M45 Engine Failure

[steve_elder]

2007 M45 Sport with 12,000 miles (acquired at 9,000 miles).

Driving up a long bridge at 50 mph, bang then loud wap wap wap and loss of most engine power. No idiot light comes on, limp down far side of bridge try to coast to Infiniti dealer less than 1 mi away. Temp steady, engine losing almost all power. Engine stops, won't restart or even turn over. Oil change by dealer at 10,500 mi. Noticed rapid rise of temp gauge after shut off, not before. Still no engine light or any idiot light. dealer thinks engine is blown / siezed.

How can this be - now the onus appears to be on me to prove that the thing had some oil changes before I bought it, or I guess I just pay for a $15,000 new engine. A smooth runner everything was fine before that.

Any thoughts ? I personally find it incredible that we're all annoyed by those "check engine lights" when nothing seems to be wrong, then when something catastrophic happens, there's no light or software that says "turn the car off fast or else"

VIN= JNKBY01EX7M402525 in case anyone with Carfax access might shed some light.

Appreciate all views here, or: [email protected]

Signed,Pissed

[SteveTheTech]

Hey there Steve, Welcome to NICO!

I do not know what may have happened, there are very few problems with the newer engines. A mechanical failure may very well not cause a check engine light to come on a sensor failure is not going to cause that. I am sorry to hear that your M died, if you car is under warranty and there are records of previous oil changes you should be straight.

I can understand your frustration, you need to remember that it is still a machine a very expensive machine and sometimes things happen. They are few and far between when it comes to large things like this. Such is life though and sh*t happens. This is the reason you have a warranty.

Did you buy the car from the dealer?

[sijoko]

Hmmm........what are the chances that this is an oil-related issue?

[SteveTheTech]

Consumption is not a huge issue if the vehicle is properly maintained.

[steve_elder]

Thanks for the thoughts.

The car was bought from a third party dealer at 8850 miles.

The dealer here has confirmed that there is catastrophic engine failure, it will not move either direction. I suspect broken connecting rod or wrist pin, it ran for a bit after hearing the nasty sound, so it can't be a broken timing chain. Dealer not allowed to tear down and repair, just remove and send to Japan.

Anyway, engine shot, (oil was perfect), they are replacing the engine. The bad news is that there is not one engine in North America, they are back ordered from Japan - 3 weeks to 3 months is the estimate, nice. Now we are arguing if I should get a loaner, I am in Canada and this car came from New York, so the warranty responsibility finger pointing has predictably begun.

New York lemon law makes provision for eligibility if out of service more than 30 days in 24 months, so that might be an option given that in 11,000 miles the RF wheel bearing failed, LR window stopped working , as did the voice recog , the NAV system, and the Video system.

Congrats on a good forum - I find it very interesting reading.

Steve

[Q45tech]

What was it doing at a 3rd party dealer in US with only 8500 miles? Excellant US cars are all snapped up by Infiniti dealers..........find one somewhere else and you must research WHY?Check VIN in US for any special problems.

With these lighter weight/duty engines all it takes is missing one 90 day oil change or running a few quarts low. Damage cannot be cured after the fact.

[steve_elder]

Thanks for the comments -

Oil was fine. That is not the cause according to delaer and also Infiniti tech support. Even if an oil change was missed in the first 8800 miles (and it was not) I do not think damage would occur, it's not an on or off thing.I speculate that the car was either repo'd or lease terminated for relocation or otherwise. I am trying to contact orig owner for info, orid dealer says it left the state shortly after the sale.

In an effort avoid this type od thing I did have the vehicle inspected at the Infiniti Dealer (Bedford) in Cleveland prior to buying it. They reported only one concern, the power steering rack, and they rplaced that under warranty.

Interestingly, in 2003 in my nearly new MuranoSE the transmission failed and was replaced at 12,000 mi, now the engine in my M45 is kaput. But I like the company and the cars, I just think I'm very very unlucky..

[sijoko]

The dealer here has confirmed that there is catastrophic engine failure, it will not move either direction. I suspect broken connecting rod or wrist pin, it ran for a bit after hearing the nasty sound, so it can't be a broken timing chain.

Steve

Whatever the problem was, it doesn't look like it was your fault. Perhaps someone hot dogged the car before you bought it or it could be a defect. The VK engines don't seem to be as reliable as the VH series.

I'm curious as to how the rods on the VK compare to the VH engine. My intuition tells me that they are thinner.

[Q45tech]

Why I use the term: Lighter and Light duty, as this was the first V8 created with modern computer weight reduction software. Everything unnecessary to last after 100k was deleted [downsized] to boost HP.

Ring and bearing friction, piston skirts, rods, crank, bearings, girdle, floating liners, bucket lifters.

Same with transmission they saved 45 pounds and added a gear..................tissue paper everwhere.

Same technology used on V6 and we are on redesign number 4 now for G35/37.

When you look at new G37 you will see many heavy duty things have been brought back

[SteveTheTech]

They may have changed the internal components I am really not sure I don't have the newer manuals at home, I have seen good reliability with the VH and have only replaced one M45 motor.

On the bright side whatever happened was in the past and now you will have a brand new motor that you can perform proper maintenance on from day one. It's perfect you get the benefit of a new car with a brand new motor. Score one for you.

[qship96]

Why I use the term: Lighter and Light duty, as this was the first V8 created with modern computer weight reduction software. Everything unnecessary to last after 100k was deleted [downsized] to boost HP.

Ring and bearing friction, piston skirts, rods, crank, bearings, girdle, floating liners, bucket lifters.

Same with transmission they saved 45 pounds and added a gear..................tissue paper everwhere.

Same technology used on V6 and we are on redesign number 4 now for G35/37.

When you look at new G37 you will see many heavy duty things have been brought back

Wow....sounds like an entire generation of G,M,Q,FX to avoid when it comes time to retire the old 96Q!

[Carl H]

the vq35de engine sucks...it has since it was fitted in early 02-03...same with the qr25, bleh.in an effort to save money nissan in advertently created a problem which costs more to replace and repair.

[SteveTheTech]

There really not that bad, for normal use they work fine and there are many people that drive the hell out of them and they still stand up. If they are maintained properly there should not be an issue. The problem described by the OP is a rare incident and is not in any way common, since the long block in it's entirety has been called back that's a good sign you have a rare incident.

All new engines have to be designed differently due to new federal mandates for emission standards and some things have to be changed to make them practical.

The V6 and V8s that are from Japan are of significantly higher quality and the QR should not even be compared to the VQ. I have several customers with Qs and Ms that are driven in traffic and have in excess of 130K and still run fine and have no consumption issues.

[Q45tech]

Remember I was comparing how they might hold up to 300k [15 years] not just broken in at 130k and 6 years.

[SteveTheTech]

True it will be interesting to see what the effects of time and age have on them.

[qship96]

Remember I was comparing how they might hold up to 300k [15 years] not just broken in at 130k and 6 years.

Exactly! Why purchase an expensive {$50K++} sedan if it wont give you 250K+ miles of reliable, durable service? Might as well just buy a Maxima/Accord/etc and drive and dump every 100K.

[Infinitiguy19]

Some do it to attract attention and look good others do it because of the nice technology the newer cars have that make it easier and safer for them to drive.

[maxnix]

You might go to another dealer like the selling one and have them pull the Infininti Dealer performed service history. Should reveal everything, especially OCI.

As a last resort, Infiniti Customer Service will read it to you over the phone.

[steve_elder]

Thanks to all who have chipped in.

The service history is unrevealing. The car sits in the lot awaiting the engine - back ordered from Japan. I'll be going in this week for a look up from the bottom end if they'll let me. I hear there are plenty chunks metal in the oil now.

No loaner car approved from Infiniti in Canada where car is, or Infinti USA where it was sold. No worries I'll rent one on my tab, maybe even an Infinti. Beware those of you who have the gall to register an Infinti in another country. There might be a lesson in customer service somewhere in here.....

But, I do like the idea of a brand new engine now, and not one after the warranty expries. FYI $20k tax in. Longer than 30 days in the shop might even qualify it for Lemon or Magnuson / Moss provisions according to the experts.

For those that might think I probably must have whipped this car till the engine blew, I'm flattered, but alas I am a 53 yr old business man with no speeding tickets in the last forever. I counted up the 15 cars I have owned and this is a first. I fly, so I guess I'll take the engine failure on the ground appreciatively, before the one in the air hits.

I'm informed that we'll never know what happened - ie no report from Japan - probably for the best.

It's not all bad - My 2004 sweet ride Ford Sport Trac keeps chuggin pretty good, and, I get a loaner car for those > 2 hours serious service issues, like brake pads....

Cheers and thanks for the comments.

Steve