Jesda will like this news...

[AZhitman]

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/globe-dr ... le4493699/

[Jesda]

I'm surprised Infiniti, historically top-3 or top-2 in JDP's survey, fell so far.




Maybe its all the glitchy tech gadgets.

[asoomal]

Porsche?

[IBCoupe]

Jaguar had a bad year.

[MinisterofDOOM]

Yeah they did. The weird part is: nothing changed. All they made in 2011 was the XF, XJ, and XK. All they make now is the XF, XJ, and XK. They are THE SAME CARS.

Which is why I take studies like these with a grain of salt.

[PapaSmurf2k3]

eh, companies can get complacent. Individuals that run the day to day operations come and go, some are better than others... it happens.

[IBCoupe]

I'm with MOD; that seems to be an odd measure. How is it selected? All issues with cars for that model year? Any model year? Past five?

I mean, I'm struggling to find a way to explain the drastic fluctuation.

[PapaSmurf2k3]

Drastic fluctuation could be caused by the Tsunami and earthquake. Lots of suppliers had to be re-sourced, lots of machines had to be re-qualified, etc.

[IBCoupe]

That's fair for the Japanese producers, but are there that many Japanese parts floating around in Lincoln, who fell 5 places, and Jaguar, who fell nearly 30 places?

[PapaSmurf2k3]

Combinations? I can personally testify that if someone sucks at their job, the product and quality suffers (and so do the people around them).

[AZhitman]

Preconceived notions, perceptions and expectations, I'm sure, play a role.

[Jesda]

I know for Lincoln and Ford a lot of quality issues are related to their touch screen interface. VDS surveys include anything that's a "problem" so a glitchy audio system and a failed transmission are recorded equally. While that may seem like a poor way to gauge transportation reliability, any problem involves a dealer visit and wasted time/energy regardless of what it is.

Poor fuel economy and wind noise (both due to the blocky shape) are why Hummer scored consistently poorly despite using standard GM powertrains.

[Jesda]

Jaguar is doing well in 90-day initial quality:

http://content.usatoday.com/communities ... Dch_vWDzmY

[gwoods]

As someone who is about to buy a xf supercharged I can tell you one big change in 2012 is the touch screen that controls everything and the glovebox handle. 2011 has one more year of Jaguar provided maintenance which includes brakes, tires, oil, wiper blades everything

[gwoods]

I know for Lincoln and Ford a lot of quality issues are related to their touch screen interface. VDS surveys include anything that's a "problem" so a glitchy audio system and a failed transmission are recorded equally. While that may seem like a poor way to gauge transportation reliability, any problem involves a dealer visit and wasted time/energy regardless of what it is.

Poor fuel economy and wind noise (both due to the blocky shape) are why Hummer scored consistently poorly despite using standard GM powertrains.

After pouring over literally hundreds of carfax reports for 2010 and 2011 XF's you can see a lot of them had the fuel door replaced and software changed or re installed. I have not found a single used XF that had a transmission or engine failure. Infact the transmission is the same ZF sourced 6spd that goes into a bunch of other cars. The only powertrain issue I have found is the differentials pinion half. The Pinion side of the XF diff is made from carbon fiber and a few of them were not quite to spec from the factory. If yours is bad it will fail within the 5/50 (4/50) warranty normally between 10 and 20k miles and be replaced under warrenty.

Another sidenote on the NEW Jaguar. Starting in 2010 and ending in 2013 the 5.0 all aluminum dual overhead cam V8 was the only motor Jag made and they are all the same.

In the base cars with no supercharger it makes 385hp
In supercharged cars it makes 470hp
In XFR's it makes 510hp (different pully 2psi more boost)
In the XKR-s it makes 550hp.

If you purchase a XF Supercharged (currently shopping for the right 2011 XFSC with the 100k Jaguar warranty) and have an extra $2,000 bucks laying around (opens wallet hey I do).... you can send that money to a company called ECU Tuning Group in New York. They will mail you back a different (XFR) pulley for the supercharger and some different ECU software that you upload yourself. This software removes the 155 mph top speed limiter, lets you rev the motor past 4,000 rpm in park/nuetral and give the car 590 hp and 550lbs of torque. In 2009 a 2010 XFR with similar changes, a aero plate on the bottom of the car, some holes in the front blocked off and a nitrous sprayer on the intercooler hit 225 mph at Bonneville.

[gwoods]

Yeah they did. The weird part is: nothing changed. All they made in 2011 was the XF, XJ, and XK. All they make now is the XF, XJ, and XK. They are THE SAME CARS.

Which is why I take studies like these with a grain of salt.

The folks on the Jaguar forum... I've been cheating on you guys for a few months now....say that the XF series didn't get included on JD powers 2011 Dependability Study because it wasn't in the US until 2009. The 2012 Dependability Study includes the XF series all three years including the terrible 2009 year with the old 4.2 L V8 left over from before TATA purchased Jag and fixed eveything.

[Jesda]

They're still having issues with fuel doors? I know the X-type was known for fuel door release issues, figured they would have sorted that out on their later models.

I came close to buying an X-type, S-type, or Lincoln LS before I picked up my truck earlier this week.

[gwoods]

Yep you would think they could get that right and the 2009-2011 touch screen is slower then my old black berry. BUT and this is what I look for in a car... they are crazy crazy fast. I have not felt anything pull so hard above 100 mph. We got up to 140 mph + on a test drive last month and the car really still wanted to go faster. Another cool thing is in racemode the suspension works to eliminate bodyroll.

check the internet for topgear testing the XFR vs M5 it really does a great job showing how fast the XF is. The m5 beat it around the track with the Stig driving but only by .5 of a second. The XF comes with Dunlap sportmax rubber and only a 285/30/20 on the back I am sure a 305 would fit

[hudy]

After pouring over literally hundreds of carfax reports for 2010 and 2011 XF's you can see a lot of them had the fuel door replaced and software changed or re installed. I have not found a single used XF that had a transmission or engine failure. Infact the transmission is the same ZF sourced 6spd that goes into a bunch of other cars. The only powertrain issue I have found is the differentials pinion half. The Pinion side of the XF diff is made from carbon fiber and a few of them were not quite to spec from the factory. If yours is bad it will fail within the 5/50 (4/50) warranty normally between 10 and 20k miles and be replaced under warrenty.

Another sidenote on the NEW Jaguar. Starting in 2010 and ending in 2013 the 5.0 all aluminum dual overhead cam V8 was the only motor Jag made and they are all the same.

In the base cars with no supercharger it makes 385hp
In supercharged cars it makes 470hp
In XFR's it makes 510hp (different pully 2psi more boost)
In the XKR-s it makes 550hp.

If you purchase a XF Supercharged (currently shopping for the right 2011 XFSC with the 100k Jaguar warranty) and have an extra $2,000 bucks laying around (opens wallet hey I do).... you can send that money to a company called ECU Tuning Group in New York. They will mail you back a different (XFR) pulley for the supercharger and some different ECU software that you upload yourself. This software removes the 155 mph top speed limiter, lets you rev the motor past 4,000 rpm in park/nuetral and give the car 590 hp and 550lbs of torque. In 2009 a 2010 XFR with similar changes, a aero plate on the bottom of the car, some holes in the front blocked off and a nitrous sprayer on the intercooler hit 225 mph at Bonneville.

The diff problem was from axle shaft seals leaking. We were replacing the seal once and if it was still leaking we replaced the diff and both axles(new style). I haven't seen any carbon fiber in there. Don't know where they got that from. It isn't in any of the training material or workshop manuals. The fuel door replacements were part of a service action on 2009 models. I haven't replaced a fuel door for anything but that. Software on the "infotainment" system is a pain. Biggest problem is recreating concern to properly diagnose, so it gets a software reflash. Multiple bulletins on the software for infotainment for both Land Rover and Jaguar. I replaced one transmission on an XK for a coolant contamination failure. That is the only one I have seen go through the shop out of the new vehicles. You are right that the ZF is in lots of other makes. We are using the ZF 6HP-28,-26. It is a pretty slick unit. I have replaced a few of the older -26 units for various failures, one had the splines between the transfer case and transmission rusted and stripped, other wise bulletproof transmissions.

Like you said, they are incredibly fast. It is not unusual to look down and be doing 100mph without even trying. I don't know how the owners are not all in jail/suspended licenses. I guess you just need to be judiciously easy with the right foot.

MOD is right about taking the results of the survey with a grain of salt. Nothing has changed. We get AWD mid model year(late winter...) and new engines oooohh. I am curious about how the turbo 4 from the Evoque is going to go with the Jag customers.

[Jesda]

Does Jaguar use Getrag diffs? Cadillac had issues with them on the CTS, STS, and first-gen SRX.

[Bubba1]

Jaguar is doing well in 90-day initial quality:

http://content.usatoday.com/communities ... Dch_vWDzmY

I've never quite understood why many care so much about the 90 day initial quality survey. It has little bearing on the long term reliability.

[Jesda]

Jaguar is doing well in 90-day initial quality:

http://content.usatoday.com/communities ... Dch_vWDzmY

I've never quite understood why many care so much about the 90 day initial quality survey. It has little bearing on the long term reliability.

IQS typically reflects factory defects and build quality while VDS reflects engineering and reliability.

[AZhitman]

Yep you would think they could get that right and the 2009-2011 touch screen is slower then my old black berry. BUT and this is what I look for in a car... they are crazy crazy fast. I have not felt anything pull so hard above 100 mph. We got up to 140 mph + on a test drive last month and the car really still wanted to go faster. Another cool thing is in racemode the suspension works to eliminate bodyroll.

check the internet for topgear testing the XFR vs M5 it really does a great job showing how fast the XF is. The m5 beat it around the track with the Stig driving but only by .5 of a second. The XF comes with Dunlap sportmax rubber and only a 285/30/20 on the back I am sure a 305 would fit

I think a lunch date is in order.

[hudy]

Does Jaguar use Getrag diffs? Cadillac had issues with them on the CTS, STS, and first-gen SRX.

Searched through the workshop manuals and training stuff and couldn't find that answer. No info stamped on the diff either.