help...please..

[r34 gtr]

the "its alive!!" thread just didnt seem to convey the right message, so i figured i would make a new one in which to continue my pathetic whining and to list my failed attempts at getting the car to start. so here we are.

well, to recap whats going on, the car wont fire. i dont have the slightest clue why. ive got a huge, fat spark and plenty of fuel. today i checked all the wires going into and out of the ecu. of course, they were all fine. the maf reads correctly and the resistances on it are what they should be. the CAS is what it should be as per the fsm. there are no blown fuses and i havnt been able to find any loose or unplugged wires. like my dad said, the car is perfect, it just wont fire.

the only thing that may be a clue as to what is going on is that the tach is dead. it doesnt move when i try and start it. the safcII is reading about half the rpm it should be (last time i checked anyway) so that is also puzzling, as the CAS seems to be all fine and dandy.

there are only 2 things i can think of that could be wrong, either the ecu is fried (but then why would i have fuel and spark?) or the safc is fried or something so it cant do its job (also doubtful, as it doesnt seem like it would go down easy). anyway, ive got no idea. im stumped. someone please say something insightful, this is rediculous.

- tim

[c-rad]

If the SAFC is reading half what it should it is either hooked up wrong or is set wrong. You have it set on 4cyl with the arrow pointing up like this-- / right? Not insulting your intelligence but it has happened to more than a few people I know!

[RMiller]

Maybe you keep flooding it. And/or maybe the safc is dumping too much fuel in. You compression is good? If you know you have fuel and spark then it's got to be lack of compression or too much fuel. Or...maybe the spark is firing at the wrong time. Check your ignition timing. If compression is bad/absent then check cam timing. My bet is that it's flooded for some reason.

You'll get it, then you'll have some fun. It's a blast! Especially in the rain.

[redamnavit]

I just read the "its alive" thread. You mentioned a SWAT ECU. Like this one?

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors...&rd=1

Do you still have the original injectors to hook up and try out? I'd leave the Z32 MAF in place and swap back to those if possible. Get the SAFC settings dialed in with just the MAF compensation, then figure out how to adjust -those- numbers for the larger injectors.

[pulsar gtr]

If you are getting spark and fuel, the engine should run.

I would first mention this to every one, and please make a note of it.

When ever you do a swap, don't add any electronics devices UNTIL the engine runs and runs good, then you can add these devices otherwise it could cause you a serious headaches.

If you are getting spark and fuel, I would look into timing issue. If the timing is off, you will get spark and fuel but it won't start.

It Can't be the Cas, as you are getting spark.

Does it back fire at all? and are the injectors new/refurbished?

I read the other thread a while back, so I can't remember all the details.

Tim, I would suggest to disconnect all the electronic devices and rehook the wiring to its original setting, then when the car runs, I would start to add one device at a time.

Good luck,

PULSAR GTRRafi

[Myetball]

Had a similar experience with a 6-bolt 4G63T with JDM cyclone manifold swap into a '96 Talon Tsi. We made the costly mistake of aligning the cam gears 180 deg. off. Had spark and fuel, would crank and crank but not run. Having bent 8 of 16 valves left us with no compression.

Run a compression check.

[r34 gtr]

ill run a compression test, but i checked and the timing is pretty much dead-on. the engine was also just rebuilt.

the injectors are not new or refurbished but they are all working as they should (checked them myself).

the car ran fine before i rebuilt the engine, so i dont see what the problem is now, as the only thing i added electronics wise is the z32 maf (though i do agree with rafi, dont add these things until the car runs. itll save some real pain).

the car does NOT backfire. i tried unhooking the safc but got no change.

redamnavit: its just like that one, but the pin is just connected directly to the board, it isnt socketed. ive got the injectors (somewhere) and i can try those if need be... though the safc is set correctly. there should be no problem there but whatever, ill try anything right now.

the part we dont understand is that the car ran and drove for 3 days, then it just wouldnt start one morning and hasnt since. the only problem we were having was that at the time i had the maf wired wrong and the safc wasnt set up quite right. now its all sorted out and it wont start. its very ghey.

on the bright side of things, i got my vlsd in the mail today! its gonna be schweet. got the z32 unit for those slightly lower gears, since i do a decent amount of highway driving and i want my engine to not die from over-revving at 80mph (stupid 4.08 rear end making me do 4k rpm at 79mph). now the car should top out around 175mph, and i intend to check it as soon as i get my cage put in.

thanks for the help guys, keep it coming! i will find the problem, mark my words!

- tim

[c-rad]

So you got the TT Z32 3.70 rear end output flanges and axles???

Did you check all the fuses? No engine codes displayed?

[pulsar gtr]

HI Tim,

Now, how do you know that the injectors are opening, they might have power and fuel but if they are dirty they might not be spraying.I know you said the car was running and it died or just won't start no more.Do a quick test, if you haven't already.

1) Make sure you have spark on all sparkplugs2) Make sure the spark is bright not weak3)Check all fuses4) Can you do diagnostics on the ecu? what errors does the ecu show?5)Disconnect the MAF completely, (car will still start but won't rev) this way you will illiminate any shorts6) Don't just disconnect the safc,make sure you put the original wires back to their original places ( you probably already done that).7) check for the relays.8)I Would double check the timing belt again, to make sure it is set on the right marks, a possibility that the tensioner got loose after 3 days of driving due to insufficient torque

9) remove the CAS and look at exhaust cam, you might have broken the latch on it where the cam fits and you are getting the wrong timing , happened to me a while back10) If the timing is good and the cas/cam are good, your problem is electrical.

11) get yourself a quick start fluid and spray in the intake and try starting the car, this will illiminate the injectors

Good luck,PULSAR GTRRafi

[float_6969]

Tim, I'm with Rafi all the way on this one. I've been away the last few days, so I haven't been around to help, but everything he's said is EXACTLY what I would do if it was my car.

[r34 gtr]

well, ive done everything he said, more than once actually. those coils are freaking blasting voltage across those plugs, to the tune of about 45-50kV. i got some new bada$s denso plugs and the car will fire up instantly now, but it still wont run. its leaned out 50% with the safc but its still getting heavy overfuelling on startup. i think theres nothing wrong, i just cant lean out the car enough when it first starts to get it to run. unfortunately im freaking broke, so i cant afford anything, unless someone has a standlaone they arent using they want to trade me for lots of stuff and a couple hundred bucks. ill happily take an e-manage too. damn you apexi!!! im going to go cry now. stupid safc is just too limited with its tuning options, i need to be able to mess with the startup maps and stuff or this car is never going to move.

- tim

edit: oh, forgot to mention, all voltages are correct. everything is peachy electrical wise. the ecu gives a code 55, so all is well.

[c-rad]

Ok, maybe I missed something, but what size injectors are you running? There is no way the SAFC should be leaned out to -50% at idle. Even with upgraded injectors, the idle settings are not too far off because you need to compensate for the dead time of the injector. Example, if you were running 550cc injectors, your 1K setting should be around -12% to -14% even though the injectors are 33% larger. If you are running as rich as you say you are, these are the only things I can think of to cause it-- dead O2 sensor or bad MAF or MAF connection (would cause the ECU to run in open loop mode and provide MAX fuel to save the engine from leaning out) but either of those would throw a code. Second guess would be a dead FPR that is stuck closed and the pressure in the rail is extraordinarily high. Third and final guess would be injector(s) that are stuck open. Whatever it is, something is seriously fubar'd. There has to be some type of oversight here or something. If the ONLY thing you changed between the motor and now is a Z32 MAF. You said the timing is "pretty much" on. Well, it either is or isn't. A few degrees can make the difference between starting or not. I mean, if it starts to spark as any of the valves are beginning to open or haven't yet closed, it's NOT going to start and your plugs will just get soaked with gas.

[Trigger]

what about bad gas

[Myetball]

Have you verified the injectors are firing in the proper sequence. CA is batch fire but if they were firing at the wrong time it would cause big problems. Dunno if you messed with the injector wiring for the SAFC, just thinking out loud.

[r34 gtr]

well, it runs now... got rid of the 7 month old gas and changed the plugs to the baddest a$s ones i could find. thing started instantly, but it wont run on its own when it has the maf plugged in. i checked EVERYTHING wiring wise, but everything is as it should be. the maf, o2 sensor and everything are working correctly. the ecu diagnostics say that its running more than 5% rich with the safc leaned out 50% from 800-2200 rpm. we found that it is possible to reconnect the maf while the car is running and it will keep running. dont know why it runs fine in its "get-u-home" mode. because the car runs, we timed it and it is set dead on 15 degrees. ive just got too much fuel, but why? im buying a nismo fpr today, we will see if that helps.

- tim

[float_6969]

I still think you should try and back-wire to a CA MAFS and see if that fixes the problem. I know it's a pain in the ***, but I think it's going to solve your problem. I really think it's the MAFS/plug/wiring...

[r34 gtr]

well, last night it ran like a swiss watch and i drove it around for the better part of an hour. it still doesnt like to idle when cold, but when its hot it runs fine. im guessing i just need to play with the safc more. dont get me wrong, theres still something wrong, but at least now it can be coaxed to run.

- tim

[r34 gtr]

ok, well, never mind. this morning it wont start again. this is so wierd, last night it ran so well. i dont know what to do with this thing. aaaarrrrgh!!!

- tim

[biosehnsucht]

when I had my coil power hotwired at the relay socket (don't ask) it worked fine at first, and eventually could barely run, then wouldn't start at all because it was getting a bad connection (and was vibrating loose over time).. but you say you have spark so that shouldn't be it.

also my coil #1 was 400+ ohhms resistance not .6 - .8, and it didn't make hardly any powre as it wasn't firing most of the time, if the MAF was connected it would actually stall after warming up, if I disconnected it it was fine, and it was giving the MAF error code but the wiring was fine - as it turned out because that one cyl wasn't burning the ECU was seeing crazy rich condition and so kept trying to lean out, just to see a lean condition and go back, and quickly decided the MAF was no good and switched to limp mode, which made it run reliably badly.

but it would always start even if it died after 5-10 seconds..

does yours not start at all, or it stalls immediately?

might check also the ground wire on the coil subharness is attatched to the head (goes to one of the screws holding the little cover the wire goes through at the back of the coil/plug valley under the coil cover).. not that it's likely to be the cause but that it would be easy not to hook up, its small.

check your battery voltage, perhaps there's enough to crank but not run properly, I also had that problem after I forgot to unhook the glovebox light since I hadn't installed the glovebox it was on overnight.. had to swap batteries to one w/ more juice.

all I can think of right..

[r34 gtr]

ive checked all those things, doesnt seem to be the problem. ive got the CA maf back on right now and it made little to no difference. though now i can coax the car to start without having to remove the maf plug. could a leak in the manifold or something cause this?

- tim

[r34 gtr]

you guys are going to love this. the other day i decided to drive my car over to a friend's house so i could put some more miles on it and see how it ran. one of the heater hoses had a crack but it wasnt huge so i drove it and topped it off when i got there. when it came time to head back home, i got in the car and started off down the street. i noticed that the car was making a sort of intermittant grinding noise when i pushed in the clutch but figured it was just in need of bleeding. so i get to the bottom of the hill at the end of this street and i go to change gear and when i push the pedal, it sinks to the floor. i coasted down to a busier street (at 230am, so no cars though) and called a friend to give me a tow. just thought it was funny how i was so worried about the coolant and how the car was running that i didnt notice the seals on my slave cylinder were gone until it was too late.

on the other side of things, it seems to run alright, despite having some issues with the safc and tuning the car. ill keep everyone updated!

- tim