Ka-T using DSM Turbo Parts???

[driftin8ez]

My friend just got a tsi and he is upgrading the thing with a new turbo, intercooler, BOV, and injectors. The reason i mention this. Could i use any of these things to turbo my KA. If i could get the turbo rebuilt and use the intercooler I may be going turbo sooner than expected I already know i can use the BOV it's just the other stuff that is up in the air. oh ya and the injectors are 450cc are they to big for this set-up?

edit* the turbo is a 14b if anyone was wondering.

[bbandit]

yea you can use em.In fact that was my original ka-t plan.14b + DSM SMIC + DSM Bovin fact, i still have my 14b laying around in my friend's garage.I dont think 450cc is too big.those 450cc's are top feed so you need a top feed fuel rail.

[driftin8ez]

What made you decide to opt. out of the setup? The donar car has 94k on it so it seems to have low mileage. So what exhaust manifold should i use? do i need a custom one?

[bbandit]

back then.. I was on a budget.. halfway through the gathering part, I got a job that pays good money. So I went with bigger turbo.

If you're on a budget, JGStools.com has a log style manifold that you can weld by yourself.

[driftin8ez]

well i thanx for the help. I gues i will be taking that stuff off his hands. anyone actually have this set-up?

[driftin8ez]

Also any other info that i need to know about this set-up would be apreciated. How much is a turbo rebuild on average?

[bbandit]

Hi its me again... well luckily, we had this s14 ka-t with similar parts that you're going to use.

His setup was

14b turboJGS log style manifolddsm 1st gen BOVdsm 1st gen SMICcustom IC piping + downpipe

stock 270cc injectorsstock fuel pump (IIRC)8:1 FMU

you might want to focus more on fuel.this guy was pinging hardcore last time I met him in an autocross.and last time I heard, he trashed the car.

[hannibal]

The DSM turbo should be an option. But you need a way to control those 450cc injectors, like a AFC or eManage.Check out the hacked MAF theory. If you run 370cc injectors from an SR ($100 used - side feed, they drop right in) , you can use a hacked MAF to control fuel and not worry about a piggyback.

[driftin8ez]

I think i am going to go with the 370cc sr injectors and an 8:1 FMU and a fuel pump (255 walbro?). Just becouse I'm on a tight budget. Oh ya what psi should i run this thing at? I will be putting it on an s13 ka24de with 164k so i dont want to push it to hard. what type of hp numbers should i expect 200rwhp and maybe a low 14 on good tires in the 1/4?

[hannibal]

A budget setup would be the 8:1 FMU with stock injectors. This setup can give you decent power levels, but its much less reliable(Nsport's kit uses a 8:1 FMU with a T4 running at 7psi).

Once you use the 370cc, you need something to trim them down at low RPMs to keep it from running way rich. If youre gonna use the 370cc, you dont need the FMU. With 370cc, Walbro fuel pump, and a hacked MAF, you could run up to 250whp (about 10psi on a 14b??)

hacked MAF - "free"370cc injectors - $100Walbro 255 - $100

So for a little over $200, you can run up to the limit of the hacked MAF (about 250whp)

[bbandit]

^^^ I agree.. start off with that instead of FMUI'd stay away from FMU as far as I can if i were you

[driftin8ez]

So that would be sufficiant for my fuel management needs for this set-up until i want to make more power? Where is a good site to read how to do the hacked maf?

[hannibal]

Try searching on here, theres been some good threads about it. Also, check out Brian's site (he goes by Orion on here)...http://www.ka24development.com/hacked_MAF.html

Orion dynoed 248whp with that setup and a T3/T4. I'm still deciding which turbo to run (T3/T4 or T3 from Z31) but that will be my "stage 1" setup.But the hacked MAF, Walbro, and 370cc should be good for 250whp, either from a T3/T4 at 8psi or a 14B (or T3, about the same size?) at about 10 psi. I'm guessing you could hit that 200whp you mentioned at 4-5 psi.

[C-Kwik]

FMU's are plenty reliable. They are effective as well. As long as the fuel pump works fine, then I soo no reliability issues as long as you are not boosting over the fuel pump's capacity to provide fuel. They are not the most accurate way of metering fuel, but they will be close enough to be safe and effective with the right ratio.

[driftin8ez]

I was reading on how to hack the maf I read the whole thing and was set on doing it. Then the last line hit me. Can this be done on an s13...NO! So i guess i will just go with an apexi s-afc. Not as cheap but seems to be the only option in that respect. unless i can us an s14 maf on my car.

[hannibal]

Sorry man, I didnt see that you had a S13. I dont know if you can use a hacked S14 MAF on a S13 motor.I'd chose emanage over AFC cause it has ignition control.

[driftin8ez]

so the emanage is $300 + instalation and i need a laptop to really tune out my car. Well there goes my budget set-up of a free hacked maf to a $700+ emanage. Is there any other way of doing things. I mean the s-afc is alot cheaper.

edit* maybe i should go back to stock injectors, fuel pump, and an FMU? Seems to be the best bang for the buck right now.

[Deadeye 5.1]

have you looked into megasquirt? Its a DIY fuel controller that you can buy pre-assembled or peice together yourself. The code to flash it with is free, and you can buy the parts anywhere. You can tune from a laptop or PDA.

http://www.bgsoflex.com/megasquirt.html

there are other ignition modules compatible with it out there, you just need to find which one you want.

[driftin8ez]

I have never seen this. I will look into it. However, I still need to buy a laptop.

[hannibal]

Based on the fact that you have an S13, the FMU route sounds more cost effective ORyou could run the DSM 450cc injecors with a SAFC.Either way, you should do something regaring timing retard. You can do this with a MSD BTM ($150) or by retarding the base timing .5-.75 degrees per psi (the base retard works for low boost; up to 8psi??). I like eManage cause it can handle both fuel and timing issues (but a laptop is definitely a factor).

With the SAFC, Walbro, and DSM injectors, I think the limiting factor would be the efficiency of that 14B turbo and that DSM side mount.Walbro $100top feed fuel rail $50 (WD says he'll be making fuel rails at a decent price)SAFC $200 used??Total $350

Its about $150 more than the hacked MAF setup I mentioned, but the 450cc injectors should be able to carry you well past 250whp. I think a T3 and 450cc injectors should approach 300whp so the 14B should be similar.

[AN89HATCH]

whats the max lbs of boost an 255lph fuel pump, stock injectors, and an 8:1 fmu handle, before getting close to detonating/ running lean?

[driftin8ez]

good question. Becouse i just found out my "friend" is selling his tsi in favor of his new 240 project. SO i wont be getting the compenants for free. I will still be definatly going this road just not as soon. Thanx for all the help so far. does anyone know the answer to AN89HATCH question?

[ftrs13]

ideally it can run a ton of boost, but the fact is that your fuel line maxes out. I wouldnt go over 100psi in the fuel rail, so anything over 7psi is out of the question.

Im worried about mine so Im going to upgrade soon

[EastCoast240]

I think you mean the fuel injectors max out.

[ftrs13]

no, the pump cant flow any volume after a certain pressure, and when you reach the critical press. by increasing 8psi/psi of boost, as the FMU does, the pump will stop flowing at maybe 10psi boost, but will be very unreliable past 7 or so

[Kool240]

Is this the set up your talking about.........