Herman Cain 2012

[stebo0728]

Well I have been pushing Herman so far, but the national media is still a bit behind on catching up with him. He conjured 4% on a straw poll this past week despite being pretty obscure nationally. Thats pretty solid, and I believe as the national media begins to shed light on him, he will catch pretty strong numbers.

Heres a video of him years ago handing Bill Clinton's a** back to him in a town hall meeting, regarding the old Hillarycare plan and its affects on business and jobs

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HdLGKRBJ_0E[/youtube]

The man knows his stuff, and as I've said before, we NEED a strong business mind in the white house right now. Ten years at Godfathers Pizza as CEO sure goes alot farther than community organizer.

[IBCoupe]

Government's not a business. Not about to watch the video, as this is only a short break from preparing for class, but I wanted to say this: business experience doesn't matter a bit to me, because the leader of the free world has a lot more on his plate of a great many more different things from that of your average CEO.

[stebo0728]

Well keep electing community organizers, and half term senators, and see where we get ...

[mattblancarte]

(x) experience doesn't matter a bit to me, because the leader of the free world has a lot more on his plate of a great many more different things from that of your average (x) .

FTFY

This may surprise you, but CEOs of publicly traded companies function in a very similar manner to the POTUS. Politics and all. Personally, I see it as relevant experience.

On a side note, Godfather's Pizza was a failing franchise in the 90's and I don't doubt that the proposed health care plan would have caused them even further trouble from an operations standpoint.

[IBCoupe]

You have a lot of experience with both, do you, Matt? How many armed forces is your average CEO in command of?

[mattblancarte]

Are you implying that because I have yet to be the CEO of a publicly traded company along with having held public office, I cannot draw superficial similarities?

A CEO is the head of a management board. The POTUS is the head of a bureaucratic cabinet.

A CEO partly makes decisions based on advice from trusted officers. The POTUS partly makes decisions based on advice from trusted cabinet members.

A CEO has to deal with a very public lifestyle, open to scrutiny by the press and competition. The POTUS has to deal with a very public lifestyle, open to scrutiny by the press and competition.

It doesn't stop there, obviously. All I was saying is that there is relevancy in the experience of a CEO when considering them for public office.

How many armed forces is anyone in the public sector commanding during the course of their professional careers? Should we discount any and all candidates without senior command experience within the military?

My point was never that they are lock-step jobs that are identical in responsibilities. My point was that there is a reasonable amount of similarity between to the two jobs to consider it worthy of more than "a bit" of experience. There's obviously no job in the world that compares exactly to that of the President. Wasn't trying to make the point that there is such a thing.

[IBCoupe]

I wasn't suggesting that you need experience to voice your opinion. I"m just suggesting that if you're going to have the gall to "fix" my posts for me, maybe experience would help.

And my point is that the probably most important job responsibilities aren't going to have anything to do with being good at business. Too often people say, "I want government to run like an efficient business!" and I'm forced to reply, "I don't want my government to profit off of me."

[mattblancarte]

I'm not so sure I can agree with your second paragraph. Leadership is of pinnacle importance in both business and the Presidency. There are a host of skill sets within that concept (a very incomplete list of them can be found in my previous post) that play a key roll.

I don't see the relationship between business and government as so black and white as I think you may be painting it to be.

I do agree, however, that the government should not be profiting off of us. I have a scathing dislike of lobbyists and the whole practice of special interest voting in general.

Personally, I'd like to see an engineer or scientist in the Oval Office.

[mattblancarte]

Didn't mean to offend you or to display any gall. Most of the time I use FTFY in a cordial, respectful manner. I was just using what you had written because it was less work than re-wording my thoughts into a retort.

My apologies, sincerely.

[srellim234]

In many ways I would equate the CEO of a public company to other politicians, not the POTUS. The biggest is that they tend to serve part time on many boards (politicians on commissions), drawing full time salaries from each. They have a "good old boys'" network sheltering themselves and allowing themselves to wind up in another cushy position even if they butcher the current one. They operate in a manner that has an attitude of "screw my rank and file workers, I'm getting mine first. They can serve a very short time and still profit handsomely as they are shown the door (golden parachutes, severance packages written into their contracts when hired, retirement packages based on short time served, etc.) whether they operate the company profitably or not.

[mattblancarte]

Most POTUS operate in an eerily similar way to the shady CEO you've described there.

I agree that it's too strong to say that the jobs equate. I can't think of any job on the planet that equates to being the President. Perhaps other world leaders could come close, but their situations are often different to a significant degree.

[IBCoupe]

Leadership is of pinnacle importance in both business and the Presidency. There are a host of skill sets within that concept (a very incomplete list of them can be found in my previous post) that play a key roll.

And my point is that leadership is a pinnacle of importance in the Boy Scouts, too. I reject the notion that business experience gives you any greater personal skill-set than most of life's other experiences. Simply being alive for 35 years (a requirement of the office of President) is probably enough to build a proper basic skill-set.

What we want (or, at least, what I want) is excellence, and that isn't demonstrated by a resume.

I don't see the relationship between business and government as so black and white as I think you may be painting it to be.

I don't see the relationship as being black and white. I see it as being black and sock. For the most part, when you think about a good "sock," you shouldn't be thinking "black." Are some black socks really good? Yes, but that's more a coincidence than it is a function of blackness.

I do agree, however, that the government should not be profiting off of us. I have a scathing dislike of lobbyists and the whole practice of special interest voting in general.

Personally, I'd like to see an engineer or scientist in the Oval Office.

I can get with all of that. And it's your last sentence that makes me so reticent to get behind the notion that a businessman is exactly what our White House needs. I think a great scientists in office would do wonders. The designer in me thinks a great engineer would have his head up his a** the whole time, but let's give it a shot anyways! But it doesn't really matter to me where they came from as long as they're great.

[mattblancarte]

And my point is that leadership is a pinnacle of importance in the Boy Scouts, too. I reject the notion that business experience gives you any greater personal skill-set than most of life's other experiences. Simply being alive for 35 years (a requirement of the office of President) is probably enough to build a proper basic skill-set.

What we want (or, at least, what I want) is excellence, and that isn't demonstrated by a resume.

I follow what you're saying, but I think the range of examples provided here aren't specific enough to solidify your point. "Business experience" can connote a wide range of skills and talents. Some may be relevant and helpful, others may be a hindrance.

Specific leadership skills required by CEOs can translate directly into a leadership position like the POTUS. The same probably can't be said for John Q. Shyguy in accounting.

One could also argue that excellence is subjective. Hippies probably look at excellence in a different manner compared to either you or I.

It's fair to say that you can assume a man or woman who has achieved the position of CEO in a publicly traded company to possess a skill set and range of experience relevant to POTUS.

The same concept could be applied to any number of positions (x).

I don't see the relationship as being black and white. I see it as being black and sock. For the most part, when you think about a good "sock," you shouldn't be thinking "black." Are some black socks really good? Yes, but that's more a coincidence than it is a function of blackness.

I agree, appearances of individuals should hold absolutely zero weight in determining intellectual prowess or leadership potential.

You want the sock with the most comfy material that will best suit the needs of what you're trying to do.

The color or appearance of the CEO/business person is of no importance. Their moral fabric is of the utmost importance.

You wouldn't want Ken Lay as POTUS... not that you even could, as he is in federal prison.

I think a great scientists in office would do wonders. The designer in me thinks a great engineer would have his head up his a** the whole time, but let's give it a shot anyways! But it doesn't really matter to me where they came from as long as they're great.

China, unfortunately, is way ahead of us. The majority of their leading politicians are engineers and scientists. No wonder they are making huge leaps and bounds on all fronts.

[IBCoupe]

The color or appearance of the CEO/business person is of no importance. Their moral fabric is of the utmost importance.

In my view, the fact that they're a CEO is of no importance, either. Now, it seems like you've laid the groundwork necessary to make the argument that qualified presidential candidates are more likely than not to be CEO's. That argument might even be right, but I don't think that means we start our search for the best possible President in the Fortune 500.

China, unfortunately, is way ahead of us. The majority of their leading politicians are engineers and scientists. No wonder they are making huge leaps and bounds on all fronts.

Also, I hear that they don't bother as much as we do in compensating their citizenry for actions of eminent domain.

[mattblancarte]

Totally agree with you in that the business world should be one of the last places we look for candidates.

To be honest, if I had billions of dollars and enough influence to have a real hand in it, I would do everything in my power to make Neil deGrasse Tyson POTUS. Plenty of vision. Plenty of media training, plenty of leadership experience, brilliant intellect, loved by the public, open opponent to war and conflict, etc.

He probably wouldn't want to be a politician, but it'd be nice to put someone in office almost against their will for once. As was done to George Washington.

Also, I hear that they don't bother as much as we do in compensating their citizenry for actions of eminent domain.

Perhaps I went too far to say they are way ahead of us.

[IBCoupe]

The name sounds familiar, but I don't know anything about him off the top of my head.

[mattblancarte]

He's a world-famous astrophysicist, author, Director of the Hayden Planetarium at the Rose Center for Earth and Space, and a Research Associate in the Department of Astrophysics at the American Museum of Natural History.

Über baller nerd.

And he's black.

[IBCoupe]

The only way he'd lose an election now is if he turns out to be a gay Jew, too.

Wikipedia says he's a "Science Communicator," which makes me think of (a) Star Trek and (b) watching the kids from the Math Club try to ask girls to prom.

In all seriousness, science needs more ambassadors to laypeople. Too many misconceptions, and only some of those are accidental.

[stebo0728]

Well, they've been announcing all day on the local am station here that Herman Cain is having his last show tonight, and has a big announcement. Campaign rules can be the only reason for him to set his show aside, so I fully expect his presidential bid announcement to be tonight.

Oh happy day! You guys will soon know who he is.

[IBCoupe]

I look forward to loathing his very core.

[stebo0728]

I dont think the average NPR employee will like him much, probably not many NPR frequenters either

[IBCoupe]

Don't know enough about him to understand your point.

The reason I'll loathe him is... well, I haven't ever really needed a reason, to be honest.

[stebo0728]

He supports the FairTax, that will be your first reason ...

He's a business man, that will be your second reason ...

As far as third, fourth, and fifth, I'll let you decide

He's a no nonsense, all common sense, say it how it is kinda fella, you might find that appealing about him

[IBCoupe]

Well, the "FairTax" might be "common," but it doesn't make much sense.

And I've already been quite clear about my position on "businessmen," and it's either insulting to me or to you for you to continue to call that position a default "against."

Though, I do like a "say it how it is" kinda guy.

[stebo0728]

Fair enough, the progressive income tax doesnt make much sense in my estimation, thats just a point on contention

The business experience, your right, if I understand your position correctly, its not a disqualifier, but its not an additional qualifier either right?

And who wouldnt like a "say it how it is" kind of person?

[IBCoupe]

You got it. My roommate recently gave me grief about buying staggered wheels. I told him, "I got a set of forged aluminum wheels that retail for $3200, and I only paid $1200. Yeah, I'm not out looking for staggered wheels, but I'm not going to turn down a fantastic deal because some come along." A great candidate to me is a great candidate, regardless of their background.

As to your second question: the Rose-Colored Glasses Industrial Complex

[stebo0728]

http://video.foxnews.com/#/v/4544494/ha ... t_id=87485

http://video.foxnews.com/v/4544189/herm ... at-critics

He's shaping up nicely, might just be a heavy hitter in 2012