Loose power steering on turns

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areznik
Posts: 115
Joined: Thu Feb 12, 2004 8:05 pm
Car: Infiniti Q45 1994
BMW 335i Couple 2007

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Hey guys,

My Q45 '94 (172K) made me sweat on my drive back home today after I noticed that my steering wheel is almost upside down while the car goes straight. There is no vibration, no pulling to either side and no other unusual symptoms other than the steering wheel position. In the parking lot I played with the steering a bit and the steering wheel is all over the place. I am worried it comes loose and it might not steer when I need it to.

I own this car for 8 years now and never had any problems with steering before (it is also the reason I know nothing about steering too).

What do you think might be the problem here?

Thanks,

Andre.


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Q451990
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My first bit of advice... don't drive the car!

If I were in this position, I would check the u-joint that attaches the steering column to the rack. Also check the power steering rack bushings and the brackets that hold the rack into place. If it's as bad as you describe - it should be pretty obvious once you're under there.

Heath

areznik
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Joined: Thu Feb 12, 2004 8:05 pm
Car: Infiniti Q45 1994
BMW 335i Couple 2007

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Thanks Heath. Is it visible from underneath or do I need to take something off to be able to see it? Do you have by any chance a picture of it?

Thanks,

Andre.

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Q451990
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You'd have to take your road shield off and have the car either on a lift or securely on jack stands before you could get to them.

I don't have pictures... you would want to review the FSM (factory service manual) for drawings. http://www.nicoclub.com/FSM/

Heath

areznik
Posts: 115
Joined: Thu Feb 12, 2004 8:05 pm
Car: Infiniti Q45 1994
BMW 335i Couple 2007

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Local Goodyear shop checked it for free and showed me that the boot that covers the rack is completely torn (yeah, the dust must have damaged the rack plus the PS leak). The estimated labor at $285 + $65 for alignment, and remanufactured rack and pinion assembly at $550. So its about $900.

Is it reasonable?

They could not tell me specifically what parts are bad, and approached it by replacing the whole assembly (I checked at everythinginfiniti its about $1,200). I could not tell either just by looking at the torn boot what parts are bad. Even though I don't the like the approach of replacing everything when some good parts are going to be swapped I don't know whether there is any other way.

Any thoughts?

Thanks,

Andre.


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Q451990
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The FSM shows a rebuild procedure for the rack, as well as the alternator, transmission, differential, etc - but in practice these things are rarely rebuilt - at least in the field. Some parts are rebuilt in a factory setting where the reliability is much better.

Keep in mind that all remanufactured parts are not the same. Some replace just what's leaking, but leave other worn parts - while others tend to be better. I can remember someone mentioning a good rebuilt rack other than OEM, but I don't recall the name. I'll do some searching and post it here if I can find it.

What you're describing is not just a worn seal somewhere... it's a major failure of the rack. I sure hope you're not driving the car.

Heath

areznik
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Joined: Thu Feb 12, 2004 8:05 pm
Car: Infiniti Q45 1994
BMW 335i Couple 2007

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Thanks Heath.

They did not mention the brand of remanufactured rack but they said they will pay $118 for my old one. Hate to give my stuff away knowing that some of it is good .

The last 4 years on my Q were fantastic (going from 130K to 173K) putting nothing into the car other than changing fluids (well except for a window motor that just died). When the guy from Goodyear showed me under the car I saw all sorts of leaks (oil, tranny). I really like doing the engine from the top (injectors, hoses, belts) but I just don't enjoy doing anything under car (maybe because I don't lift it high enough). I would love to have it lifted when I can stand under and do the work (I envy those mechanics that have such a nice view under car).

Do you put yours on the jacks and just squeeze yourself under it?

Thanks,

Andre.

maxnix
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Car: 1995 Infiniti Q45
1995 Infiniti Q45t
2000 Infiniti Q45

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areznik wrote:The estimated labor at $285 + $65 for alignment, and remanufactured rack and pinion assembly at $550. So its about $900.

Is it reasonable?
My Mavic rebuilt rack cost about $385 1.5 years and 15k miles ago. Works fine.

Labor should be about 2-2.5 hours. You will need new rack bushings. I like the SPL poly ones. Use M1 or other synthetic ATF.

Personally, I would avoid all Goodyear and Firestone franchisee stores and go to a good ASE who would perform the work himself. Check the Tire rack recommended alignment shops in your area, visit the best 3 by customer ratings then choose one based on interviews. Hunter alignment and balancing machines should be evident.

areznik
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Joined: Thu Feb 12, 2004 8:05 pm
Car: Infiniti Q45 1994
BMW 335i Couple 2007

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Thanks for the advice.

I just googled for Mavic and could not find any rack and pinion products by them. Where did buy yours from?

I just bought 2.5 ton jack and lifted my Q high enough to get underneath.

Is it pretty easy to take the rack off the car? I see two bolts that hold the O bushings on each side and the tie rods that seems to be easy to take of. Is there anything else to pay attention to or is it pretty much it?

I figured if I take it of the car it will be much easier to disassemble the whole assembly to determine the bad parts.

Thanks again,

Andre.
Modified by areznik at 9:05 PM 3/21/2010

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Q451990
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I hope you're using jack stands with your new jack!
areznik wrote:I figured if I take it of the car it will be much easier to disassemble the whole assembly to determine the bad parts.
If the parts are even available separately. I'd check with Infiniti of Scottsdale before I started this plan. You'd be the first member I can recall to rebuild a rack.

I still wonder if your issues aren't in the u-joint that connects the rack to the steering column. The full r&r instructions should be in the factory service manual.

Heath

areznik
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Joined: Thu Feb 12, 2004 8:05 pm
Car: Infiniti Q45 1994
BMW 335i Couple 2007

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After lifting the car high enough and getting over the "fear" of laying under it I think it is a doable DIY job. All prior jobs (injectors, struts, fuel pump, belts, except for alternator I was doing myself). What I noticed is the side of a bushing on one side is sticking out which I think might give the rack some play. I might go ahead and order the remanufactured one for ~$300 from autopartswarehouse.com (branded Mavel) and once I take mine out I will decide whether just replace the bushings or the whole assembly. If these are just bushings, I will return the rack.

Will try to take some pictures and post them here.

Andre.

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Haitian_King
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I had the same issue with the steering wheel being in a funny position while going straight. I had excessive play in the wheel too. I ended up replacing the entire rack and the UCA's.

Glad to see that you've solved your problem.

maxnix
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Car: 1995 Infiniti Q45
1995 Infiniti Q45t
2000 Infiniti Q45

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Sorry about the misnaming.

http://www.mavalgear.com/

http://www.splparts.com sells the polyurethane bushings for the rack. They are the Z32 ones.

Use M1 in the rack.

A lift is a blessing and I would have it done at a reputable shop as you will get nowhere near a decent alignment no matter how careful you are. They make lifts for a reason. Life is too short already.

Know the torque values for the anti-sway bars, rack mount, etc. so you can rattle them off for the tech without having them rely on some data (which they will call AllData).

Q45tech
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Car: 1990 Q45 342,400 miles 22 years ownership with original engine
1995 G20t 5 speed 334,000 miles 16" 2002 wheels - 205/50/16 Sr20ve vvl

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People don't realize that the steering ratio is race car like 2.25> 2.75 Turns L>L, thus the front toe alignment is super critical and a single rotation on the adjustment is a gigantic amount. It blows away the inexperienced alignment expert.

Be sure to have you or your weight equivalent sitting in drivers seat as this drops the leftside by 1/2 x x/143 or 0.63" for me which is ~ 0.5 degrees of camber change plus toe change!

areznik
Posts: 115
Joined: Thu Feb 12, 2004 8:05 pm
Car: Infiniti Q45 1994
BMW 335i Couple 2007

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Ok, so I attempted to do it myself but quickly realized that it is more work than I can handle under the car. Took it to the local shop and for $350 (labor + alignment) it was done. New (reman A1 Carbon) rack and pinion with new bushings. I am was loving my Q even more than before. I drove it today 100 miles and had no problem until later in the evening I noticed my steering wheel does not go back completely to a straight position after making left turn (when the car goes straight). The angle is maybe 10 - 15 degrees off but darn!!! I don't think I am that "lucky" to get a reman rack and pinion with exact same problem as I had before although of course I cannot completely rule that one out either. What might be the problem, steering column? Not being an expert but do you think the bold that holds the steering column in the rack is loose?

It feels like one of those never ending problems ... .

Thanks again,

Andre.

Q45tech
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1995 G20t 5 speed 334,000 miles 16" 2002 wheels - 205/50/16 Sr20ve vvl

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Some of what happens when you don't annually spend $2,000>$2,500* to maintain the vehicle.
* depending on labor rate and oem new parts costs.

Things pile up without you noticing the slow progressive decline.

I'm always replacing something [tie rod ends, tension rods, changing some fluids, belts - yesterday] a never ending adventure every 90 days [depending on mileage].

My honey do list keeps growing, as soon as I fix somethng something else goes.
The trials and tribs of try to maintain as brand new operation.

Don't forget to bank $350 per year for tranny replacement.

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Q451990
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Did they replace the rack's mouting bushings? I can't imagine them not doing so, but if they looked "pretty good" and didn't have a new set on hand it's possible. Beyond that, it's time to look for more suspension slop...

Heath

areznik
Posts: 115
Joined: Thu Feb 12, 2004 8:05 pm
Car: Infiniti Q45 1994
BMW 335i Couple 2007

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Unbelievable. I bought new bushings and left in the trunk with rack and pinion and told the mechanic that the part with bushings in the trunk. I could not even think they forgot to put new bushings. Heath, after reading your post I went to the car, opened the trunk to find out my new bushings are still there. I am speechless.

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Q451990
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Car: 1990 Q45 - 118K, 2022 Toyota 4 Runner, 2004 Frontier M/T - 108K, 2012 Xterra (Mom's), 2023 Rogue (Inlaws)
Location: Columbia, SC
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Well, at least we have a good idea of the problem's source... and the good news is that they're not that difficult to replace. A tech. with a lift should be able to get it done in a half hour or so. I've done it on jack stands... just have to pull the u-joint that connects the rack to the steering column, and then unbolt the two brackets. Stories like this are the reason do as much as possible at home.

Heath


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