Getting power w/o turboing the ka24de block

[1995s-14]

Ive heard that cams are a hot mod on the ka block. any certain types of cams to use? what about lightened belt pulleys? im ooking for some power. thanks

[Slipstream]

I think the cheap cams to use are off the S13 DE engine. You can also just get a cold air intake, exhaust, and those type of bolt ons, but you probably won't see huge gains. All depends on what type of power you want.

[Chukidori]

Best bang for the buck = set of Nice headers, and a decent Cat-back. Dont get 3" piping it will be too loud and obnoxious. The stock exhaust is incredibly restrictive.

Cams also dont go on the block...They go on the head.

As far as potential gains....No non turbo KA here has yet to break 200hp....

[1995s-14]

so s13 cams are better than any aftermarket cams you can put on the head or are just a good cheap swap? will aftermarket ones be any better or are you just paying alot for a little? any headers you guys reccommend?

[kenjimatic]

before you do any cam swaps i recomend you to go i/h/e first because the intanke and the exhaust are really restrictive.....the s13 cam swap is something cheap to do but if you want more power for cam wise go brian crower v2's or jwt...the v2's are much more affordable compared to the jwt's...i'm still waiting on a set of v2's to come in the mail...

This is actually from bigvinnie's write up from club240.comheres the link since the pics aren't uphttp://www.club240.com/forums/...30440

(PROOF) That NA KA can make 200CHP on $1000

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Well it's been over a year since I last did the thread on how to power your KA24de for under $1000. At the time I had little resources and no proof to back up my finding's. Now it is proven!!!!

Here is a list of parts that are sourced that it will take to guarantee and prove these numbers.

1st open the exhaust. Stock exhaust comes in 1.75" in diameter, that is horrible flow for the KA, and technically will keep the engine slow. So lets look at exhaust modifications.An OBX header although not the best header is efficient at a cost at $200. Shipping charges are at purchasers discretion there are stores where you live that sell them for that price. If you find something more affordable I don't care, but I do know that pacesetters are even cheaper. Just stay away from the 4-1 combination headers, KA's love a 4-2-1 design, shows the smallest drop in what is called "dyno dipping", where a portion of the power band losses power to scavaging indifferences to fuel dumping......Second look for a CAT back exhaust, I've found them cheap on Ebay for about $200, (name brands don't count here folks), again at your discretion if you want a name brand, but it doesn't matter when it comes to performance your just looking for mandrel bent larger diameter piping.I am not adding to the controversy of 2.5" over a 3" exhaust system, both will prove to show gains, although for sound and low end power I chose 2.5". Don't start this into a debate that will overall be worthless to me, if you like 3" then get it (I don't care, it's your money)....So total spent on exhaust system was $400. Lets move on.Now it's time to pull off some over weight inertia. Aluminum pulley's are efficient at $60 from OBX, or Megan racing (yes thats right folk's I said Megan racing, especially after all the shiat I talk about them). I happen to purchase mine for $40 so you might be able to find one for a good deal. Does an aluminum pulley affect dampening? The answer is NO. KAE and DE do not come with a dampener ( they are low RPM rev engines and useless for having such a large non harmonic half weighted crank). So pulleys are fine.Now of great importance is engine management. This is were the big numbers come into play for HP numbers. For $300 OBD1 s13 owners can utilize BikiRom and make there own ecu tunes. Even reprogram for any add on there after. It is a daughter board that is saudered into place and with your own programming is a direct plug and play still using the stock OEM mother board (strictly and only for OBD1 KA24de ECU's). Although NEMEGUERO of zilvia is utilizing his OBD2 s14 KA24det with an OBD1 Biki rom to set his MAPS, (it can be used rewiring the harness although emissions won't be effective.An alternative route to also make these numbers are through the SAFC and manually advancing the timing at the distributor. (this mod is not as effective on OBD2 engines/ecu combinations, but works to a full advantage on OBD1 engine/ecu combinations).With a new tune higher octane fuels can be used and actually change response to the knock sensor to increase timing and fuel dumping. The dyno that I am going to show utilized 104octane, although I find it to be unnecessary since the KA runs a compression at under 9.5:1....96octane will work fine to achieve these numbers. This dyno used all the modifications I just stated....

Now this is direct power at the wheels I was here to prove numbers at the crank. If you break down the 15% (25.5HP) degradation loss that the KA transmission and power steering pump makes that leaves you at about 195HP at the flywheel. So total spent was $760.00 plus or minus a few dollars and these are do it your self mods. Devious KA (Gabe Z) of NICO can sell you a 1 time tune to achieve these numbers for $100, do not go through JWT I do not advise it for the price, and Gabe can sell you a much more aggressive tune......... So for those doing a 1 time tune the cost it now $860 plus or minus what ever your shipping charges. So if you didn't notice I didn't add a intake or filter which would put you at 4 more HP. Or a high flow CAT that would add another 5HP for about $120 ( I got my CATCO for $50 and welded my own flanges). That my friends puts you at 204HP at the crank and 1 HP less than the sr20det swap. So is the KA still worth achievable numbers..... YESThis is the set up that will give you the same power to the wheel as an sr20det boosted at 7PSI. At the wheels the SR makes these numbers with no modifications or additional boosting.

So now allowing room to play with your finances there is room for bigger numbers and internal modifications.Effective alternatives are crank scrapers they actually kill harmonic disturbances and allow the crank to rev easier, (prevent oil from misting and spraying through out the engine, this method actually cools engine oil temperatures when modified with a windage tray which you can purchase for about $110 from Ishihara and Johnson crank scrapers......

Or you can increase throttle response with TB boring nothing too drastic just something that will help to increase a lean mixture a 62mm size will do fine.......

As we all know there are free mods as well OBD and OBD1 KA's can remove the SCV's for an easy 6HP gaind to the wheels.

Also the KA coolant bypass which I don't think is anything significant accept for about fraction of a donkey.

Does advanced timing work??? Not really by a modification by itself, not unless you have retuned the ecu and/or tuned the cams as well. So for those that haven't tuned properly you are just wasting fuel. Just keep timing at the distributor set at 20BTDC, or unless a piggy back (SAFC and wide band) is used to adjust the right A/F ratio for the timing adjustments...

Are cams worth it? for the price JWT sells there cams for... F$CK NO, but if you get your hands on them the are the best on the market and showed better results than the PDM racing cams.

How do I know most of this... Those that know me in this forum and the pic's and tips I've shown through out the year know that it is true....... Many of the stuff I've learned is through trial and error just like the rest of you... Some is with learning from other guy's building there KA's. For some of you this is nothing new, and for others it is. It just feels refreshing to know that I made corrections to information I f%cked up on a year ago.......

Now can I back up these dyno's without a dyno of my own??? YesI live in a community full of people that drift with the SR20det and run at stock boost. Do I have the mods listed in this thread? Yes as well as a few of my own goodies.........

Nothing beats the throttle response of an NA engine... Enough said.....

(UPDATE) PDM racing now broke the new dyno record with the same mods this is one year later from the start of this thread...

Modified by kenjimatic at 9:15 AM 7/16/2007
Modified by kenjimatic at 9:18 AM 7/16/2007

[neverlift]

ok I believer he is talking about wheel hp... anywho,

a guy on here right now has 17x wtrq and 15xwhp on a de, he is still on the s14 cams with the s13 ecu(should clear up the diff some), hes about to do a maf swap and use an afc, I hope he gets over 200whp but I dont see it without internal mods. If you want a fun n/a ka its easy suspension, then some exhaust work(stock pipe is like 1.5" diam. not good for performance),and jsut fyi a 3" exhaust makes more noise AND power on a ka it was dynoed) . Stock ka intake is ok, mod it,throw a better filter in. MAke sure your usual items(cts,tps,maf,o2) are in proper order and in spec. That will pay off the most( the cts alone is good for poor economy AND 28whp loss). Not saying buy new ones just make sure the ones you have are good.

Other then that stock they are a fun car to drive, so get some driving in....

[93HATCH240]

My friend just put down 165whp and 170tq. Hes got i/h/e exedy clutch. electric fan and a tuned safc neo. I have a lot more done then him and hes got another 10whp on me. . Im clueless

[Razi]

Well your sig says your engine runs like poop. Get your engine running better.

[93HATCH240]

Well your sig says your engine runs like poop. Get your engine running better.

That was with the old motor. I already swapped in a low mile 95 ka

[neverlift]

the cams and afc are why? ask if he dropped some fuel(leaned out), I cant recall your entire setup(its 7xx am), but depending on your parts vs his parts its hard to say exactly why, but I know first hand what less fuel can do for the ka, you can feel it butt dyno even, my tune is still a bit rich but with no knock monitor and the knock sensor is not being read by the ecu, rather spend a lil extra at the pump for now,then on a motor. I'm even using a fairly stock timig map,but just dropping some off the fuel map has increase trq notably IMHO. Good afr is a HUGE part of your trp/hp too much is bad and too little is the worst. But timing(like yours not being set) is a BIG factor as well.

[93HATCH240]

the cams and afc are why? ask if he dropped some fuel(leaned out), I cant recall your entire setup(its 7xx am), but depending on your parts vs his parts its hard to say exactly why, but I know first hand what less fuel can do for the ka, you can feel it butt dyno even, my tune is still a bit rich but with no knock monitor and the knock sensor is not being read by the ecu, rather spend a lil extra at the pump for now,then on a motor. I'm even using a fairly stock timig map,but just dropping some off the fuel map has increase trq notably IMHO. Good afr is a HUGE part of your trp/hp too much is bad and too little is the worst. But timing(like yours not being set) is a BIG factor as well.

It was dyno tuned. he gained like 10whp and like 8wtq from the neo being set up properly. his timing is i belive is dead on. The guy that was doing it said he was already running extremely lean. Fuel had to be added throughtout the rpm range. the parts i have over him are a lightwieght crank pully, lightweight flywheel. Jim wolf ecu Maganacore wires and something else i cant remember atm. I will have a new dyno next week with cam, maf installed along with new ngk plugs and a dyno tuned safc neo.

[dj4u2no]

As we all know there are free mods as well OBD and OBD1 KA's can remove the SCV's for an easy 6HP gaind to the wheels.......

What is the SCV and where is it???????????

[bruinbear714]

You can always swap out the restrictive OEM cat with a 2.5" high flow cat,

http://www.frsport.com/FR_Catc....html

[93HATCH240]

You can always swap out the restrictive OEM cat with a 2.5" high flow cat,

http://www.frsport.com/FR_Catc....html

cat? whats a cat. lol I already have an hollowed out cat. mods are in my sig

[neverlift]

your cat is hurting you some though, it has to be filled then the exhuast pushes out....

thats strange on your friend being lean... IDKhow lean may be some fuel issues there,stock is more than capable of bolt ons.... injectors and pump come on with them, I'm going meow in the next few weeks

As we all know there are free mods as well OBD and OBD1 KA's can remove the SCV's for an easy 6HP gaind to the wheels.......

What is the SCV and where is it???????????

search it bro

[93HATCH240]

your cat is hurting you some though, it has to be filled then the exhuast pushes out....

thats strange on your friend being lean... IDKhow lean may be some fuel issues there,stock is more than capable of bolt ons.... injectors and pump come on with them, I'm going meow in the next few weeks

search it bro

Going "meow" umm yea you lost me with that one. wtf is meow?

[nka24racr]

if you still need to know, blueprint your engine.to blueprint a naturally asperated engine you port and polish the head, primarily the intake side of the head.Then increase the compression ratio of your engine by milling the head,this will increase the power output on your engine. Also you then have to change the cam profiles to accomodate the new ammount of airflow;here you have the option of buying after market cams or having your stock cams re-ground for half the price.Getting the right end gap on your piston rings is extremely important, if the gap is too big you will suffer greatly from blowby and if you set the gap too small you will break your rings score, your cylinder bores and quite possibly seize your pistons.

To blueprint an engine that is going to be boosted;most of the above apply with the exception of increasing compression.Instead you will need to decrease compression to 8.5-1 because this is the optimum compression ratio for boost.

[SCKA24E]

any one running a bikirom still?

[venomthedarkone]

go up to 10:5:1, 10:8:1, or 11:5:1 on pump gas. The 11:5:1 you have to use 91 only.