Housing Issues? Why the Democrats are to blame.

[AZhitman]

http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/...bnQY0

Cliff's Notes:

- Fannie and Freddie reform bill (2005) didn't become law, Democrats opposed it. - Republicans couldn't even get the Senate to vote on the matter. - Fast-forward to 2008, collapse has occurred and the roadblock built by Senate Democrats in 2005 is unforgivable. - The senators who protected Fannie / Freddie, including Barack Obama, Hillary Clinton and Christopher Dodd, have received mind-boggling levels of financial support from them over the years. - Obama has gotten more than $125,000 in campaign contributions from Fannie / Freddie, second only to Dodd at $165,000. - H. Clinton, 12th-ranked recipient of Fannie and Freddie contributions, received more than $75,000.

Bottom line:The private profit found its way back to the senators who killed the fix.

Now, where is the corruption in Washington?

[96Qowner]

McCain’s attempt to fix Fannie Mae, Freddie Mac in 2005; Update: Obama can’t get AIG right

In this speech, McCain managed to predict the entire collapse that has forced the government to eat Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac, along with Bear Stearns and AIG. He hammers the falsification of financial records to benefit executives, including Franklin Raines and Jim Johnson, both of whom have worked as advisers to Barack Obama this year. McCain also noted the power of their lobbying efforts to forestall oversight over their business practices. He finishes with the warning that proved all too prescient over the past few days and weeks.

It never made it out of committee. Chris Dodd, then the ranking member of the Banking Committee and now its chair, was in the middle of receiving preferential loan treatment from Countrywide Mortgage, one of the companies gaming the system in the credit crisis. Meanwhile, Barack Obama took hundreds of thousands of dollars from the lobbyists McCain mentions in this speech, making him the #2 recipient of Fannie/Freddie money:

http://hotair.com/archives/200...-2005/

But partisans will be partisans.

[AZhitman]

...and yet, these clear and convincing issues will be rug-swept dust by morning.

Hell, even the resident lefties in this forum won't defend these allegations.

Who hates hearing "the truth" again?

[96Qowner]

I fear we've chased all the lefties away.

We need to recruit some more.

[eh?]

(Kevin Hassett, director of economic-policy studies at the American Enterprise Institute, is a Bloomberg News columnist. He is an adviser to Republican Senator John McCain of Arizona in the 2008 presidential election. The opinions expressed are his own.)

Biased much?

[Cold_Zero]

Let's stick to the facts. It is Congress's Job for Oversight in banking matters. This issue has been going on since 2005-2006. Why didnt the House Banking Committee chaired by Barny Frank and the United States Senate Committee on Banking, Housing, and Urban Affairs chaired by Chris Dodd exercise their oversight duties by blowing the whistle, holding hearings and proposing legislation? It is Congress's duty to oversee these matters.

Blaming the CEOs, the CFOs, the Investment Banks, President Bush and the Regulators but not yourself is just plain wrong. Barny Frank and Christopher Dodd where just as asleep at the switch as Christopher Cox was at the SEC and James B. Lockhart III was at the Office of Federal Housing Enterprise Oversight.

[AZhitman]

Biased much?

Not at all. Research the FACTUAL basis for what's being said and let us know if it's in any way inaccurate.

Hassett is not the only one pointing out the dismally obvious here.

[APEXi240]

- Fannie and Freddie reform bill (2005) didn't become law, Democrats opposed it. - Republicans couldn't even get the Senate to vote on the matter. - Fast-forward to 2008, collapse has occurred and the roadblock built by Senate Democrats in 2005 is unforgivable.

Now, where is the corruption in Washington?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/R...icies

Republicans emphasize the role of corporate and personal decision making in fostering economic prosperity. They support the idea of individuals being economically responsible for their own actions and decisions. They favor a free market, policies supporting business, economic liberalism, and fiscal conservatism but with higher spending on the military.

I still don't understand why Republicans are so proud to state McCain proposed all of these reform bills. I understand it to the extent of trying to point out the faults of the Democratic party and their actions (or inactions) in the matter, but in doing so they are going against what I was always taught were the basics of the Republican party idealogies. To me, in essence they are touting their deviation from what their party should be, to the mess that it is today.

I would honestly love for nothing more than for the Republican party to return to most of it's classical beliefs and policies. Instead we have a polarization of two parties that are become more and more similar on certain issues, and more muddled on others.

*edit

The corruption is everywhere in Washington, it is not limited to one party, so cherry picking this issue to bring up corruption among a party you happen to dislike is moot.

[S13_love]

The corruption is everywhere in Washington, it is not limited to one party, so cherry picking this issue to bring up corruption among a party you happen to dislike is moot.

Some people fail to realize this.

If republicans can just go back to their basic beliefs like what you said, then and only then they might have my vote.

[smockers83]

So let me get this straight. The Democrats thumbed their nose twice at Fannie and Freddie?

[HashiriyaS14]

- Fannie and Freddie reform bill (2005) didn't become law, Democrats opposed it. - Republicans couldn't even get the Senate to vote on the matter.

Weren't both houses of Congress still controlled by a Republican majority in 2005 (i.e. 109th Congress)? Dennis Hastert was still the speaker.

It looks like the bill was called the "Federal Housing Enterprise Regulatory Reform Act of 2005"

Here is a link to the Bill text and sponsoring members: (Hagel, McCain, Dole, Sununu)

http://www.govtrack.us/congres...9-190

It appears that the bill was never even scheduled for Debate. I guess it's possible that Democrats somehow killed it in committee, but still, this was during a GOP majority. I'm somewhat amazed that it never even came to a vote.

Are we really, truly certain that it was Democrats who killed this thing? It seems like it would have been a difficult thing for them to have done at the time. McCain wasn't exactly the most popular guy with the GOP majority back then, is it possible that the rank-and-file pro-deregulation Republicans axed this thing?

I'm not saying it was either way, but I AM saying that it's not cut-and-dry, we don't seem to have much information. If it had come to a vote during Pelosi's reign and struck down that'd be one thing, but this was during a GOP-controlled Congress.

[srellim234]

If you thnk that the blame needs to be fixed on the Democrats for something that did or did not happen in Congress in 2005/2006, you are incredibly naive.

Bipartisan greed and deregulation have led to the point we are at now. It took decades to get here. Greed by the board rooms, shareholders (big AND small), mortgage lenders, individuals who took out those mortgages, etc. Deregulation led by the likes of Phil Gramm and John McCain.

srellim's edit- I took out a comment that should have been conveyed directly to an individual by email here. It didn't belong in a post.
Modified by srellim234 at 10:32 AM 9/24/2008

[AZhitman]

Steve - I concur completely.

My point was simply to dispute Obama's idiotic comments leading people to believe the responsibility for this mess is all on the GOP and that JM doesn't "understand" the issue at hand. He clearly does comprehend it, or he wouldn't have co-sponsored the bill in 2005.

None are blameless here. Contentions to the contrary should be dismissed as partisan shenanigans.

[audtatious]

Here's an interesting WSJ article on the Fan/Fred issue:

http://online.wsj.com/article/...s_wsj

Looks like the crooks (and Chris Dodd) made out with some nice home loans too:http://stuckon-stupid.com/2008...ogram

Here's where it started?http://stuckon-stupid.com/2008...table/

And more info on who did what or who got what:http://ace.mu.nu/archives/274081.phphtt ... sp....html

Media reporting on F/F:http://newsbusters.org/blogs/n...orrup

[HashiriyaS14]

http://ace.mu.nu/archives/274081.php

This article is preposterous. It in no way details how the "Democrats created this problem". The idea that the Democrats COULD have created this problem after a GOP congressional majority since 94 and a GOP President since 2000 is ridiculous. The article talks ABOUT the problem, but it does not convincingly attribute it to Democrats likely because no facts exist to support such a conclusion and the writer knows it.

I still haven't heard anyone mention anything about the 2005 Housing Reform Act. Who killed that bill? Seems tough for me to believe that it was Democrats under the Hastert Congress. Did they fillibuster or did pro-deregulation Republicans kill it in committee?

[audtatious]

Come on dude, you know the Reps never do anything wrong. They have a heart of GOLD!

Anywho...Some of his rants are not necessarily "on par" but the basis of what he is saying is pretty much what others are also saying. He has the players right as well although I think he puts more on Obama than is deserved. Barney Frank, Chris Dodd, Franklin Raines, Penny Pritzker and Jim Johnson are definitely some of the key players. They were helped along by establishments like ACORN as well. Obama was part of ACORN and has given them support while in the Senate. He has also received a good bit of money from Fannie/Freddie (5x+ more than McCain, but less than Hillary) although that is probably nothing but assumptions based on a "wide net".

As far as the 2005 Housing reform act:http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/...bnQY0

"If that bill had become law, then the world today would be different. In 2005, 2006 and 2007, a blizzard of terrible mortgage paper fluttered out of the Fannie and Freddie clouds, burying many of our oldest and most venerable institutions. Without their checkbooks keeping the market liquid and buying up excess supply, the market would likely have not existed.

But the bill didn't become law, for a simple reason: Democrats opposed it on a party-line vote in the committee, signaling that this would be a partisan issue. Republicans, tied in knots by the tight Democratic opposition, couldn't even get the Senate to vote on the matter. " (this assumes you trust the author of the above which you probably don't as I believe he is now associated with McCain)

In general I think the Dems were concerned with the bill as they thought it could stagnate "affordable housing" and while the Reps had already added some changes based upon what the Dems wanted they seemed unwilling to make additional change which would further fund those who could not afford housing on their own (my interpretation).

Anyway, on April 12, 2007 it was reintroduced as S. 1100 [110th]: Federal Housing Enterprise Regulatory Reform Act of 2007. It has been held up in the Senate Committee on Banking, Housing, and Urban Affairs by the honorable Senator Chris Dodd (D-CT), Chairman.

Yes, the Republicans had a majority. They did NOT have a Super Majority and still needed Democratic support to get things passed. From "the peoples" standpoint it just really sucks that partisan politics are played so much in congress and the US as a whole is getting screwed because of it.

[HashiriyaS14]

But the bill didn't become law, for a simple reason: Democrats opposed it on a party-line vote in the committee, signaling that this would be a partisan issue. Republicans, tied in knots by the tight Democratic opposition, couldn't even get the Senate to vote on the matter. " (this assumes you trust the author of the above which you probably don't as I believe he is now associated with McCain)

If this is true, then I will happily eat crow. I did not purport to know what happened to the bill, I only know that it never reached a vote. If you can find me some details in regards to the members of the committee and how they voted, you most certainly win. Facts are facts.

I don't DISBELIEVE it, but Senate happenings are pretty well documented by any number of impartial sources, so it shouldn't be too tough to find out what went on in committee.

EDIT:

It appears that during the 109th Congress, the Senate Committee on Banking, Housing, and Urban Affairs (who handled the bill) had an 11-9 GOP majority and a GOP chairman (Shelby), so I find it tough to believe that a "strict partisan vote" could have killed the bill in committee.

Insomuch as I am aware, there is no filibuster in committees, and thus a simple majority is all that is needed. The GOP *could* have brought this to the floor for a vote, but didn't. I'm not sure why that would occur. Perhaps they feared a floor filibuster? Why not at least bring it to a vote then, to force the Dems into filibustering an otherwise-good bill? Methinks it's because it didn't have watertight support on the GOP side in the Senate, but that's just a theory. Making the other side filibuster ALWAYS looks good, so I can't figure out any other reason why they wouldn't have done that other than that enough GOP'ers were willing to vote against it that a filibuster wouldn't have occurred.

Additionally, McCain failed to re-sponsor the bill when it came up again in 2007, but given how bills can change with amendments, I'm not really prepared to fault him for this, because I don't know how closely it resembled the original.

[audtatious]

I'm not here to win. It not passing is a lose for all of us. Partisan politics were definitely part of the issue. The current iteration of the bill is stalled due to Dodd from what I can tell.

[wingFeather]

Some people fail to realize this.

If republicans can just go back to their basic beliefs like what you said, then and only then they might have my vote.

But you make it sound like Obama is immune from all this

[AZhitman]

No need to start sauteeing that blackbird, Hashie - It's old news.

And it wouldn't even be an issue if Oblabberlips would STFU and quit acting like he knew of this all along and that this is all on the GOP. That's all.

[HashiriyaS14]

No need to start sauteeing that blackbird, Hashie - It's old news.

That's a deflection.

If we're going to bring up this bill, then whomever brought it up (McCain camp) has the burden on THEM to prove that it was, in fact, Democrats that killed it.

I'm still not necessarily asserting that it wasn't, but I am saying that it would seem improbable that they would be able to do so. If this bill is going to be the first point in your original post and we're going to do a whole back-and-forth about it, you DO need to demonstrate that your point is valid and that Democrats killed it rather than the GOP letting it die.

So yes, I suppose I am going to "saute that blackbird", whatever the f*ck that means. Saute away. I may very well be VERY wrong, but given that I'm not the one who raised the issue in the first place, the onus is not on me to deliver the proof.

If people aren't willing to get into the details, don't raise the points to begin with. You shouldn't make the post unless you already know the answer.

[96Qowner]

I think it was related to this.

If this is true, then I will happily eat crow.

In other words, no need to "saute the blackbird". Blah, blah, old news, who knows?

Zoom! Over the head, heheh.

[audtatious]

It appears that during the 109th Congress, the Senate Committee on Banking, Housing, and Urban Affairs (who handled the bill) had an 11-9 GOP majority and a GOP chairman (Shelby), so I find it tough to believe that a "strict partisan vote" could have killed the bill in committee.

It depends on what the majority vote requirement is. Even if it was as low as 60% then bills would not pass based on votes along party lines. I don't know what the Committee on Banking, Housing, and Urban Affairs requires as a majority vote but I'm sure it's more than just a simple majority rule. Thus, it is absolutely expected that a vote along party lines would kill a bill.

[AZhitman]

Damn, Hashie. I wasn't slamming you brother.

Sautee = to cook. Blackbird = a crow.

I meant, there's no need to "eat crow", or, put more simply, I'm not pressing the issue, and I don't do the "I told ya so" thing.

The onus is NOT on me. The onus is on Blabberack Obama, who has consistently pointed fingers at the Right while claiming NO Dem responsibility for this mess.

I was simply pointing out that while BO was a Fresh Senator, J-Mac actually DID something about it (or tried to).

So, BO needs to prove to YOU, the voter, that his party DIDN'T kill the bill. Call his HQ.

p.s. Here's a hint: I'll bet you the Dems alone didn't kill it... there were likely some GOP reps involved in opposing it... remember, J-Mac has never been the "Golden Boy" of the GOP. Think along those lines...

Or, just vote for him without finding out the facts.

[HashiriyaS14]

Damn, Hashie. I wasn't slamming you brother.

Sautee = to cook. Blackbird = a crow.

I meant, there's no need to "eat crow", or, put more simply, I'm not pressing the issue, and I don't do the "I told ya so" thing.

The onus is NOT on me. The onus is on Blabberack Obama, who has consistently pointed fingers at the Right while claiming NO Dem responsibility for this mess.

I was simply pointing out that while BO was a Fresh Senator, J-Mac actually DID something about it (or tried to).

So, BO needs to prove to YOU, the voter, that his party DIDN'T kill the bill. Call his HQ.

p.s. Here's a hint: I'll bet you the Dems alone didn't kill it... there were likely some GOP reps involved in opposing it... remember, J-Mac has never been the "Golden Boy" of the GOP. Think along those lines...

Or, just vote for him without finding out the facts.

LOL, I'm a retard (in regards to blackbird comment). I must be having an off day.

As for who killed it, in your last paragraph, I think you're probably right. To Mac's credit, he DID co-sponsor it, so even if Senate Republicans were threatening to kill it, which is probably what happened, he should still get the credit, you just couldn't pin it's death, per se, on the Democrats. Thus, just because the Dems didn't kill it, it doesn't mean that Mac shouldn't get credit for having sponsored the thing.

[Jesda]

THE GREAT BLACKBIRD SCANDAL OF 2008

[audtatious]

Check this video out

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v....html

[AZhitman]

Check this video out

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v....html

Ouch.

Who the HELL in NY voted for that Meeks clown?