Help, my 89 SOHC wont start up

[pro_leonk]

Hi guys,

I recently bought a 8/89 Nissan 240sx with 160k on engine and transmission, all stock. The time I bought it, the owner told me that the fuel injectors were leaking badly. I thought no big problem, get new O-rings and new rubber gormets and that should be fine. (Note: the car was in a not very well maintained condition, was low on oil, no clutch fluid and low power steering fluid)

I bought it, drove around in town, and sometimes stalled on me because of the exessive fuel the engine got (e.g. driving from 50mph then stopping at a red light) 5secs later, it started up fine again.

On the way home, it stalled on me three times. The frist time, it started up with in a minute. The next half mile i had to always stay on the gas, otherwise t he rpms would have dropped to far and it would have stalled. Waiting at the light, I could smell the fuel not being burnt properly, hence, there was a lot of white smoking coming from the exhaust.I drive on mile, it stall again... but this time i can see some slight smoke coming from the hood. i jump out, and smell some electrical stuff burning up. I poured some water near the injectors ( i was afraid that the leaking fuel would catch on fire, or thought that was the problem)I pull over, engine cranks but doesnt fire up. After waiting for 20mins, it finally starts again. Pulled over to a gas station and got some gas (91oct, dont know what the previous owner used) and poured in a quart of chevron 10w-30 oil. Engine starts up again, no problem.

i drive for another 5 miles, it stalls again. Heard some ticking noise when i pressed more on the gas while driving in 4th between 2500-3000rpm.Last time it stalls again, doesnt start up, only cranks...had to tow the last few miles home.

At home, i replaced the fuel injector rubber gormets... no more leaking!Now, when i try to crank it, it just turns over. I replaced the spark plugs and the spark plug wires (were cracked)

I am still confused, why it doesnt want to start up anymore. I found out that the fuel injectors are not firing at all, so i dont have fuel. I get fuel till the fuel injectors. I guess they dont get a signal to fire... the cables are in fairly bad condition, but should be able to send a signal through.

The check engine light is on as well... i pulled the codes, and i got a code 55 - which means no malfuntion. I guess that doesnt help me further.

I hope that there is something that i am missing out or not realizing... but i hope you guys know more then me. Any help, hints or further troubleshooting is greately appreciated!thanks in advance!

[NISTECH]

First how did you determine the injectors aren't firing? If the check engine light was on while you were driving you should have a code other then 55 perhaps you accidently erased them? Do some of the basic checks first. Check for spark while cranking, Check your fuel pressure, If you didnt use a noid light to check you injector pulse go get one and test it. Also check all your fuses.

[pro_leonk]

thanks nistech for replying and taking the time reading my long post!

Well, i first removed the fuel rail again, to make sure that all injectors werent leaking anymore. Injector on cylinder #4 was still leaking, because i damaged the O-ring when i installed it. fixed that. after that, i got a bit stupid. i didnt put the injectors back(still on the fuel rails, but not screwed down into the engine), and cranked the engine. not a single drop came out of em...

the time i bought the car, the check engine light was going on from time to time due to the leaking fuel injectors, and i guess a very rich fuel mixture. however, when i drove it home, it was off most of the time and only stayed on when when it stalled and didnt want to start anymore. (that was like almost 3weeks ago, then the battery died) i highly doubt that i erased the error codes yesterday. the check engine light is always on, even after disconneting the battery.

- i got spark- i checked all fuses, still all in working condition- i got fuel till the injectors, but not too sure if i have sufficent pressure... could that be the fuel pressure regulator?

here, a small video clip when i start to crank it: http://proleonk.ws/S13crank.wmvis that normal that the oil pressure light goes off after one second? also, all the sensors (seatbelt, open door, and e-brake) stay on all the time... all fuses are fine though. some other electircal issue with the fuel injectors?

thanks again

[NISTECH]

it is normal for several lights to be on when the car is not running ,including the CEL. The oil light will go out when it builds enough pressure to turn the light off. As far as checkin the injectors. go down to autozone and pick up a noid light for a gm vehicle that will work in your injector connectors. They are less then 5 bucks. This will tell you weather or not the ECM is telling them to fire.

[pro_leonk]

it is normal for several lights to be on when the car is not running ,including the CEL. The oil light will go out when it builds enough pressure to turn the light off. As far as checkin the injectors. go down to autozone and pick up a noid light for a gm vehicle that will work in your injector connectors. They are less then 5 bucks. This will tell you weather or not the ECM is telling them to fire.

i actually meant, that those lights are always on. if i turn the key to ACC, the lights usually go on, but stay on, regardless on what position they are. i was trying to tell you, that e.g. the e-brake light is on, if it is pulled up or not, the same with the door ajar and seatbelts (they were working before, duno if a conenction burnt... i checked all fuses and they are ok) i am just thinking, if that "could" relate to the non firing injectors. or just bad sensors?

anyways, i will pick up those noid lights. i hope they have them. (just checked online, no results found...) u said for a GM vehicle, right? they use the same injector connectors sizes? any specific year? and i guess i should get 4 of the noid lights.

thanks again

[NISTECH]

No you only need one. They are not an exact fit to the terminals but they work. There are I think 3 GM styles, you want to get the one with the small pins but the wider apart of the 2 smaller pin ones. I see what your saying about your lights when you pull the key out the lights are still on. That has been traced to altenator or wiring to the altenator before.

[pro_leonk]

i got a noid lite (part #25143 for GM), but wasnt able to to try anything further. They seem to fit, eventhough they were still a bit loose... but should be fine.i had a quick look at the fuel injector connectors, and they seem to be not in the best shape anymore... the connectors are badly covered in sticky dirty, and the wires at the end are not completely insulated anymore. i will do my best tomorrow morning and see if the ECU actually sends out a signal and lights up the noid :P

thanks for the hints

[zero_gripS13]

sounds like that fire burnt some electrical wires and is messing some thing up...

[pro_leonk]

hm, it didnt really catch on fire, it just smoked a lil bit.

well, i connected the noid lite today, and surprisingly they do get a signal to fire!i checked on all of 4 connectors, all went on around 4-5 times a second - what seems to be the normal firing rate at ~1000rpm.

ok, i guess this leaves me with the following options. i get fuel delivered up to the fuel injectors...-not efficent fuel pressure-defective fuel regulator-fried fuel injectorsor something else...

[NISTECH]

check fuel pressure with a gauge. should be around 35psi. If you got that I seriously doubt all 4 injectors are fried.

[pro_leonk]

alright, some better news this time. atleast i think im getting somewhere

i checked the fuel pressure with my homemade pressure gauge. pressure diplayed around 40psi when cranking - so that is good.

the fuel pressure regulator vacuum cable was a little bit wigly, and guess that is what caused insufficent pressure to the injectors last time. now the injectors are firing again! atleast 3 out of 4. i believe its either fried or got a bad connection.

well, when cranking, it tries very hard, but still doesnt... it seems like the first 3 cylinders just run dry, then the 4th one is able to make a proper combustion. i could hear this clearly when my battery was running out of juice again. i also could see the engine vibrating (moving more around), meaning that combustion was taking place. i will upload a small video tomorrow.

my friend thought that the distributer and the spark plug wires where placed incorectly, and that i have to rotate the distributer counterclock wise. i am not to sure about this... and dont really know how this would affect the startup. i know that the firing order would, but right now im am very confused and dont really know what to do next.

i dont really want to tow it to a shop, atleast not as of yet.

[NISTECH]

Once you have your battery recharged hold your foot on the floor and crank the hell out of it. See if it will fire then. Sounds to me like its flooding out.

[pro_leonk]

i tried doing that till the battery died

[NISTECH]

Pop your distributor cap off and look inside it for cracks or carbon tracking[ looks like white or gray spots on the plastic to either side of the elctrodes for the plug wires]. They will have some directly behind them that is normal.

[pro_leonk]

k, will check up on that tomorrow. wanted to replace the distributer cap anyways, regardless of cracks or not.what about the numbering system. when i replaced the spark plug wires, i was to much of an idiot and just started pulling them off, without labeling them or looking which ones goes where. anyways, my point im trying to make is, if the numbers on the distributer cap match the cylinder number or the firing order?

thanks again nistech

[NISTECH]

they match the cyl starting with 1 going clock wise 1342

[NISTECH]

BTW thats also the firing order obviously.

[pro_leonk]

ok, i think i got really confused there somewhere... dont know what i was thinking, but now it makes all sense again!

k, i checked the distributer cap, there were some small carbon trackings which i easily removed with a srewdriver. i tried cranking it again, and it didnt seem to make a difference. the day before i tried to move the distributer counter-clockwise and clockwise to change the timing. no success either.
Modified by pro_leonk at 9:52 AM 7/11/2005

[IzzyTrippin]

take the injectors out and put 12 volts through them, if you hear a click it's working. borrow a voltage meter and check while all the injectors are inpluged, crank the car and test the harness connectors to see if the connectors are sending any current. it sounds as though you may have fried the wiring harness.in case you haven't yet, check the vaccuum lines too. you should be able to find full diagnostics in the FSM, do a search with google for "240sx fsm pdf"

[NISTECH]

Izzy he has already established the ECM is firing the injectors with a noid light.

[pro_leonk]

in case you haven't yet, check the vaccuum lines too. you should be able to find full diagnostics in the FSM, do a search with google for "240sx fsm pdf"

i got actually the original factory service manual in paper. u said to check for vaccum line? which ones are you talking a bout? intake? fuel? i know that my vaccuum hose for the fuel regulator wasnt connected properly, thats why the fuel injectors didnt spray any fuel.lemme know,

thanks

[pro_leonk]

dont know why my old post got posted again...

ok, i dont know what to do next... once again. i am planning on realigning/matching the firing times. dont know what else could be wrong...

actually thinking back way to the beginning, the time i bought the car, there might have been another issue. the cooland was fairly low, and now im thinking that maybe the car over heated when i drove it home (cant remember looking at the temp gauge) rather the fuel on the intake creating the issue. also, the radiator seems to be dry, eventhough i filled it up.would this make any sense? please let me know.


Modified by pro_leonk at 9:42 PM 7/12/2005