing wrong with alternatives though.

User avatar
WDRacing
Moderator
Posts: 15983
Joined: Mon Nov 25, 2002 2:00 am
Car: 95 240SX, 99 BMW 540i, 01 Chevy Express, 14 Ford Escape
Location: MFFO
Contact:

Post

Yeah, I'll just have the alcohol injection on standby for those high boost situations, or dyno runs to prove the stock block is tougher then most think. I really only plan on 15-17 psi daily.

WD


Return to “KA24E / KA24DE Forum”