Well, I just got a call from the Infiniti dealer and they say I have rod knock in cylinders 1, 3 and 5. They say the damage could have been caused because I was low on oil. Not true, I change my own oil every 3500 miles and I don't drive more than 10,000 miles per year or so. I purchased the car in 2012 at 26K miles and it is now at 84k miles. So in 7 years or so I've drive 58k miles. And now the motor is gone. I have a case opened with Infiniti Consumer Affairs.

I'll post more information as soon as I hear back from ICA.

R

Sorry to hear that T_T
What about buyng a crate motor?

Sorry to hear of the bad news. Keep us updated with Infiniti Corporate's decision.

Btw, where are you located?

I’m hearing this way to often
I’m thinking that there should be a class act law suite
Not sure that the dealers are doing the recall correctly and the recall may not be taking care of all the issues with the motor. I never thought that I would be nervous about owning infinities flagship auto.

We might need to combine our experiences with our cars and see if we can sue them. I hate saying that but it’s true.

Let me know what you guys think.

Andy

Yoda's Master wrote: ↑

Thu Oct 24, 2019 7:36 pm

Sorry to hear that T_T
What about buyng a crate motor?

I thought about that too Yoda. I see a few low miles motor from LKQ for 4G's but I'm not sure it's worth it at this point I'd be throwing good money after bad given the age of the car. Also, who's to say that the next motor won't fail? Infiniti has yet to acknowledge this as a problem, but I'm convinced it is.

Edbwoy, I'm in Maryland. I'll keep you posted on what ICA says - I'm expecting a call today and will let you know what they say. Hopefully they will authorize a motor break-down to get to the issue of what really occurred. I personally feel that my car fell within the "replace" paramaters and the motor was simply not replaced.

Andy,

I have owned every Infiniti flagship. I had 1998 and 2002 Q45's and both were driven spiritedly, same as this M. I put almost 200K on the 2002 Q45 and about 120K on the 98 Q45 until I got rid of them. (The 98 was totalled) Both were still purring like kittens on the last day I had them. Not so much with this M. Dead at 84K miles. I think that everyone with the 5.6 motor (including Titans, QX56, Armadas) should get involved with a class action lawsuit until Infiniti acknowledges there is a problem with the engine design or at least explains that there isn't. We should at least hold them accountable for what we can. I believe the timing chain recall was a stop-gap measure to prolong what was to come which is a lot of failed motors. The "fixes" they provided had no real checks and balances. How many motors were replaced because they fell outside of tolerable limits? How many motors fell outside of the 3mil insertion tool spec and were not replaced? Who knows? We were just handed back working cars with no documented stats. I'm concerned that many cars were repaired outside of the 3mil check and sent on their way, only to fail 2 or 3 years later. At this point I'm just looking for real answers from Infiniti Corp.

I would caution anyone that is having engine tapping noises or the 5th gear acceleration/hesitation issue to call Infiniti and voice your concerns. My car started out with both and now look where I am.

Lastly, Did we ever get an answer to why the car groans for 15 seconds on cold starts? I know the forum collectively said that it was normal, but I don't believe it is and I'd like Infiniti to confirm.

I'm sorry to hear these frequent issues regarding this engine. Seems clear enough that something was not designed properly in the 5.6 engine. The sad bit is that it seems most of these issues are happening after the factory warranty ends. I'm not sure how that might affect a class action because it's likely Nissan / Inifniti will hide behind the warranty expiration. It's definitely worth discussing with a lawyer who specializes in these types of claims. The tricky bit will be getting to the actual root cause and I'm betting it isn't the timing chain alone. It might be like the GM fiasco over those ignition switches. It may take years, but somewhere, there is an admin, an Email, or a confidential report shared only at highest management and once that is found, the cards will fall, and what's left of the Nissan / Inifniti reputation will self-destruct.
I can't help wondering if all the oil burning issues )higher than expected) are a symptom of the poorly designed timing chain?

reggiebrown40 wrote: ↑

Thu Oct 24, 2019 11:40 am

They say the damage could have been caused because I was low on oil. Not true, I change my own oil every 3500 miles and I don't drive more than 10,000 miles per year or so.

How often do you check the oil level? If you change the oil and never pull the dipstick between oil changes, you likely did let the oil level down too low. Just happened to a friend of mine in her Kia Soul. 10,000 mile oil changes. Never checked it once during OCIs. Now at 27,000 miles and just had a new engine installed. Warranty/manufacturer will not cover this, nor should they.

ArmedAviator wrote: ↑

Sat Oct 26, 2019 12:12 pm

reggiebrown40 wrote: ↑

Thu Oct 24, 2019 11:40 am

They say the damage could have been caused because I was low on oil. Not true, I change my own oil every 3500 miles and I don't drive more than 10,000 miles per year or so.

How often do you check the oil level? If you change the oil and never pull the dipstick between oil changes, you likely did let the oil level down too low. Just happened to a friend of mine in her Kia Soul. 10,000 mile oil changes. Never checked it once during OCIs. Now at 27,000 miles and just had a new engine installed. Warranty/manufacturer will not cover this, nor should they.

Yep I hear folks say that they have the oil changed every x number of miles...but never mention about checking in between. These cars can use up to 1 qt every 1200 miles. I witnessed this first hand when I first got my car. Did the first oil change and didn't check it again until 5k later (my oil change frequency) I almost passed out when I drained about half of the 6-5/8 required. I knew it didn't leak, then found out that this was normal for the 5.6.

Also, many folks (including me) bought these cars used. You don't know how the previous owner was about checking the oil, so it's possible that the damage was already done. I know mine was a lease turn in, and the previous owner had it serviced as per the maintenance manual, but I really don't know if she checked the oil in between.

Yeah I'm terrible at checking my oil, but after all of these 5.6 failures I'm going to need to start. I have a 5k OCI myself with Mobil 1 0W-40. Other than my cat. code, no other issues with my car as far as sounds. Just rattles from old age (mostly interior when I'm blastin music).

Not the optimal choice, but what about swapping in a 3.7L motor or maybe the 3.0 Turbo motor?

ArmedAviator wrote: ↑

Sat Oct 26, 2019 12:12 pm

reggiebrown40 wrote: ↑

Thu Oct 24, 2019 11:40 am

They say the damage could have been caused because I was low on oil. Not true, I change my own oil every 3500 miles and I don't drive more than 10,000 miles per year or so.

How often do you check the oil level? If you change the oil and never pull the dipstick between oil changes, you likely did let the oil level down too low. Just happened to a friend of mine in her Kia Soul. 10,000 mile oil changes. Never checked it once during OCIs. Now at 27,000 miles and just had a new engine installed. Warranty/manufacturer will not cover this, nor should they.

During my last oil change I drained more than 5 quarts of oil from the motor. I know this because I fill up my old mobil one containers for recycling. Is 5 quarts too low in your opinion? Also, they didn't pull the pan or engine apart. They just checked the cylinders by pulling the spark plugs to determine which cylinders were bad. I don't think you can make a determination that oil was low until you pull the motor apart and examine it for wear.

Yoda's Master wrote: ↑

Sun Oct 27, 2019 1:36 am

Not the optimal choice, but what about swapping in a 3.7L motor or maybe the 3.0 Turbo motor?

I have the Q60 Red Sport now which is a really powerful V6, but I bought the M because I wanted V8 power. Probably wouldn't convert at this point.

Yoda's Master wrote: ↑

Sun Oct 27, 2019 1:36 am

Not the optimal choice, but what about swapping in a 3.7L motor or maybe the 3.0 Turbo motor?

You'll probably have to swap the whole drive train. The 5.6 final drive ratio is lower so you will probably have to change the rear diff out as well. You'll also need a new y-pipe and maybe mid pipe...not sure if the mid pipes are the same for both motors. Stock mufflers should work. Not sure about the driveshaft. Other stuff like the motor mounts, intakes and filter boxes, ECU, etc. will also have to be changed. By the time you add all that up, it'll probably be cheaper to get another V8.

Hey at least the cats won't be an issue anymore.

Reggie, any furrher updates from the dealer or corporate?

I wasn't quite clear on whether the ball is now in their court or they told you to kick rocks and it's now back to you.

EdBwoy wrote: ↑

Wed Oct 30, 2019 8:02 am

Reggie, any furrher updates from the dealer or corporate?

I wasn't quite clear on whether the ball is now in their court or they told you to kick rocks and it's now back to you.

Edbwoy,

I got a call from the dealership yesterday. Infiniti corporate is offering to pay for the cost of a new motor. The dealership is saying it will cost me 4600 -4900 dollars to install the motor. My wife priced out another dealership install and we've gotten varying prices, from 2600 to 4900. I called Infiniti corporate and asked if I could have the motor installed at another dealership. They said no. This is where we currently stand.

R

If your car is paid off, I'd honestly do it, regardless of cost of one dealer vs another.

$500/mo for a car payment is $6k. But you'll get another 3-4 years easy out of that motor if its rebuilt and a lot longer if it's brand spankin new. If your body is in great condition, you're basically getting a new car for $6k.

That's my $0.02.

Ilya wrote: ↑

Thu Oct 31, 2019 10:37 am

If your car is paid off, I'd honestly do it, regardless of cost of one dealer vs another.

$500/mo for a car payment is $6k. But you'll get another 3-4 years easy out of that motor if its rebuilt and a lot longer if it's brand spankin new. If your body is in great condition, you're basically getting a new car for $6k.

That's my $0.02.

The car is paid off and the body is in great condition. It's also out of warranty so the next repair, big or small, is on me. It was an unexpected surprise when I was told I'd be getting a new engine. It was followed by shock when I was expected to pay 5K towards the repair. My wife and I called a few dealerships in the area and we were quoted install amounts that varied from 2600 - 4900. I'd been given a good-faith replacement by corporate before so I'm not sure why this is offer is exclusive to just this dealership. Sounds like they've made some back room agreement to me.

It's not like getting a new car, unfortunately. it's still a 9 year old car and things will break and there will be no warranty aside from the engine. If this new engine goes up in smoke in 1 year i'd be out 5K. Same thing if tranny, radiator or anything else breaks or fails. But to each his own. I'm not in the habit of throwing good money after bad. If they negotiate the price down I'd consider it, but 5K is too much to ask in my opinion.

R

The new motor itself wouldn't come with any warranty? In that case I retract my statement. I figured the labor and motor itself had some sort of warranty attached...so even if something else failed and was out of pocket for you, the most expensive part of the car would be covered for at least a bit. I guess I was rash to make my assumption, but that certainly does change things.

Ilya wrote: ↑

Thu Oct 31, 2019 2:43 pm

The new motor itself wouldn't come with any warranty? In that case I retract my statement. I figured the labor and motor itself had some sort of warranty attached...so even if something else failed and was out of pocket for you, the most expensive part of the car would be covered for at least a bit. I guess I was rash to make my assumption, but that certainly does change things.

The dealer made no mention of a warranty. I said "aside from the engine" meaning that it would probably be the only thing covered, for a year at least. No harm done, Ilya. Just trying to figure this all out.

On one hand, it's extremely gracious of Corporate to offer you a new engine. And $5,000 seems like a good deal on what would otherwise be a $17k affair.

This all sounds reasonable, until you take into consideration that you haven't done anything wrong that you know of. You shouldn't have to face a $5k penalty for no fault of your own.
We could flip the script and assume Infiniti doesn't feel like they should give a free engine through an incident that wasn't their fault either(yet to be determined). As you said, if they insisted you pay for the labor, it seems fair. Being charged double for this labor seems exorbitant. Unless they are including some sort of deductible?...which should be declared in an itemized bill of sorts.

Who exactly gave this $5k quote for labor; the dealership or corporate?
I'd ask to sit down with the service manager. 18 hours of labor at $140 per hour does not get you anywhere close to $5k. Maybe the cost of supplies and a diagnosis charge? (1 hour tops)
As I see it, this service department stands to make a fair $3,000 in labor if they give you a reasonable quote. If they don't, then they lose that business whether you get the engine or not.

Pardon if I missed this, but do you mind sharing the dealership name?

Ilya wrote: ↑

Thu Oct 31, 2019 2:43 pm

The new motor itself wouldn't come with any warranty? In that case I retract my statement. I figured the labor and motor itself had some sort of warranty attached...so even if something else failed and was out of pocket for you, the most expensive part of the car would be covered for at least a bit. I guess I was rash to make my assumption, but that certainly does change things.

New motor would likely be a remanufactured motor and would only come with 12k/12 month warranty like any other part.

EdBwoy wrote: ↑

Thu Oct 31, 2019 9:45 pm

On one hand, it's extremely gracious of Corporate to offer you a new engine. And $5,000 seems like a good deal on what would otherwise be a $17k affair.

This all sounds reasonable, until you take into consideration that you haven't done anything wrong that you know of. You shouldn't have to face a $5k penalty for no fault of your own.
We could flip the script and assume Infiniti doesn't feel like they should give a free engine through an incident that wasn't their fault either(yet to be determined). As you said, if they insisted you pay for the labor, it seems fair. Being charged double for this labor seems exorbitant. Unless they are including some sort of deductible?...which should be declared in an itemized bill of sorts.

Who exactly gave this $5k quote for labor; the dealership or corporate?
I'd ask to sit down with the service manager. 18 hours of labor at $140 per hour does not get you anywhere close to $5k. Maybe the cost of supplies and a diagnosis charge? (1 hour tops)
As I see it, this service department stands to make a fair $3,000 in labor if they give you a reasonable quote. If they don't, then they lose that business whether you get the engine or not.

Pardon if I missed this, but do you mind sharing the dealership name?

Edbwoy,

You're saying exactly what I have been saying all along. On the surface it looks like a great deal, but if you think about it I would be paying 5K for something that I ultimately do not believe is my fault. Fair is fair though, and I think 3K dollars is a middle ground that all parties should agree to. Infiniti is sending me a new or re-manufactured engine, I'm paying 3K towards the install. I never asked Infiniti for a motor. I actually asked for an engine breakdown so that someone could prove to me that I was wrong and that the engine has no mechanical defects. I suspect that corporate took the EZ way out. If it's ever documented that these motors were designed flawed from the jump, they'd be in serious trouble.

The rates that you are saying (18 hours @ 140) sound similar to the two other dealerships my wife contacted. The dealership that had my car quoted me a flat rate fee of 5K and said it included installation of old parts, fluids, etc. WTF? So, are they saying the other two dealerships will install my motor and not put the connectors back on and pour new fluids in? That service advisor was spewing pure nonsense. The labor rate they are quoting seems unfair given the situation. It also does not line up with rates at there other locations. It's more than evident that this dealerships GM and someone at the corporate office worked something out where they would give the dealership the motor and in return the dealership would agree to purchase more cars. It's the only thing that makes sense. Think about it - what does Infiniti corp - after providing a motor - stand to gain? Me installing the motor at any of their dealerships world wide would not make a difference to them, unless there is something else driving the agreement.

There were no deductions, Edbwoy and I have no idea how they got to that 5K number. Seems like they pulled it out of thin air because there are no hours associated with it. The dealership gave me the quote. I've spoke with the service manager and general manager. All they said was that the deal was exclusive to their location and that the motor will not be distributed to another Infiniti store.

lastly, my wife and I just bought Q60's. Hers is a Luxe, mine a Red Sport. Had I known this is the treatment I would be getting I doubt I would have purchased another infiniti. I've been saying for years I need to try another brand. Next time around I will.

How about simply getting the new engine from them and then listing the car for sale locally with the new engine to be installed by the new owner at their own cost. Would be the proverbial "mechanic's special".

The rules of their deal were specific to me. If I sold it they would rescind the offer, which I believe they now have. No regrets, I will just get rid of the car in a few weeks.

That sucks so bad.

My brother has a catastrophic engine failure on good 911 with 30000 miles. No warranty due to age of the vehicle.

He hired a lawyer and got Porsche to pay 80% of the repair.

So it might be worth giving that a try if you know someone.

Good luck
I'm not impressed with Nissan but I do like there cars. Damn it.