Is a future G from China possible?

[telcoman]

http://www.forbes.com/2008/02/...ootix

I wonder how long that will take?

Telcoman

[rn79870]

I would hate to know how many parts/systems in my G were made in China now. I try not to buy Chinese stuff, but it is next to impossible to tell most of the time. I wish they would name them with Chinese names like Dung Heap or Junk Champ or even 58 ford.

[telcoman]

I would hate to know how many parts/systems in my G were made in China now. I try not to buy Chinese stuff, but it is next to impossible to tell most of the time. I wish they would name them with Chinese names like Dung Heap or Junk Champ or even 58 ford.

Perhaps like Chinese food, Premium Package A from column A, and technology package from column BIt wasn't too long ago that Americans referred to Japanese products as junk. That was around the time I bought my first Volkswagen Beedle while in the US Army in Germany. $1420 delivered brand new. My first foreign car. To this day I have never purchased another American car and never will because they are all crap

Telcoman

[rn79870]

My Dad had a 1964 VW that he bought while overseas and had shipped to California. I think he paid something like $1300+/-. I took the driving test for my license in that car. (and passes)

[smockers83]

Just don't go off biting your door or something crazy...scarred for life.

Sounds like the UAW has to get their homework done or else their members won't have jobs (stupid unions anyway; or just come to realize that their members are overpaid or don't do a thing at work).

[Sentientbydesign]

Some of us union people would love to work more, we just have *coughs* for bosses. It's the bureacracy that really limits production.

[telcoman]

Just don't go off biting your door or something crazy...scarred for life.

Sounds like the UAW has to get their homework done or else their members won't have jobs (stupid unions anyway; or just come to realize that their members are overpaid or don't do a thing at work).

The UAW is a fine union and has done a lot for American workers.Unfortunately when President Regan fired the air traffic controllers in 1982 there was no nationwide strike and that was the beginning of the decline of the trade union movement in this country. What we have now in our economy is the result of a twenty five year decline in living standards for the middle class. Of course the rich got richer with the Bush tax cuts and him pissing away the Clinton balanced budget when he came into office.

It is not the unions and how can you say they are overpaid when the CEO's, Board of Directors, and CFO's all get huge multi million dollar salaries for turning out crap that no one wants to buy?A few examples... Cadillac Diesel engins and transmissions, putting Chevy engines in Oldsmobiles without informing consumers, Fuel tank explosions in Ford Pinto's, Edsels, poor customer service from all of the big three, almost non existent manual shift vehicles and way behind in developing 6 , 7 and 8 speed automatic transmissions, late in offering fuel injection, 4 wheel disc brakes, etc....i could go on and on. They screwed my father and they screwed me in my early twenties so I say #uck the #other$uckers I'll never buy another American car. Amercan workers are just fine. They just have poor management.

Don't get me started Sorry, I'm turning into Jacko

Telcoman

[rn79870]

... late in offering fuel injection, 4 wheel disc brakes, Telcoman

Okay telcoman, 99% of what you said is correct. However, I remember a Buick that was available in 1986. It was black on black, turbo'd and fuel injected. They called it a GN and later a GNX. That car was a leader in many technological areas. There was nothing from Asia that was available here that could touch a 1987 GNX in performance, comfort or style. Car & Driver quoted a 4.7 second 0-60. That for a 3800 pound car shaped like a brick.

GN shown below.

[Sentientbydesign]

Times have changed.

In the 80s asian vehicles in the US were getting out of the economy mode.

In the end, I wouldn't buy an american car. Maybe a truck, with lots of research, but none of this american crap. I do love the styling of the new Camaro though

[telcoman]

Okay telcoman, 99% of what you said is correct. However, I remember a Buick that was available in 1986. It was black on black, turbo'd and fuel injected. They called it a GN and later a GNX. That car was a leader in many technological areas. There was nothing from Asia that was available here that could touch a 1987 GNX in performance, comfort or style. Car & Driver quoted a 4.7 second 0-60. That for a 3800 pound car shaped like a brick.

GN shown below.

OK but they still dropped the ball. The Corvette came out in 1953 but again GM was slow in developing and becoming a leader in automotive technology. Porsche, Datsun, Mazda, Honda became technologically superior. Using old design pushrod engines instead of developing duel overhead cam more fuel efficient engines. Fighting and wining about CAFE standards was poor planning and resulted in loss of market share. Remember the Cadillac V8 6 4 engine What a disaster. My father bought a 1955 Buick. What a beautiful car that was. It's too bad GM picked a bunch of $ssholes to run that company and its been slowly sliding into oblivion ever since.

Telcoman

[Jacko3]

Sentientbydesign:

As a union member, what type of soldiering do you guys typically employ--natural or systematic soldiering?

[Jacko3]

Telcoman:

Take it easy. Cool your engines. I feel your pain and frustration. It is okay to be Jacko every now and then. Please, everyone, give Telcoman a big hug.

[rn79870]

OK but they still dropped the ball. The Corvette came out in 1953 but again Remember the Cadillac V8 6 4 engine What a disaster. Telcoman

Yep, that was the low point of Cadillac. In fact, I understand that that engine, plus a few other errors like that little 3/4 size Caddy of 86-87 just about killed Cadillac.

Then GM dropped Oldsmobile and kept Saturn.

You're right, poor management, poor leadership and poor planning all around.

[telcoman]

Yep, that was the low point of Cadillac. In fact, I understand that that engine, plus a few other errors like that little 3/4 size Caddy of 86-87 just about killed Cadillac.

Then GM dropped Oldsmobile and kept Saturn.

You're right, poor management, poor leadership and poor planning all around.

Sometimes speaking up with the truth can get one into trouble

http://www.michaelmoore.com/do....html

[infinitgkid]

oh boy, i hope the future G doesn't come from china... The chinese quality of the chinese products are horrible.

Have any of you seen that chinese car that was from some chinese independant manufacturer?

It got 1 out of 5 stars in the crash test. I mean once the car made contact with that wall, the motor was practically in the back seat... not mention that the doors flew off!

The only way I would see a chinese car having such an affect on us as to them producing a future G, is if they drastically improve the quality of their products...

thats my 2 cents...

[smockers83]

Sorry telco, misspoke or mistyped or whatever we call it here, the UAW members were being overpaid. In the most recent deal, 70% of the gap in labor costs between GM and Japanese rivals was cut out (from GMs perspective, health care costs will be handed off to UAW--good luck to them). And I was never trying to criticize the American worker either, its the union bosses that I like to criticize--they can be just as bad as CEOs--and the things they demand for their members.

Unions aren't held too high here in Michigan from my understanding growing up here and my experiences. UAW walked out last year I think it was and are always complaining and threatening. A local union here at home sat outside the firm they used to work for, doing nothing for over a year over something stupid while the company just brought in non-union workers and that’s the way it still is today--nobody supported them. When I was in high school, the teachers and their union could, and still, never agree with the school board in the town next to us which always threatened to keep school from starting on time almost every year, which also led the good teachers to leave the district for a more stable one, which ironically meant a pay cut. The union that represents some of the employees at the University of Michigan in which I supervise, none of them like their union or even other unions. The only decent union I've had experience with is the local ironworker’s union at home. That’s my experience with unions here in Michigan.

As for Flint and Michael Moore, I don't know much about it but I do know this--it's workforce is very low skilled and it's never really been a nice place to live and is now the 3rd most violent city with Detroit as #1 (that's with a 46% drop in crime). My grandma said they only went to Flint if they had to. Plus, Michael Moore sensationalizes facts but does bring to light a lot of good issues. It's not that GM had a conspiracy against Flint, it probably just wasn't economically viable which may be the reason they headed south for cheaper labor starting in the 60s. As for Flint becoming a ghost town, won't happen just because GM leaves, in fact they're building a new factory for 2011 to replace the one closing this year. I'm from essentially a ghost town--half of the town was abandoned in the early 1900s and has been declining for the past 80 years (currently around 4,500)--and 3 hours in any direction of me gives you ghost towns. Why? Business moved out, no longer economical. That's just the way it goes, oh well. But as you read in that link you posted from Moore, whoever was on city council in those years did a horrible, horrible job at rebuilding Flint.

[Sentientbydesign]

Sentientbydesign:

As a union member, what type of soldiering do you guys typically employ--natural or systematic soldiering?

Please forgive my nescience, but I'm not familiar with the terminology.

[telcoman]

Please forgive my nescience, but I'm not familiar with the terminology.

[rn79870]

Sometimes speaking up with the truth can get one into trouble

Poor GM, they can't find enough ways to create problems. Makes me glad I like Ford. Especially the classic Fords from the 50's.