I'm moving to Canada

[dreamsOfSkylines]

I just don't get it, Bush won the popular vote?? I know a lot of people are sick of talking about politics at this point, but thats half the problem. You have to always consider the effect your decisions make on other people, and not just once every four years. The republicans ran a campaign based on pure fear, and they won. Fear of terrorists, fear of gay marriage, basically fear of the unknown. You're more likely to die from any number of illnesses than terrorism, yet fear of terrorism wins out over improved health coverage and stem cell research. Your more likely to die in a car accident, maybe we should all buy Volvos? Even intellegent conservatives were saying to get Bush out of office. He isn't fiscally conservative. He isn't conservative on labor/immigration issues.

They say that Bush won from "values votes". First of all, one of the founding concepts of America is freedom of religion. This means that no one (including christians) is supposed to use the government to implement their beliefs. If you do believe that abortion and homosexuality are sins, then the abortionists and gays will all burn in hell for all eternity, right? Isn't that enough? It's not like they're getting married in YOUR church, its not like they're marriage is recognized by YOUR church. Nobody is forcing YOU to get an abortion.

People tell me, "Oh, but Bush did such a great job after 9/11." What did he do that was so great? ANY president would have invaded Afganistan, and most would have put a little more effort into actually taking full control of the country and rebuilding it. Most of the country is still under the rule of warlords. Opium production has sky rocketed. There are serious questions as to whether meaningful elections can be held in such a lawless land.

Bush and Co. knew that their was no tie between Iraq and Al-Queda before the war, and they had little to no valid evidence of WMDs. Osama Bin Laden considered Sadam an infidel, due to his secular government. They violated numerous international laws in their "preemptive war" against a country which has no means to attack us. Sadam wouldn't have been a problem at all if we didn't put him in power and arm him back in Bush Senior's days. Nobody is arguing that Sadam wasn't a bad guy, but the the means don't always justify the ends. Take a look at this for example: http://www.washingtonpost.com/...1.pdf These people are at least partly to blame for the Abu Gahrib "scandal".

The fact is, you can't win a conventional war against terrorists. Al Queda recruitment has shot up dramatically since the start of the Iraq war, we are LESS SAFE now. For every bad guy we kill in there, we get at least five innocent civillians too. Every single relative of these people is then going to swear revenge against America (just like we swore revenge after 9/11) and the vicous cycle continues to propagate. There is a limited number of radicals in these places (like the religous leaders who urge young children to become suicide bombers). Its not easy to convince your average person to give up their life for any cause, but we are giving them plenty of material to work with when we kill these peoples' loved ones. You need to remove the popular support for these people, not boost it. Give the people tangible benefits like better security and infrastructure, not just abstract talk about "freedom".

People in other countries do not hate us because of our freedom. They hate us because of our imperialism. America has frequently removed democratically elected governments with socialist leanings, in favor of iron fisted dictators who will make they're natraul resources and markets available to us. Read a history book, its all blood money. We use an amazingly disproportinate amount of the worlds natraul resources. If america reduced its meat intake by just 10%, we could feed every single starving person in the whole world.

Oh well, never mind my ramblings. Enjoy your tax break, buy an assult rifle, and keep a close eye on your neighbor.

[Altiman94]

Uh, we don't need political threads, and me being a republican makes me disagree with about everything you've said. You need to educate yourself more on the issues. The people have spoken, they want W.

[ilovedrifting]

Uh, we don't need political threads, and me being a republican makes me disagree with about everything you've said. You need to educate yourself more on the issues. The people have spoken, they want W.

[gumby]

dont get me started

[rico05]

I do not agree with the "morality" of Mr. Bush (he is NOT my President) but as a person, he seems honest and to at least follow his (bass akward) convictions. If Kerry had won, then you would hear me bitching more. But I do not like our nations "leader" and I can't wait until 2008. He needs to quit gay-bashing and get us the hell out of Iraq. That is #1 in my book.

[themadscientist]

I know you are going to have trouble with this but do your best. More people voted for Bush, he wins. There are people who do not see the world as you do and when they were counted there was more of us.

quit typin, get packin, see ya!

Oh please transfer this hate rant over to the specific political thread in this section.

[nametakennow]

We have an official election thread for a reason, keep this there guys.

[Altiman94]

^agreed. This is just general ranting of people who know nothing about politcals.

[dreamsOfSkylines]

.

Uh, we don't need political threads, and me being a republican makes me disagree with about everything you've said. You need to educate yourself more on the issues. The people have spoken, they want W.

My point is, half the problem is that people don't want to talk about it. If you disagree with something I said then tell me why or don't say anything at all. If you beleive something you should at least be able to explain why.

We have an official election thread for a reason, keep this there guys.

I'm sorry I didn't realize there was a specific "political thread" so that it is easier to ignore.

I know you are going to have trouble with this but do your best. More people voted for Bush, he wins. There are people who do not see the world as you do and when they were counted there was more of us.

quit typin, get packin, see ya!

Oh please transfer this hate rant over to the specific political thread in this section.

I'm not saying Bush didn't win, I'm asking why people voted for him. I didn't realize that questioning convictions = hating.

^agreed. This is just general ranting of people who know nothing about politcals.

Please educate me.

[prigo]

I'm moving to Canada

Then get the hell out, you won't be missed.

[gumby]

why don't you start packin, for iraq.

[dreamsOfSkylines]

Then get the hell out, you won't be missed.

Great Argument! Informative and inspiring.

[nametakennow]

I'm sorry I didn't realize there was a specific "political thread" so that it is easier to ignore.

Yup. Thread says "official election thread" or something the like. If you read it, it would explain that there are too many political threads for a non-political board, and thus that thread was/is the official one for political discussions at the moment, all others will be locked. I assume the Mods haven't really noticed this one yet.

[dreamsOfSkylines]

Its the General Discussion forum. The point of my thread is that too many people will do anything to avoid discussing their political views, which is ridiculous. You can still ignore the thread but I would like someone to actually argue the points I made. I will post what I said in your one and only political thread if mods want to close this one.

[The Mic]

told ya the "Official election thread" is like the free speech zone the dems had, now it will be treated as such

[SmithSR]

Political threads end now.

Thread locked, any additional posts will be removed.