klanking noise still present!...

Post by **ka240se** » Thu Sep 18, 2003 8:32 am

after replacing my lefters the klanking noise is still present!!Is there any possiability that my broken motor mount could be the culpret, or possiably my timing is off? after i start my car the klankin noise increases with the revs, and will not idle by itself. any help would be much appreciated, thanks....

Post by **ka240se** » Thu Sep 18, 2003 8:32 am

ok i got the car to idle now (me being me i over looked the idle screw)

Post by **Asleep Altima** » Thu Sep 18, 2003 8:32 am

is it still clanking? im going to be anal here, but what exactly does it sound like? a clank is kinda high pitched, a clunk would be lower pitched and a knock would sound like a muffled, well, knock... its very important to know the different sounds. just guessing right now, but if it increases with the revs and your original guess was lifters, id say that either the oil pump is taking a s*** or the rods are knocking...

Post by **ka240se** » Thu Sep 18, 2003 8:32 am

its more the higher pitched klanking noise. I dont quite think its my rods (hopefully) but i can fell the valves hittin on the valve cover and when i increase the revs the vibration on the cover increases too. For a few second when i first started the car i herd a screach that i kinda thought could be the PS but i thought it could also be the fact that i havnt had oil in my car for about a week and the rockers or some bearing screached for a moment from lack or oil.. other than that im fellin kinda stumped at the moment! if anyone can give me any input on this situation it would be much appreciated. thanks...

Post by **deviousKA** » Thu Sep 18, 2003 8:32 am

your screetch is non-related (ps, alt., ac etc... ). did you replace your lifters with used or new? did you check them? has it done it since the first time you installed them and started the car? a faulty oil pump may have been the reason for your first set of lifters going bad. fix it before you run the car much longer. if you can get a hold of an oil pressure gauge and fitting, hook it up to where the factory oil sender is located (on oil filter extension). if you cant do that, remove your oil pump (your going to have to time the damn thing up again) and check it by filling it with oil, plugging the outlet with your thumb (make sure your spinning it the right way). there should be a decent amount of pressure (you should just be able to overcome with your hand twisting power) if you can hear it leaking by or you are skeptical, disassemble it. inspect the internals of the pump (pits in the drives, chips/debris etc...).

how long have you allowed the car to run? if it clangs, ticks, pops whatever for longer than an hour (breakin for the lifters is running at 1500-2000 rpm for 10-20 min) then you should know if something is wrong

hope this helps

edit, btw: what did the lifters that you took out look like? how many were "solid"? what was the condition of the rockershafts and rocker/lifter bearings? this could also help you determine a problem with your oil pump or oil passages

Post by **ka240se** » Thu Sep 18, 2003 8:32 am

both sets of lifters that i have look fine, very solid without a single sign of cracking chiping or what not. since you mentioned the oil pump i took a minute to think, before the evil klanking noise occured i had a lil bit of black smoke comin out of my exhaust and now the smoke pours out like a water fall. when i think back to the night this all happened the klanking noise kinda gradually started, so that would make sence that my oil pump gave out on me, plus it kinda makes since if you think about it (oil isnt gettin pumped so im hearin the klankin noise which seems like it could possiably just be the fact that the oil isnt gettin pumped so the cam and lifters are just hittin metal to metal) does that sound like it could make any sence to anyone else? thanks..

Post by **Asleep Altima** » Thu Sep 18, 2003 8:32 am

i vote a second time for the oil pump.

Post by **ka240se** » Thu Sep 18, 2003 8:32 am

ok, i replaced the oil pump and it didnt help at all. I started up the car and it was still klanking for the moment that it ran, until it took its toll and just died out on me and now the car wont even start! once again, if anyone can think of something, input would be much appreciated. im goin to give it one more try then im goin to forget about it and just junk the damned thing!

Post by **Asleep Altima** » Thu Sep 18, 2003 8:32 am

ouch... check the play in the caps on the rods and crankshaft. i dont think it will be the crank because when the main bearings are bad, its a deep clunk. excessive wear or tolerance on the rod bearings will make you lose oil pressure and cause the rods to knock as well. sorry about your engine.

Post by **ka240se** » Thu Sep 18, 2003 8:32 am

is it a posiability that when i put my oil pump back in that the rod that pumps the oil pump and distributor is off by a tooth or so, the reason i say this is because when i looked at the rod when i put it in the slotted peice didnt quite seem to be exactly where it was before but when i matched it up with the distributor my match marks lined up. so being as it was i went ahead and finished my install...

Post by **Asleep Altima** » Thu Sep 18, 2003 8:32 am

your timing would have been way off... you can check it very easily though. pull the number one spark plug and stick a long screwdriver in there, slowly crank the engine by hand until the screwdriver raises all the way up. once its at its peak, check the timing mark on the pulley to see if its where it should be and then pull the distributor cap and see if the rotor is pointing to the number one spark plug wire. if all three match, the timing is correct. it will be obvious if you are a tooth off or not.

Post by **ka240se** » Thu Sep 18, 2003 8:32 am

couldnt i just rotate the distributor a lil if i was off a tooth?

Post by **Asleep Altima** » Thu Sep 18, 2003 8:32 am

it wont let you move it that far. you can get away with it on a v8, maybe even a 6, but on a 4 banger, its too much difference between posts inside the distributor cap.

Post by **ka240se** » Thu Sep 18, 2003 8:32 am

AHHHHHHHH! F#$K me runnin. my piston is tdc lined up with my match mark on the pully and my rotor is now at the #1 spark plug wire and the damned thing still wont start, it just clicks like it did before and is really startin to piss me off! im almost ready just to pay someone else to take the damn thing and get it away from me, but then again i dont even have the money to pay them

Post by **Asleep Altima** » Thu Sep 18, 2003 8:32 am

do you get spark with the coil wire pulled from the distributor?

Post by **ka240se** » Thu Sep 18, 2003 8:32 am

no spark, does that mean my distributor is bad?

Post by **Asleep Altima** » Thu Sep 18, 2003 8:32 am

usually no spark when the coil wire is disconnected from the distributor means the coil is bad. BUT, nissan distributors have a habit of going out when the cam position sensor gets oil on it... is there any oil under the pickup inside the distributor?

Post by **s13_CrOwNaR** » Thu Sep 18, 2003 8:32 am

the klank is prob the timing chain guides.they wear out ,ive done 2 in my 240sx and if u do the serch ull find the guides wearing out it commin . take a screw driver ,put the tip on the motor around the front and ur ear to the handle ,while the car is runing listen and move around ,i bet thats what it is , if not good luck

Post by **deviousKA** » Thu Sep 18, 2003 8:32 am

ive been away from the forums for quite some time, im sorry to hear about your ongoing problem ka240se.

ok, about the starter. if it clicks and doesnt start, try it with the lights on, do they dim when you do it and it still doesnt turn over? if so the starter/solenoid may be bad, try tappin on it with some sort of hammer (dont be afraid to hit it fairly hard) if this gets it to turn over when someone is trying the key while you hit your solenoid is bad. if it doesnt your starter may be real bad.

if you click and the lights dont dim, most likely it is a bad connection at the starter or your battery.

ok now you have double checked your timing. do you have at least a chiltons/haynes manual on your car to assist. sometimes it can help much more than people on forums can. when your pulley is at 0 tdc the arm is pointing to number one plug correct? look at how the cap would sit on the rotor and find where your number 1 wire is. you say you have no spark? i assume you checked with a plug with wire laid up againts the block? try sticking a screwdriver in the wire while someone turns it over, it will shock you pretty good if you have spark.

You are sure your rocker assembly is assembled correctly?, you have to be really sure. also if you have a chance to check when you have valve cover off, roll your pulley to 0tdc. the intake and exhaust rockers of the #1 cyl should push down, or "spring".

dont give up and sell your car

Maybe you are overlooking another problem. when the car does run it doesnt run well at all correct? this could also easily be caused my faulty injectors. one or more bad injector can create an "clunk" of sorts. the car will not run/rev very well at all

Post by **ka240se** » Thu Sep 18, 2003 8:32 am

i havnt even thought about my solenoid, or brushes even! I triple checked my timing and i have a chiltons, when i checked for spark I did like asleep said and unpluged the coil wire for the distributor. my rocker assemble is put togather right, as for the injectors ive havnt thought about that neither but the klanking can be felt through the valve cover, and when i inspect it theres no sign or them hittin at all. other than that the only other problem that im aware of is my motor and transmission mount, but i dont want to fix them until i get my engine up and running or should i think about replacing them first? other than that i dont know what to say right now but thanks to the both of you for helpin me out over this period of time with my problem and i hope to one day be able to return the favor...

Post by **I am Technoman** » Thu Sep 18, 2003 8:32 am

have you ever replaced the timing chain? your motor is 14 years old you know. Im not dissing your car im just asking

Post by **ka240se** » Thu Sep 18, 2003 8:32 am

Brand new timing chain.... I stated that in a previous post. Right now its the solenoid that is actin up, but i havnt really had any time to fix it..

Post by **C-Kwik** » Thu Sep 18, 2003 8:32 am

The starting issue will be separate from the clanking. Once you get it started, let it run even if it clanks. I'm almost positive it is just the lifters needing to purge out air and fill with oil. It may take about 20 minutes of idle to do this. This is the norm for any car with hydraulic lifters.

But then if the clanking was not the lifters in the first place, this won't solve anything. But since you replaced them, there should be some clanking comin from the lifters, Particularly the new ones.

Post by **Asleep Altima** » Thu Sep 18, 2003 8:32 am

when you replace lifters though, youre s'posed to submerge them in oil and cycle them until the air bubbles are all gone. if thats not done first, they will clank.

Post by **ka240se** » Thu Sep 18, 2003 8:32 am

when i installed the lifters i bathed them in oil for about 45 mins just to make sure no air was present, and still got the same results as before, but like i said, i think it was just the oil pump not pumping the oil, thus causing that nasty noise. But now my solenoid is still stuck and im not able to get under the car without a jack to beat the hell out of it, and i dont really trust any floor jacks & stands to keep the car up when i try to start it. The passenger side motor mount is completely trash and the motor shakes like hell so im a lil scared to get under the car. Even with my solenoid stuck, running the 10G wire to the solenoid will kick it over? So far ya'll have been a great help and i really apreciate all this help from strangers who could really give two sh!ts abuot me or my car problems!

Post by **Asleep Altima** » Thu Sep 18, 2003 8:32 am

put a socket on the crank pulley bolt and turn the pulley backwards. that should release the bendix. when you submerged the lifters, did you cycle them?

Post by **ka240se** » Thu Sep 18, 2003 8:32 am

Well I grounded out my solenoid and just got a lil firework show... So I have decided to take the starter out and just check it on a bench like I did in class. My starter looks like s*** though, and the whole area around the solenid connections is covered with clay and oil; because i got the car from someone that lived in georgia. The injectors wasn't something that i was even considering because I was drivin to my house and right before i got there it just started to klank like that , and it never really had any problems before and was running quite fine; minus the vibration of the motor mount. If anyone has any intel help me out please... Thanks...

Post by **deviousKA** » Thu Sep 18, 2003 8:32 am

dont run a hotwire to your starter to check it, can cause more problems than necessary. if when you try to start it, the relay under the hood clicks, but the starter doesnt, clean your battery terminals very well and reinstall. if this doesnt work try it a few more times. if it still doesnt work, check the wire connections at your starter (make sure nuts are tight, etc. removing and cleaning wouldnt hurt). If all this doesnt get your starter to turn but the relay clicks, your starter is most likely gone bad. Now it is time for you to replace/rebuild it.

go to the wrecking yard and look for some good motor mounts, then if you find some nice ones, and want to beef them up, fill with 3m windo weld.

when you get your engine to start and not flop around in the engine bay due to your mounts. reply with your findings

klanking noise still present!...

klanking noise still present!...

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