2008 Rogue - 145,000 miles 4 cyl, automatic.

My daughter's Rogue has a leak on the driveway.
When she came home, I looked and see there is a leak where the passenger CV axle goes into the transmission. I think I see a bit of rubber protruding from where the axle goes in. This is the long axle. It just started yesterday. I checked the transmission level and it is about 7/8 full and clean color.

So how big of a job is this?
Is it likely to be the seal at the CV axle insert point? Or is there another seal inside the transmission?

If it is the seal (similar to crankshaft seal), can I just disconnect the knuckle from the struts and that will give me room to pull the CV axle out?
Also I am thinking, I might as well replace the CV axle while at it. With it having 140,000 miles- is this worth it?
Last Summer I replaced both sides... the wheel bearings, Control Arms, Inner and outer tierods and I'd like avoid disconnecting any of the grease and ball joints.

Any suggestions? I am mainly concerned about the seal and how hard it is to replace.

The seals aren't difficult, they're pretty standard stuff once you get the axle out. The easiest method is to take the strut bolts out and detach the tie rod end, that gives you more than enough slop to remove the axle. The problem on gen1's is the carrier bearing. They're seized at least half the time, and taking the whole mount loose isn't a good option because there's a location pin that fits into the engine block and prevents moving it far enough to do any good. On an old car that's never had the axle replaced, I recommend you hit the bearing repeatedly with PB Blaster and drive the car afterward for a number of weeks before attempting removal. That will go a long way to making sure you don't need an act of congress to release the bearing.

WOW.. glad you told me this about the carrier bearing. I didn't even see this.

I edited this since I watched a YouTube video...



I guess the issue you were talking about is at 9:00 minutes. Makes sense to spray penetrating oil on the bearing maybe every other day for a week or so.

Now a few questions..

1) I guess I might as well get a new CV axle, so everything on that side is new (other than the knuckle and strut).
2) If I put the new CV axle in and the bearing will not go in, I guess i could take a wire brush on a drill and try to clean the hole out?
3) I noticed the guy disconnected the ball joint. I don't want to do this since the ball joint is new. If I carefully make a mark on the knuckle and strut, then put it back together "exactly" on the line, I could get by without having to get alignment done?
4) Some manuals say to never reuse the wheel-bearing nut. The nut I put on is 9 months old. So it's probably OK to reuse it?

5) If worse comes to worse and I break that bracket where the carrier bearing goes, is this a BIG problem?

Rockhoundrob wrote: ↑

Tue Apr 26, 2022 7:56 am

1) I guess I might as well get a new CV axle, so everything on that side is new (other than the knuckle and strut).

On a 14 year old car, yes, definitely.

Rockhoundrob wrote: ↑

Tue Apr 26, 2022 7:56 am

2) If I put the new CV axle in and the bearing will not go in, I guess i could take a wire brush on a drill and try to clean the hole out?

Yep, that should work fine. Don't use anything like emory or sandpaper that might leave abrasives behind. If there's a lot of white corrosion in the bore, CLR will help.

Rockhoundrob wrote: ↑

Tue Apr 26, 2022 7:56 am

3) I noticed the guy disconnected the ball joint. I don't want to do this since the ball joint is new. If I carefully make a mark on the knuckle and strut, then put it back together "exactly" on the line, I could get by without having to get alignment done?

I never take the BJ loose, I do it by popping the tie-rod end and removing the bolts that hold the base of the strut. Unless someone installed eccentric camber adjusters on your struts, an alignment shouldn't be necessary.

Rockhoundrob wrote: ↑

Tue Apr 26, 2022 7:56 am

4) some manuals say to never reuse the wheel-bearing nut. The nut I put on is 9 months old. So it's probably OK to reuse it?

I've never seen any problems with re-use as long as the threads are in good shape.

Rockhoundrob wrote: ↑

Tue Apr 26, 2022 7:56 am

5) if worse comes to worse and I break that bracket where the carrier bearing goes, is this a BIG problem?

The bracket is a b%tch to get out because of space and that locator stud. You might need to pop the engine mounts or subframe loose and maneuver the engine to replace it, so I'd try real hard not to damage it.

Thank you VERY much for the info VStar.
I'll start on the PB blaster tonight, order the parts from Rockauto... and HOPEFULLY start on it next weekend.

And is 3-4 hours a safe estimate of how long it will take? (IF the carrier bearing comes out after 10-15 mins of work)

Yah, without a lift and using hand tools I'd say 4 is a safe bet.

Here I am trying to be prepared for the worse and hope for the best...

I went under the car last night and sprayed penetrating oil on the carried bearing.
Will do that again Saturday, and then again next week. Then again the night before I start.
I see the carrier bearing bracket, but cannot see the location pin.

I found this video about removing the bracket. At 1:50... why did the guy have to cut the bracket?
Why not cut the axle between the carrier bearing and the transmission.
Is the difficulty from having to deal with the axle still in there? I know i can separate the outer part of the axle by cutting the middle boot.

I see he didn't have any issue putting the new bracket in.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=76pz3PM8HCg&t=192s

Cutting the bracket gives you enough room to remove the bracket and axle together. If you notice, he had to swing the new bracket past 45 deg to get it in place, and that's impossible with the axle attached. If it is seized and a sledge or air hammer won't break it loose, cutting the bracket is the next best option. I suppose you could cut the axle on both sides, but that's probably extra work.

OK.. So what happens if I just try hitting the axle remover harder and harder. Will the bracket finally break where the carrier bearing is stuck?
And I have nothing to lose, but to replace the bracket?

The bracket could break, yah. More likely you'll just get lots of beater marks and not much else, those brackets are stout. If you do need to cut, it looks to me like using an angle grinder on the thin portion around the bearing first to take out the axle will be easier than a sawzall. With the axle out, maneuvering to cut the rest of the bracket will be a lot easier no matter what cutter you use.

OK.. Thank you VERY much for your input!

I am more comfortable giving this a try next weekend.

You're most welcome. Keep us posted!

I got a Chilton Manual, so I could do other maintenance, but in this case mainly to get the torque specs for putting everything back together.

However, it says to put multi-purpose grease on the CV seal before I put the CV axle into the transmission.
Is this right? I would have put transmission fluid on the seal (similar to putting oil on the oil filter gasket).

Also, do I need to put anything on the spline of the CV axle that goes into the transmission?

Tranny fluid is preferred, but a neutral lube like Vaseline or pure mineral oil is also fine. I dunno about axle grease on a CVT seal, I'd be leery of that. FYI, when in doubt, Vaseline and mineral oil are both safe for just about every form of seal and fluid known to mankind. You can lube the tranny splines with CVT fluid if desired, but it isn't usually necessary since the female splines will already be soaked. We do use gray Moly Grease on the hub end splines.

I have all the parts ready and even ordered a CV bearing bracket just in case.

I have the CV axle and seal. However when I was testing the fit, the seal opening was about 1/8th " bigger than the diameter of the axel.
Is this right? how does it seal the trans fluid inside?

There are two seals on those, a dust seal for the axle and a fluid seal for the tranny. Chances are you got the wrong one. I think the one you want is 38342-3VX0B, it's in the transmission case drawing and not the axle drawing.

Took the seal back and it turns out they gave me a driveshaft seal and not the CV axle seal.
Thanks for the part #. They cross referenced it and got the right part. I checked and the seal fits the CV axle like I expect it should.

Will start on the CV axle/seal replacement this Thursday. I am really hoping the Bearing will come out without it being a BIG issue).
That's my main concern. Already sprayed penetrating oil last Tuesday, Friday, last night. and will spray again on Weds night.

Well, got the work done.
The CV axle was not hard to pull out at all, but I had a hard time putting the new seal in.
When I first put the seal in, it was at a little angle like 1/16th of an inch.
I pulled this one out and bought a new one and put the new one in and it was also at 1/16th angle, but on the opposite side. So I took a screwdriver and carefully tapped it in until it was even.

Now I have 2 questions...

1) The seal... is the rubber supposed to be even with the outer surface of the transmission? We kept tapping until it stopped. OR is the rubber supposed to protrude a bit?
The rubber I am talking about is more of a dust shield and not the seal on the Axle.

2) When I put the CV axle in, it seems fine and drives fine, but is there a 1/16th gap between the carriage bearing bracket and the C-shaped brace that holds the carriage bearing in place.
I would almost assume the bearing would fit and the brace to hold the carriage bearing in place would be flush with the carriage bearing bracket.
I did torque everything to spec... something like 35 ft lbs on the 2 bolts.

It sounds like you seated the seal okay, but next time, without a seal driver, the next best tool for seating seals is a socket slightly smaller than the OD of the seal. That lets you drive it straight to the bottom with no risk of distorting the metal shell. If it springs a leak in the future, it will most likely be because driving it in off center with the screwdriver slightly distorted it. Chances are it will be okay, but I'd keep an eye on it for awhile. To answer the rest of the question, yes, it should go in until it seats fully. Most (although not all) seals are set up that way, designed to be driven until they seat flat against the housing. The only time you don't necessarily want to do that is on an old shaft which has developed a groove from the seal riding in the same spot for years. In that instance driving it in square but not to the bottom can salvage some extra use out of the worn shaft.

I'm not sure exactly what you mean about the bracket, maybe you could post a pic?

I did use a seal driver, but it was short and I had to get a 4 foot pipe to insert the seal driver into so it is like a seal driver with a 4 foot extension.
Guess next time, I'll use the socket and see how it does.

Hard to get a good picture of the carrier brakcet, but this video shows what is expected.
The guy said "flush" with the bracket.

Go to about 14:30 mins
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9TQqsycArFY&t=718s

maybe to clarify, when you put that Clamp on the bracket and install those 2 bolts, there is a 1/16th in gap on that clamp

If you mean the bearing retainer that he installs at 15:04, then if it isn't flush it means the bearing didn't seat all the way into the bracket. If the bearing isn't fully inserted then the retainer won't be flush either. That isn't good, if the bearing moves it will cause the retainer to loosen and the bolts may back out. It shouldn't hurt anything as long as the bearing doesn't move, so if it won't seat further, stick a couple of washers the right thickness to fill the gap between the retainer and bracket so the screws are torqued down on something solid and not an air gap.

OK, I'll take another look this weekend and check whats going on.
I know when I torqued the 2 bolts, it seemed to stop instantly to torque. It didn't bend the retainer.

As long as there's no air gap under the screw heads and the retainer isn't bending, that's "flush" and no worries.

GRRRR... There is still a leak, but not as bad. Before there would be a wet stain about 16" by 8" on the driveway overnight.
Now there is a wet stain that is about 4" by 4". I looked again and it seems to still be coming from that seal.

1) There is a space between the bearing bracket and the retainer because the width of the bracket where the bolt goes is 1/16" thicker than the rest of the bracket.
When the guy in the video said flush, I took it to mean the bearing needs to be even EVEN with the surface of the bracket, but it was "even" with the extra width where the 2 bolts go for the retainer. Maybe flush to him, really means the bearing need to be seated properly 2) Is putting the seal in pretty straight forward? No tricks or something I have to be aware of?
When I tapped the seal in, I keep tapping until it stopped. But then it was offset by 1/16th of an inch (it wasn't flush with the surface). I took the first one out and put a new one in and it did the same thing, but on the opposite side. So I took a big screwdriver and tapped the outer part of the seal that was sticking out 1/16th inch, until it was flush and even with the outer part of the transmission opening. See where I hit the seal in between the rubber grooves. Is it possible that by using a screwdriver, I kinked the metal of the seal and therefore isn't sealing properly? The rubber is coating the metal on the outside, so the screwdriver was actually hitting the rubber, and the metal was under the rubber.

I am thinking about giving it one more try. Any suggestions?
If the new seal isn't flush ( still sticks out 1/6th inch on one side), I am thinking about using a small socket like like 13mm and hit that side that is 1/16th inch out.
There is no place to put a hammer in there, so I have been using a 3 foot pipe and put the seal driver in the pipe and a friend would hammer the pipe.
I guess the protruding rubber can take a couple of hits?
The reason I didn't use a large socket the first time was because I was afraid of damaging the 2 rubber ridges

Rockhoundrob wrote: ↑

Mon May 09, 2022 8:07 am

Is it possible that by using a screwdriver, I kinked the metal of the seal and therefore isn't sealing properly? The rubber is coating the metal on the outside, so the screwdriver was actually hitting the rubber, and the metal was under the rubber.

Basically the seal lip needs to be perfectly perpendicular to the axle shaft. When it's "off" the seal forms an oval and it's sweeping a larger area than it should. The former will reduce the static sealing pressure exerted by the seal and the latter will lead to seepage when the shaft is turning, plus wear out the seal quickly. So a ka-ka angle is bad on multiple counts. Most parts stores can rent you a seal driver if you don't want to buy one (a new set from Harbor Freight is $40, and there are used ones on eBay for as little as $20). The advantage to using a driver is that if you suspect the seat isn't straight or it's giving you seating problems, you can use a driver that's larger than the opening and knock the seal down level with the outside of the opening, which still gives you perpendicularity. It just rides the shaft in a slightly different spot. That's what you do with an old shaft when you want to relocate the lips of a new seal off a groove in the shaft. It works fine, and that might be your best bet if the seal insists on seating wrong.

I did use a seal driver from Autozone and twice it was offset by 1/16th inch.
When I used a screwdriver to tap that one side still protruding the 2nd time, I guess I kinked the metal part a bit and maybe didn't seal well against the opening in the transmission?

Now that I think about it, maybe the handle on the seal driver was offset? I know I was watching more careful the 2nd time when putting the seal in.
Never know what the previous person did to the tool.

1) If I try again and it is offset again, what should l I do next? .... I plan to rent a seal driver from a different store, just in case.
2) Am I supposed to keep tapping until the seal stops moving? In other words, is there something in the opening that will stop the seal and prevent it from going in too far?

There should be a stop machined into the bottom of the hole, so yes, generally you just tap it till it won't move any further. But like I said, you can also use an oversize driver and tap the seal down flat with the outside perimeter of the hole instead of driving it all the way in to the stop. If there's a problem in the seat, that will work around it. You'll still get a perpendicular orientation.

That makes sense, but I am afraid to tap the outer perimeter because of the 2 rubber rims protruding towards the CV axle. By tapping the outer perimeter, I may damage the rubber. Also, the rubber is flexible and may cause the seal to offset.
Drawing below is the cross section of the seal.
The red arrows point the the rubber sticking out about 1/4 inch.
This is why I put the screwdriver between the 2 slots of rubber and tapped the seal until it was flush.

The FSM doesn't show a stop. That's not what I recall, but they don't make me sling trannies anymore and my memory may be faulty. You can see what the FSM shows on TM-193:
https://www.nicoclub.com/service-manual ... 8%2FTM.pdf

The rubber on the outside is part of the dust seal and not the shaft seal, so rapping on it gently with a flat seal tool won't hurt anything. It will just compress. Since the seal is a press-fit, some tranny fluid can be used on the outside to help it slide in without getting ka-ka. The main thing is usually to line up straight for the first tap. FYI, Nissan basically calls for a tool that nobody owns or uses, see TM-158.

Thank you for this FSM info!
Now I see I drove the seal in too far and should have stopped at 1/16 inch or so.
I hope there isn't anything rotating in there that the seal is touching and grinding the metal rim on the seal.

My daughter has a AWD Rogue, so I am looking at page 194 and looks like I can skip everything and go straight to step 6.

The diagram shows the seal as #3 RH differential seal.
The Installation shows Dimension A, B, C, but which one is the"differential seal"? It looks like A?

I am starting to lean towards trying again.