matting a Top Hat block with an AMS head?

[sausagelinks98]

Do you see any problems with combing a Top Hat stage 2 crate motor with an AMS built head? I want to buy the Stage 2 crate motor and combine the head later on.

[9sec240]

Why wouldnt you just get everything from AMS seeing as your so close?

There should be no issue with mating the two together.

[sausagelinks98]

well not to like bash u guys since u r an awesome company, great parts, quality, from what I hear service too but then comes price. TopHat gives you new OEM parts, oil pan and a few other things that are extra that you dont offer with ur crate motor, Basically your will be more expensive when I order plus the extras I have or would have to buy like the OEM parts.

[GEO]

^^ I agree, if you wre able to buy a AMS built engine, pistons,rods, studs, bearings, angle job for like $2700-2900. I'd have one right now.

[9sec240]

Thank you for your quick reply. I want your business and will work to figure out how we can earn it.

Just some things to consider: Our KA crate motors have more machine work put into them than ANY other KA crate motor out there. Over the past 4 years, we have gained so much knowledge about the KA that we have used to bring you the best crate motor you can buy. Nobody out there has put as much R&D into the KA as us. Just look at our option list for our crate motors and you can see how far we have gone into the KA. From our fully grooved bearings to oversize head studs and thread-serts, nobody comes close.

Our motors come STANDARD with all oil galleys tapped and sealed with a NPT threaded plug to ensure it never leaks or pops out like a pressed in plug can.

Our motors come STANDARD with the mains align honed. The reason we do this is because we have found that some KA girdles tend to deform when torqued to ARP specs with ARP main studs. If the girdle deforms, it will lead to main bearing failure. We go out of our way to ensure the mains are on size and straight as an arrow.

We ONLY use OEM NISSAN timing components. We would NEVER use cheap aftermarket components that are prone to failure.

Our motors are honed with a torque plate. A torque plate is bolted on when the motor is being honed to final size which ensures that the cylinders are perfectly round when the head is bolted into place. A block that is honed without a torque plate can deform slightly when the head is bolted on causing ring sealing issues.

Our motors come with a COMPLETE gasket kit. You get EVERY gasket you will ever need for your motor.

We would NEVER EVER turn a crank undersize. We ONLY use factory cranks that pass inspection and that can be used at STANDARD size.

From the parts it seems your looking for, it seems that your looking for a motor that can handle quite a bit of HP. Please call me or Chris at the shop and lets discuss your HP goals and the parts required to handle that HP reliably. I promise that we will get the motor right for YOUR goals at the most cost effective price possible. We know what works and what is required to keep a motor together weather its for a mild 300 whp daily driver to a 1000 HP monster.


Modified by 9sec240 at 8:25 PM 2/14/2007

[9sec240]

^^ I agree, if you wre able to buy a AMS built engine, pistons,rods, studs, bearings, angle job for like $2700-2900. I'd have one right now.

We actually had a meeting today to discuss getting more information on the website and online store. I can see how it can be hard to make decisions when not all of the relevant information is available. I know that our motors come with more R&D, machining processes, etc than anybody else but we need to make that more clear to our potential customers.

We also discussed how to better package our products for our customers. How would YOU guys like to see the motors packaged? Keep in mind that we dont have a rebuilt factory rod option like the competition for a reason. Too many people have had issues going that route so we only package motors with upgraded forged rods. Other than that, would you rather have "stages"?

[wa-chiss]

Stages? Yes please.

[Charlie240sxt]

I'd love to see a motor from you guys in the 2.5-3.3k range with block,head and intake that could handle 400whp reliably and be EZ for the avg joe to slap in his car. Also maybe let us pick are CR you guys offer 8.8:1 but what if say i want 9:1 or 8.5:1 i know it not that big of a diff but yea choices are always good. You guys are the **** when it come to the ka and other motors from what i read.

[Chris@AMS]

I'm working on making a good compairison here. Stay tuned.

[GEO]

For about 2.5K, if there was crate engine that able to handle 400RWHP, i'd buy it. Spot on

[Chris@AMS]

That price is unrealistic when using any type of quality components.

[Chris@AMS]

I've updated the description of the crate motor in the cart for those of you that are interested in having some more detail.

http://www.amsperformance.com/...=1042

[myRed240]

I've updated the description of the crate motor in the cart for those of you that are interested in having some more detail.

http://www.amsperformance.com/...=1042

That's a much better description!

I'm with others on price though, $4k is waayy steep. I vote different stages of motors.

[Chris@AMS]

I think it may be a little bit more expensive than the other alternatives that are available.

If you compare others prices, I really don't think we are that far off.

I could offer a bare bones motor, stripped of any upgrades that we find necessary and get the price down, but what is the point?! When you build a motor you build it right, or your build it twice.

I have already had occaisions where someone has bought a competitors motor, or shortblock, or what have you only to have failure issues. I have even heard a horror stories of a certain company not including the actual parts that were invoiced to the customer!

Given these conditions, I think that the price is actually quite fair for a 'bolt in and go' motor, considering the upgrades that we include.

What would you like to see in a motor? I can make them any way you want them. I consider the Crate Motor to be the best way to rebuild a KA.

[Charlie240sxt]

Your propbly right Its propbly one of the best if not THE best crate Ka around. Still 4k plus shipping is alot of money. What about a your bulit block and head without intake mani?? Some like me thinking about getting a after market intake for when i get a bulit motor. Still never said anything about choices in CR i see you guys like the 8.8 but...

EDIT just got off your site it doesn't come with a intake manifold does it??

[sausagelinks98]

CHRIS!!!!, I just called u guys, I asked a few quick questions but drew a blank while trying to think of it all and sounded like a tard. I'm gonna hit u up with an email, I just saw the updated site and this is gonna make me rethink this. I'll talk to u soon.

I'm gonna be coming to u guys for the build since I got jack **** tool so shipping is not gonna be a problem but it would be for the other motor....making me think.

[sausagelinks98]

No valve cover!, well u guys r painting mine cuz I love that wrinkly black color, what is that?

[hannibal]

I met Mike from Top Hat at NOPI 2005. He's a good guy and knows his stuff...

[halnfl]

$4k on a built engine isn't bad at all. I spent about that just on parts. Not to mention they've taken the Ka further than anyone else so they know all the tricks and things to look for when building a reliable crate engine. If you add up the parts included, the machine work, they really aren't charging a whole lot for their expertise.

[9sec240]

Quality machine work is NOT CHEAP. I just got my personal block back from the machine shop and my bill was over $1000. No parts... just machine work.

[NateDogg]

I'm with halnfl.

Just the rods alone are worth $500. Thats down to $3500 right there with just stock rods. Come on guys, if you're going to the trouble to build a motor, at least use parts that will give you some piece of mind when pushing 25psi and hitting the rev limiter at 7000+ rpm.

I for one would never consider using stock rods in a 'built' engine. They've proven to be unreliable above 350whp.

A couple hundred for top shelf machine work and its almost like you're getting a warranty on your engine.

Do it right or do it twice!

[hannibal]

A couple hundred for top shelf machine work and its almost like you're getting a warranty on your engine.

Now that would be a selling point!!!

[epokh]

Now that would be a selling point!!!

Aye, that it would, but it would never happen, and for good reason, you can blow just about anything up with improper tuning. I personally think their crate motor is reasonably priced for what is offered. It's not going to be for everyone, but it is in fact the best of the best! You're not just buying a motor, you're buying a motor built with only top quality parts by people who KNOW the KA. If you think about it from a business standpoint, I can understand why they wouldn't offer "lesser" motors. The result would be countless posts of people trashing the quality because they decided to "cheap out", all the while the guys at AMS would be shaking their head saying "i told you so". Anyone questioning the price needs to reread Ivan's post about what is done to the motor, then go to your local machinist, and get prices(If they even have these capabilities).

Like I said, it's not going to be for everyone, I don't have one, but I started my build before Turbo240 even existed(and I'm poor ), but if you want the assurance that comes with having the best, you're gonna have to pay for it!!

^^^I should do advertisements for you guys!!! ....I'll be expecting my free motor any time now! Seriously, If you've ever dealt with these guys or bought something from them, you know they are top notch!

[Chris@AMS]

Nice post epokh.

If you keep that up I might be forced to send you some free t-shirts.

[fiznat]

Chris or Ivan, would one of you mind commenting on your view of the necessity for a complete rotating assy. balance? I was a little suprised to see that it was an option instead of standard fare. ...Seems to me that a good balance is essential for a high horsepower performance engine, no?

[NateDogg]

To the original poster:

You may want to let AMS know how much the block was bored in order for them to match it up to the head.

[Chris@AMS]

Chris or Ivan, would one of you mind commenting on your view of the necessity for a complete rotating assy. balance? I was a little suprised to see that it was an option instead of standard fare. ...Seems to me that a good balance is essential for a high horsepower performance engine, no?

Complete rotating assembly is just that, the complete rotating assembly. This includes everything that rotates off the crank.

In order for us to do this you would need to send in EVERYTHING that you intend to use with your new motor. The clutch, flywheel, pilot bushing, harmonic balancer etc...

This is above and beyond balancing, not the normal balancing that is completed on every motor that we build.

[jrivera]

I agree that having a Stage I, Stage II, etc. is a great idea.

Easier for those with less knowledge to decide.

[PapaSmurf2k3]

I hope AMS is still around in a couple years when I'm out of college and filtyh rich... I'll probably want to build some sort of monster 240 of epic proportions... BTW Chris, Rich over there hasn't answered my last couple of E-mails. Is he still alive?

[eazye2000]

BTW Chris, Rich over there hasn't answered my last couple of E-mails. Is he still alive?

I would call them man. I've had quite a few e-mails into them and nothing. I called Ivan about 5 minutes ago for some info.

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