Help buying my first car

[CarlW]

I've always liked Zs and I've been shopping around for my first car. I'm oblivious to these cars so that's why I'm here.

I found a z32 na 5 speed for a good deal price but I don't know if it's worth the buy.

The car already has powertrix coilovers and a Greddy exhaust and runs and drives. T - tops don't leak either. Everything works it's just the outside that's the problem. The body panels and doors and t tops are all different colors.

That's not a concern for me though because repaint is always an option.

After talking to the guy I've learned that the door is rusted but comes with a new door in good condition as well as another mirror for the passengers side. He said eventually it could use new up joints too.
The rear taillights aren't perfect but I could get a set off of eBay.

My main fear is the few small dents In the rear quarter panel. I know from my dad telling me that those are not cheap repairs.

After browsing the Web I've seen that some stores sell kits to pop out small enough dents. Also a kid at my school says he's handy at popping out dents and he could do it for cheap. Only problem is I have no idea (yet) how deep the dents are and how many there are.
The car for what it has is a fair price, but I need input on if these really are quick/easy fixes (more importantly; CHEAP).

Anyway here's the car. Should I stay away or go for it?

[CarlW]

[NolimitZ32]

As a general rule, unless upon personal inspection the car is immaculate, i mean actually immaculate and has been properly and completely maintained and serviced I would by all means stay away from a Z32 as a first car and daily driver.

[Afi]

As a general rule, unless upon personal inspection the car is immaculate, i mean actually immaculate and has been properly and completely maintained and serviced I would by all means stay away from a Z32 as a first car and daily driver.

^^^Should probably stay away even as a summer car!
Seriously OP, unless you are pretty good with a wrench, proceed with caution. Even if the car is in pretty good mechanic shape than you got to drop money for preventive maintenance.
What's the mileage? Was a 60k or 120k timing belt service done? Was the PTU recall done if the car is a 90-92? How is the compression in each cylinders? That are just couple of questions out of my head. More knowledgeable members would have a lot more.

[CarlW]

What's so bad about it?

[NolimitZ32]

Its a 20+ year old GT/luxury sports car that was designed and built around the engine, an engine which produces a ton of heat in a very crammed space, this causes all plastic and electrical connections to bake and fall apart, this leads to gremlins, the Z32 is mechanically a great car but at its age it will usually need a full reseal (all gaskets and seals) and most of the time a new EFI harness and power harnesses. That's not mentioning things like bushings, struts, wheel bearings, brakes, etc. This was never meant to be an economy car so all the OEM bits are high quality and therefore expensive to replace (even as maintenance items). A first car should be safe, economical, easy to drive and cheap to own, a Z32 is safe, NOT economical, NOT easy to drive in anything but perfect summer weather, and it is certainly NOT cheap to own and maintain.

[DCaff300ZX]

^^^This.
To answer your question about the condition of the car you pictured, the car looks like it could use some serious TLC which for a TT costs BIG bucks beyond the body work and paint- most likely why the PO is selling it. I hate to put on the car's owner without knowing him, but generally a Z32 in that shape is a project car for a relatively able, mechanically-inclined guy who knows or knows someone who knows Z's, and most likely has a donor car with upgraded parts or a upgraded powerplant.
A Z32 is a fairly finicky bastard and hard to work on for the average mechanic of which I myself am, I do most of my own work but currently am looking at a $3,500 bill for replacement turbos and downpipes, a new clutch, and main seal fix plus 120K service while the beast is out.

I'm sure that you could do a lot better with your money than the car you pictured buying a more "average" car with better repair costs and history instead of a Z32, unless you plan on learning the car and doing all of the work you can yourself.

[CarlW]

I would like to learn about the car. With my dad's help I'm sure we could fix it up ( the owner says it drives fine it's just the bodywork) but on the part about not being economical nor cheap to own, that's my problem. I told my dad about it and he says the same thing you guys are saying but he says I can spend my money on it if I want.

And this Is actually the first car I am buying myself. I do already have a 91 maxima auto that my parents gave me but it leaves me stranded every time I drive it. Every time my dad fixes it something else breaks.

I want a fun reliable car and the owner told me all what's wrong with it and he says he just drove it to VA and back (he lives in Ohio) with no problems.

Basically I CAN afford the car IF nothing mechanical goes wrong. And from what you guys are saying that may be a slim chance.

Still don't know though... Full Greddy exhaust from the headers back and Powertrix coilovers man!! I'd just buy it and paint it and drive it!

[NolimitZ32]

Ok, look, I know you really really really REALLY!!!!! want it, and you are here to try to justify buying it, you are waiting on at least one person to say something along the lines of "Nah man it'll be a great car, just go for it, YOLO JDM TYTE YO". In reality you will end up with a headache that will likely ultimately end up with yet another Z32 in a junkyard or rusting in a back yard. Its a really bad idea to try to make this your daily driver. I have had all sorts of cars since I was 16 and I lived through exactly the pain which I am describing to you right now multiple times, which is why I am so adamant about trying to make it seem like a bad idea, because it is. If you want to learn to work on a car then by all means get the Z its as good a car as any to learn on but, you should by all means get a reliable cheap boring daily driver unless you can afford to spend days or potentially weeks without your car and can afford to fix it. Great example is the 120k miles maintenance package, usually takes an experienced and mechanically inclined owner or Z mechanic a full day at best to complete. At shop rates (and you can't just go to any shop, its gotta be a Z shop) you are paying something like $100/hour for a job that takes lets say 8 hours, that $800 in labor, not counting the $600 for parts. IF in the end of the day you do decide you want it and you are going to ignore all we've said then at the least find a Z32 guru or someone with Z32 experience and take them with you to look at the car. Z32 GURU, not that kid at your school who has a riced out Honda and thinks he's Dominic Toretto or Brian O'Connor.

[Afi]

Great example is the 120k miles maintenance package, usually takes an experienced and mechanically inclined owner or Z mechanic a full day at best to complete. At shop rates (and you can't just go to any shop, its gotta be a Z shop) you are paying something like $100/hour for a job that takes lets say 8 hours, that $800 in labor, not counting the $600 for parts. IF in the end of the day you do decide you want it and you are going to ignore all we've said then at the least find a Z32 guru or someone with Z32 experience and take them with you to look at the car. Z32 GURU, not that kid at your school who has a riced out Honda and thinks he's Dominic Toretto or Brian O'Connor.

Spot on! My 120k cost me 1500$ at the dealer (76$/hr because they give a discount on old cars and they have a mechanic that has been working on Z since the 240Z). So, basically, I dropped 1500$ for a 120k maintenance on a car that had 54k miles at the time. I did that for peace of mind for a summer car that was in perfect running condition that sees around 3k miles per summer. Last summer, we are talking another 1200$ for calipers rebuild and tension rods. So basically, in two summers, we close to 3000$ for preventive maintenance for a car that ran around 6k miles and I'm not even taking into account oil change and fuel. OP, that is the kind of money we are talking here. Indeed, I could of saved money by doing the work myself (which I can't to be honest) but you get my point. Now imagine if my car had real issues. Once again, proceed with caution.

[DCaff300ZX]

OP, consider also that your '91 Maxima is acting JUST like a '90's Z32 will act without the kind of maintenance mentioned above, and more. 20-year old cars all have a tendency to be unreliable unless it's been maintained in a really consistent way, end even then things do tend to wear out just from time or other issues such as electrolysis and heat.
I bought my current Z in SF and drove it back, not a hitch or anything wrong with it but immediately I went in and replaced the entire fuel delivery system, vacuum hoses, and replaced the injector connectors and several other connectors along the way that were corroded or broken or both. Almost every connector in the engine bay needs to be inspected and cleaned/replaced even in a really clean Z. Then came new tires which are easily in the $1,500 to $2,000 range for 18" ZR speed rated tires, a battery, and a complete fluid service to the car. All done just as Afi wrote, simply for piece of mind and knowledge these areas would not be problems in the future.
Now, two years later a turbo is down and several other areas of the car all at once as well, all beyond my means at this time and so off to my Z guy it goes for $3,500 in service costs. I paid $1,200 for new turbos and downpipes, and +/- $300 for clutch and rear main seal. My '93 also has the earlier injectors that fail from ethanol and electrolysis, a $700-$1,200 cost for the future that WILL come.
I've also had to replace the intake hard pipes with silicone pipes, replace the PVC's and hoses, and fix several other small issues which have totaled about $1K cost- so, you HAVE been warned both by your current car, and all of us about what you will be undertaking.

BTW, I say this having been EXACTLY where you are when I was your age, a '67 big block fastback Mustang was in my sights. My Dad did exactly as your Dad did, and I bought the heap from some drug dealer it turned out and I forever learned a valuable lesson as it just killed me financially and rarely ran right. I later bought a nice '67 GTA big block fastback that had none of the problems of that first car, but a FAR steeper price tag and it eventually had to have a new motor as well. I blew about $5K on a 600+ HP build that I did myself and never really came out right completely, and it was sold off to some lucky stiff for the money I had into it (and even then only because I had some really rare parts)...so realize that we have all been there, done that, and we are FAR from the first to have done so...

[CarlW]

I've read through all of your posts guys and I've decided to stay away from the car. I've got a job, but not a good one plus I'm still in high school.

Now my sights are on either a subaru impreza wagon (winters get harsh here)

Or a 96-00 honda civic sedan.

Which is a better first car?

[NolimitZ32]

For a DD, and if you know how to drive in snow the Civic will be a great car. I still miss my EK hatch, it was one of my favorite cars (and I've owned lifter 4x4s, 300+whp subarus and my very built Z32) The subie will be a nice car to roll in as well, however because of the popularity of those cars a lot of them get beat on pretty badly so when you go to buy make sure the car is a virgin (no aftermarket) and that it was treated well because lots of subies have trans problems, and if treated badly can literally fall apart. I grenaded the first trans in my 02 wrx so trust me this comes from experience

[DCaff300ZX]

GOOD call and I agree with the Civic, but also by all means if you feel strongly about a Z32 then see about checking the car out more thoroughly with some advise here, and continuing to haggle that guy and maybe still buying it as a 2nd /project car. You can learn a lot of things for the future with the car and get plenty of how-to help here, and you won't kill your work life if the Z isn't running.
Best way to go IMO if you really, REALLY want a Z32...and there's no reason why not with ample warning, and NOT as a first DD.

[nexus08]

Man you guys are harsh! I say just go for it!!!

No... just kidding. LOL. What they said above.

A nice car that looks good and is probably really reliable too is a Toyota Celica, either a 94-99 model (go closer to the 99 range to avoid the age), or a 2000+ model (which is a bit more of a girl car in my book). I like the 94-99 version a lot.



With a little 4 cylinder it gets great gas millage and looks to have lots of room in the engine compartment for ease of maintenance.

As much as all of us on our board love our cars, it is telling for us to say "Don't do it!!!"

[nexus08]

Oh and for Honda's, I know everyone says they last forever.

I've had two that started having bad emissions problems after only 100,000 miles or so. They will run forever yes, but if you have to have emissions testing, I'm not so sure they do as well as people say.

[DCaff300ZX]

Agreed on the Hondas, I myself was looking at the V6 Accord models for a DD as well as the Celicas mentioned above. I personally can't drive cars I don't like and or beaters, and these models are at the top of my list of serviceable, economical, but fairly sporty cars.
I currently am looking for a good deal on a '94-'99 I4 engine Celica with decent maintenance records and miles for a DD in the next year, so the TT can begin to rest and stop eating all of my extra $ when I'm not ready for it...and would certainly be a good choice for the OP and perhaps leave him with $ to get the Z or another one as a project/2nd car.
See what we're doing here, we're showing you the way to go about owning your first Z32...

Here's some examples of what I'd look for as that first Z32- one with a few good things to start with and the rest up to you:
http://seattle.craigslist.org/sno/cto/4356989777.html
http://seattle.craigslist.org/sno/cto/4372519397.html
http://seattle.craigslist.org/skc/cto/4365787924.html
I realize these aren't in your area, but check out some of the other Z32 ads while you're there for an idea of the price ranges and what some people expect you to buy versus what aren't a problem i some of the other Z's. You REALLY want your engine and drive train to be in the best possible state maintenance-wise buying your first Z32.