I am fairly new to working on cars so bare with me.

so i am doing a timing rebuild on a ka and i've got it all lined up with where the marks are supposed to be, but every time i turn the crank it always changes where the marks are and its always about a tooth off (i have read on some forums that it i supposed to line up after two full rotations). well my question is whether this is normal? i also want to add that i made the mistake of moving the crank when it was at tdc with the front chain off, could this be the cause of the timing being all off? i have redone the timing but im still having the same issue...

any feedback is appreciated

Pretty much any engine on the planet turns the cams at half speed in relation to the crank and why CAM timing lines up every other time you turn the engine around using the crank at TDC. At that time whatever you are using as marks should pretty much line up then unless the chain(s) are stretched, you will have to be the determiner of that. They should not be off a whole tooth though.

'i also want to add that i made the mistake of moving the crank when it was at tdc with the front chain off, could this be the cause of the timing being all off?'

Can't do that, it throws the timing off. Just retime it to be right again..........

appreciate your input, so how would i be able to determine if the crank is at tdc, i have the pulley and the timing cover off (those were my guides to determine if it is at tdc)? also i just want to add that my timing was never off i started hearing a ticking and that is why i decided to do the timing, that being said when i had it at tdc initially the link marks were way off, but currently i have it at tdc and the its all lined up the same from when i started, although i am doubtful of the lower timing chain being on correctly (as i said i moved the crank independently)

First off, I do not know the construction of the engine. Means nothing though, as I have worked on hundreds of car engines.

The norm is to find a long stiff rod (make SURE it is longer than needed to not fall into the engine!) and yank the #1 spark plug and then fit the rod down in the hole to then slowly raise the piston up until it absolutely quits rising and begins to go down. There is a very slight dead spot there that you have to find the middle of, the piston quits rising then stabilizes for a slight time as the rod goes overcenter of the crank. You want the middle of that slack period, that is TDC.

Or, set up again with the timing cover on and the pulley and get to TDC, then figure out a way to indicate it. I use a piece of coat hanger wire with a loop bent into it that a bolt can go into to hold it in place. Make pointer on the other end and set it close to your TDC and the whole thing must clear your cover and pulley so they can be pulled back off and once the pointer is set remove pulley and cover and then put pulley back on with no cover and you have a marker then with TDC set and you can still see your chain. The coat hanger pointer bolts to anything that has a hole there, there often being accessory bolt holes to hold things. If the cover is too wide to force you to touch the pointer while removing the cover then you will have to figure out a way to extend the pulley TDC mark further outwards, and why degree wheels that are store bought are so big in OD, besides being able to see the numbers easier. Maybe you need one of them depending on how the motor front face is designed. I used the coat hanger idea on $40,000 pro stock race engines.

The same coat hanger idea can work to finalize and zero in on a piston touching rod like higher above to get TDC much closer, when you get really close, mark the rising rod with a piece of tape and then scribe a thin mark on it and then make a pointer up from hanger and bolt to something to be at that mark and then you can clearly see at what point the mark quits going up and even how long in turning crank the slack period is to cut it in half using the mark. The closer you get there the better.

is there by chance a video you could link so i can have a better understanding of what you are talking about?