GET 50+ MPG with your versa.

[MPG]

i opened this thread to share some tips on how to get great fuel economy with the versa. i have a 1.8 6spd HB rated at 28 mpg combined, and so far i have managed to go as far as doubling my epa fuel economy. my record for one tank so far was 57mpg. it dropped down into the low to mid 40s during the summer because i was constantly running the AC. but now with cooler weather approaching i am shooting for 60mpg before it gets too cold and fuel economy drops again.

my versa is completely factory stock right down to the paper intake air filter. the only modification i have done to the car itself is removal of the rear seat(which i did for increased cargo room, but the weight savings are welcome) and tire over inflation to 40psi COLD, which reduces rolling resistance while still offering a fairily smooth ride. i do not recomment doing over 40 psi as this separates tires over time, increases the chance of blowouts, picking up tire puncturing debri, and makes for a harsh ride along with poor traction, braking and handling.

so besides some weight reduction and tire inflation, its all about your driving habits.

if you have an automatic:

1.keep the rpm as low as possible getting up to speed
2.never depress the throttle more than 20%
3. limit your speed to 5mph below the indicated speed limit
4.always travel in the right lane so others can easily pass you.
5. always use cruise control if available.
6. observe traffic half a mile ahead and coast in D as much as possible.


if you have the 6speed there are additional tips that will give you a significant mpg boost over automatics.

1. shift at 1500rpm
2. observe the traffic half a mile ahead and coast in neutral as much as possible.

OPTIONAL ADVANCED FUEL SAVING TECHNIQUES FOR MANUAL TRANSMISSION CARS.
these techniques are potentially dangerous, so do not attempt if not comfortable

3. pulse and glide (fuel saving alternative to cruise control). with this technique, you accelerate to slightly over the indicated speedlimit(not enough to risk scoring a ticket) shift to neutral and coast at idle until you are below the speed limit(again, not slow enough to impede traffic), then you revmatch and shift back in gear, slowly getting back up to speed, repeating the process over and over. depending on traffic conditions you can increase the coasting window to as much as 20mph difference, which given ideal conditions may be as much as a 1 mile coast.


4. forced auto stop with bump start......this technique comes in handy when coasting down hill. accelerate to desired speed, shift to neutral, turn engine off, wait 3 seconds, turn key to on position (SO THAT THE STEERING WHEEL WONT LOCK UP), and coast. then push the clutchpedal all the way down, shift 6th gear, release clutch pedal slightly (about 30%) and quickly depress it again. this will bump the engine just enough for it to fire up all on its own. this does not damage the clutch or transmission and saves the starter. do not just release the clutch all at once to restart the engine, because this will cause severe damage to various components over time



5. combination of 3 and 4




these advanced techniques play a major role in achieving 50+mpg with your versa but also require planning, skill and common sense to reap maximum benefits.

[aidan80]

You could do all that or you could buy a turbo diesel car and save yourself a lot of hassle and drive normally? Then you won't have to plan your trip to include coasting, and the (sorry to be blunt) stupidest thing I've ever head.. turn off the engine while moving. Quite a bit of what your suggesting if attempted by an inexperienced driver or anyone that makes a mistake is a recipe for disaster and possibly death on the road.

[MPG]

the diesels and hybrids offered in the usa are pure money pits in every way compared to the nissan versa. the gain in fuel economy does not even come close to covering the difference in overall cost from the day it is sold brand new at the dealer, to the day it is dumped at the junk yard.

as for the second part of your post. i have made it clear that those are potentially dangerous advanced techniques and should not be attempted if not comfortable what you call stupid i call real money savings.

[AZhitman]

the diesels and hybrids offered in the usa are pure money pits in every way compared to the nissan versa. the gain in fuel economy does not even come close to covering the difference in overall cost from the day it is sold brand new at the dealer, to the day it is dumped at the junk yard.

as for the second part of your post. i have made it clear that those are potentially dangerous advanced techniques and should not be attempted if not comfortable what you call stupid i call real money savings.

True and true.

Good info, MPG. Lots of tried-and-true hypermiler techniques.

Add in some fuel-saving mods to the car itself and you've got a lot of opportunity to save fuel with that car.

[totsubo]

40 PSI in the tires save me about 2 mpg without changing my driving habits.

Shutting off the car at long signals saves some more.

[aidan80]

the diesels and hybrids offered in the usa are pure money pits in every way compared to the nissan versa. the gain in fuel economy does not even come close to covering the difference in overall cost from the day it is sold brand new at the dealer, to the day it is dumped at the junk yard.

as for the second part of your post. i have made it clear that those are potentially dangerous advanced techniques and should not be attempted if not comfortable what you call stupid i call real money savings.

In what way are they money pits? I like the idea of a hybrid but honestly wouldn't jump on it. Diesels back home appear to get better mileage than even hybrids there and over here? I did notice the almost non existence of diesels here in the US which is strange and yes I did notice that diesel costs more.. well about 5c - 10c more here in Florida last time i checked. A lot of cars in Ireland are diesel, cheaper to run and typically give better mpg when compared to the petrol equivalents.

Don't get me wrong I'm all for saving money just like anyone else but some of the techniques you mentioned are, in my personal opinion stupid because they can very likely cause death and injury when attempted by inexperienced drivers. I know you said they are "advanced techniques" but tell that to the person's family that kills themselves because they "think" they can do it. I'm sure all that money saved will cover the funeral? I'm saying this not because I'm trying to irritate you or offend in any way. I'm just stating my opinion and concern as a fellow driver that some of those maneuvers bring a lot of additional unneeded danger to the roads.

[AZhitman]

A TDI costs substantially more than a gasoline VW... look at the amount of fuel you can buy with that extra $. Then calculate how many miles you can drive on that amount of fuel.

With diesel costing the same (or more) than gasoline, it's really not a smart buy right now.

The SMART money is on an older car that got 40mpg when new - pay cash for it, maintain it well, and hypermile the s*** out of it.

[MPG]

the diesels and hybrids offered in the usa are pure money pits in every way compared to the nissan versa. the gain in fuel economy does not even come close to covering the difference in overall cost from the day it is sold brand new at the dealer, to the day it is dumped at the junk yard.

as for the second part of your post. i have made it clear that those are potentially dangerous advanced techniques and should not be attempted if not comfortable what you call stupid i call real money savings.

True and true.

Good info, MPG. Lots of tried-and-true hypermiler techniques.

Add in some fuel-saving mods to the car itself and you've got a lot of opportunity to save fuel with that car.

thanks man. your username reminds me of a guy on x runner underground. i think he was from tucson. its not you is it?

[AZhitman]

Nope. I'm in Phoenix.

[MPG]

the diesels and hybrids offered in the usa are pure money pits in every way compared to the nissan versa. the gain in fuel economy does not even come close to covering the difference in overall cost from the day it is sold brand new at the dealer, to the day it is dumped at the junk yard.

as for the second part of your post. i have made it clear that those are potentially dangerous advanced techniques and should not be attempted if not comfortable what you call stupid i call real money savings.

In what way are they money pits? I like the idea of a hybrid but honestly wouldn't jump on it. Diesels back home appear to get better mileage than even hybrids there and over here? I did notice the almost non existence of diesels here in the US which is strange and yes I did notice that diesel costs more.. well about 5c - 10c more here in Florida last time i checked. A lot of cars in Ireland are diesel, cheaper to run and typically give better mpg when compared to the petrol equivalents.

Don't get me wrong I'm all for saving money just like anyone else but some of the techniques you mentioned are, in my personal opinion stupid because they can very likely cause death and injury when attempted by inexperienced drivers. I know you said they are "advanced techniques" but tell that to the person's family that kills themselves because they "think" they can do it. I'm sure all that money saved will cover the funeral? I'm saying this not because I'm trying to irritate you or offend in any way. I'm just stating my opinion and concern as a fellow driver that some of those maneuvers bring a lot of additional unneeded danger to the roads.

In what way are they money pits? like i said, in every way. from the several thousand dollar difference in original cost at the dealer, to longterm reliability/parts/maintenance/upkeep cost, to simple things like filling up at the fuel station.(diesel fuel is more expensive than regular unleaded, which adds up quickly when you drive 150-200 miles a day like i do)

now, if the americans were smarter, they would bring over vw lupo3Ls and similar diesel cars that dont cost several grand more than the versa/fit/yaris etc. and actually get substantially better fuel ecomomy. then i could maybe forgive the difference in german vs jap reliability and parts cost. but as things stand right now, nothing beats my 6speed versa hatch at $13500 with 57MPG. except maybe a base 1.6 versa sedan for under 10 grand.

[Knightro2]

now, if the americans were smarter, they would bring over vw lupo3Ls and similar diesel cars that dont cost several grand more than the versa/fit/yaris etc.

It's not us Americans that get to make that choice. It is the "brass" at VW that makes those choices.

[sr20bet]

You could do all that or you could buy a turbo diesel car and save yourself a lot of hassle and drive normally? Then you won't have to plan your trip to include coasting, and the (sorry to be blunt) stupidest thing I've ever head.. turn off the engine while moving. Quite a bit of what your suggesting if attempted by an inexperienced driver or anyone that makes a mistake is a recipe for disaster and possibly death on the road.

I gotta agree with aidan80 on this one.

[srellim234]

Coasting in neutral is actually against the law in many states.

[Bubs daddy]

I tried to explain the diesel thing to another member last year. If the price we're equal to a gas vehicle, then maybe it'll come out in a few years, diesel being more expensive and whatnot. But as others have stated, a diesel always has some $5000 premium and that folks, buys a lot of go juice. At three dollars per gallon of gasoline, That's 1666 gallons. Lets say a car gets 30 mpg, that's almost 50,000 miles before the diesel Jetta even rolls off the lot. That's 4-5 years of driving. If that diesel car gets 40 mpg, it will take forever to make up the savings at the pump. But seeing as how diesel fuel is always more expensive per gallon, it'll be a wash.

If you're buying a diesel to save money on fuel, you're not going to save anything. And then there's the maintenance. Look at some of the vee dub Jetta's and the problems with their high pressure fuel filters. Corrosion, build quality or lousy fuel, it adds up to $$$ at 60,000 miles when that car is out of warranty.

If the price were the same, MAYBE. With the extra you pay for the car at purchase and the higher fuel cost, any higher mpg is negated. No thanks.

[MPG]

sr20 and aidan, like with most any action/excercise/maneuver. if you dont know what you are doing, it is potentially dangerous, even deadly. if however you know what you are doing and are comfortable doing it, the odds of something ever happening are next to zero.

if you put an inexperienced rider on a horse and the horse takes off running, chances are very high that person will fall off the horse and sustain potentially life threatening injuries. an experienced rider however will most likely ride that horse a lifetime without any accidents.

the vast majority of pilots will fly planes their whole lifes without crashing once. put an untrained person in charge however, and that plane will most likely go down in flames.. and this goes for absolutely everything. thats all i have to say on the subject of safety.

srellim, driving barefooted is against the law in alabama. in arkansas it is against the law to sound the horn on a vehicle at any place where cold drinks or sandwiches are served after 9:00 P.M. -Little Rock City Code Sec. 18-54. in long beach california Cars are the only item allowed in a garage. under florida law If an elephant is left tied to a parking meter, the parking fee has to be paid just as it would for a vehicle. and in many states, oral sex is STILL illegal. there are several hundred more such laws that no one cares about or is even aware of. point is. no one will arrest you or give you a ticket for coasting in neutral. not that a police officer can even prove you did, or better yet, even thinks about it in the first place.

bubs daddy, you are absolutely right, and i would also add that it is even worse with hybrid cars.... you pay an extreme markup on hybrids right up front, and then if you are lucky enough to have your first battery replacement under warranty, you will have to dish out another few thousand dollars for the next battery replacement. even with the better fuel economy you are looking at a significant money loss over a conventional car.

[Bubs daddy]

Indeed. cargurus.com found that the average markup of a hybrid over its non hybrid counterpart was $6400. Too many people get emotional and don't do the math. It is far cheaper just to get a $11000 Versa than some $25000 Prius. Even if the Pruis gets 50mpg, it's $14000 more.

[MPG]

I have always found it difficult to call two different make and model cars "counterparts" because it always comes down to personal opinion. So when making the argument against hybrids I always compare the civic gasoline vs civic hybrid because it takes out the opinion factor eliminating any chance for excuses, since its the same exact car with different powertrain only. So ill lay out the facts and let you lay out the actual numbers for people to see. A base civic gasoline costs $15500 and is rated at a combined 30 mpg . A base civic hybrid costs $24000 and is rated at a combined 42.5 mpg. I'm curious to see how many miles it will take for the hybrid to break even with the gas civic. Also count 3 grand for battery replacement every 100k. Most probably far sooner in hot climates like Arizona.

[AZhitman]

I tried to explain the diesel thing to another member last year. If the price we're equal to a gas vehicle, then maybe it'll come out in a few years, diesel being more expensive and whatnot. But as others have stated, a diesel always has some $5000 premium and that folks, buys a lot of go juice. At three dollars per gallon of gasoline, That's 1666 gallons. Lets say a car gets 30 mpg, that's almost 50,000 miles before the diesel Jetta even rolls off the lot. That's 4-5 years of driving. If that diesel car gets 40 mpg, it will take forever to make up the savings at the pump. But seeing as how diesel fuel is always more expensive per gallon, it'll be a wash.

If you're buying a diesel to save money on fuel, you're not going to save anything. And then there's the maintenance. Look at some of the vee dub Jetta's and the problems with their high pressure fuel filters. Corrosion, build quality or lousy fuel, it adds up to $$$ at 60,000 miles when that car is out of warranty.

If the price were the same, MAYBE. With the extra you pay for the car at purchase and the higher fuel cost, any higher mpg is negated. No thanks.

Nailed it.

Well done. my friend.

[srellim234]

MPG, your reply to the illegality of it is arrogant and shows a total lack of respect. It is also illegal to run red lights. It doesn't matter if traffic is there at the moment or not. It is illegal to drive around railroad crossing gates. People do and die. It is not legal to do a lot of things that you may feel are safe, regardless of your personal experience or perceived expertise. Just like driving while texting or talking on the phone while driving. Ask the majority of the people who have died or killed someone else through those actions and they will tell you they thought they could handle it. That it wasn't dangerous despite evidence and laws to the contrary.

Bottom line: if you know it is illegal and think it is a safe action, GET INVOLVED AND GET THE LAW CHANGED! In the meantime, obey the laws. And thank God that there are people like my wife who will direct traffic around the accident scene and treat the body with great respect as they help the coroner zip up the body bag.

[MPG]

So you went from "it is illegal to coast in neutral in some states" to "it is illegal to run red lights " maybe next you'll accuse me of saying rape and murder is not dangerous . If you are incapable of discerning between the severity and importance of laws I pity you.

[srellim234]

You cited individual statutes around the country. Only after you absurdly equated coasting in neutral to oral sex and tying an elephant to a parking meter did I challenge you on it. You are equating coasting in neutral to the wrong set of laws.

If you have the evidence that coasting in neutral is a safe action (actual study evidence, not just personal anectodal evidence) then present it. And get involved to change those laws you see as ridiculous. That multiple states have independently passed laws against coasting in neutral indicates to me that there is a reason, probably safety related, for having such a law. If it were only one jurisdiction I might feel differently.

[MPG]

You cited individual statutes around the country. Only after you absurdly equated coasting in neutral to oral sex and tying an elephant to a parking meter did I challenge you on it. You are equating coasting in neutral to the wrong set of laws.

If you have the evidence that coasting in neutral is a safe action (actual study evidence, not just personal anectodal evidence) then present it. And get involved to change those laws you see as ridiculous. That multiple states have independently passed laws against coasting in neutral indicates to me that there is a reason, probably safety related, for having such a law. If it were only one jurisdiction I might feel differently.

the burden of proof lays with the person making the claim. you claim that coasting in neutral is just as dangerous as running red lights. make your case. so far all you have to back your claim is that some states have laws against coasting in neutral, which means nothing because as i have already pointed out, many states have numerous other laws no one cares to uphold and law enforcement doesnt care to enforce.

[srellim234]

Absolutely not. The burden of proof lies with YOU. It is you who is advocating that people break existing laws. Justify your advocacy by proving the law shouldn't exist.

But, if you insist, this is from CarDealExpert.com and Popular Mechanics:

Coasting while in neutral is dangerous and does not save gas

Consumers are always looking for good ways to save gas as they take to the highways and byways. Various additive products exist that supposedly improve a car’s fuel economy, but these products have been met with skepticism by experts. Driving techniques like hypermiling have grounding in scientific fact. However, one driving technique that some associate with fuel economy – coasting in neutral as the engine is idling – has little to do with effective hypermiling, reports Popular Mechanics. Not only does it not save gas, but it is unsafe.

Coasting in neutral disables the accelerator

If drivers experience road hazards while coasting in neutral, they cannot use the accelerator pedal to avoid the danger. Not only that, but handling around sharp corners is severely hampered while coasting in neutral. This is because the engine is disconnected from the drive train at that time.

The saving gas argument

It is an illogical claim that a car experiences greater fuel economy while coasting in neutral. In terms of gallons of gas consumed per hour, Popular Mechanics states that one gallon is consumed per hour when a car engine is left idling. Using that as a guide, if a car is coasting in neutral down a mile-long hill at an average speed of 30 mph, about .033 gallons of gas are consumed.
But the engine is still producing rpm

Through studies with an oscilloscope, it has been proven that the pulse-width-modulated wave signal controlling the fuel injector of a vehicle varies from 5 percent to 80 percent from idle to full throttle. The higher the percentage, the higher the rpm goes, and more fuel is consumed. Ultimately, once the car reaches the bottom of a hill – or as a car creeps up to a traffic light – the engine eventually slows to an idle rpm, about 1,000 rpm. This varies somewhat by vehicle. At that point, the car’s fuel injection starts adding fuel to keep the engine from stalling out. The driver feels this as a slight rev up, and the oscilloscope shows that pulse increase. Thus, gas is actually being wasted when the car shifts into neutral, claims Popular Mechanics.

Tricking the trip computer

For a variety of reasons, when a car is coasting in neutral, inaccurate readings are being sent to the trip computer. Essentially, the computer sends a “false positive” of drastically increased mileage while coasting. That’s why gallons into the tank divided by odometer mileage (and checked against a handheld GPS device) are more useful when analyzing fuel economy. All told, Popular Mechanics believes that drivers will save more fuel if they simply turn off the engine at a traffic light than if they used the unsafe driving technique of coasting in neutral.

[AZhitman]

It's well-known that, assuming no throttle input, a manual in 6th uses less fuel than it does in neutral.

Putting an automatic in neutral for long periods of coasting is asking for trouble (but we all know that).

[srellim234]

Apparently MPG doesn't.

[wingFeather]

Interesting read! It seems logical that neutral uses less gas in the long run than staying in gear, assuming that the revolutions & throttle input are higher in gear. Sure, for neutral, there may be an initial burst of gas to keep the engine from stalling, but after that would it not use less?

[Bubs daddy]

Nailed it.

Well done. my friend.

Thanks, Hitman.

I am intrigued with diesels but the price premium is so ridiculous. I know they've come a long way. I knew of a couple people back in the day with diesel Rabbits. They got 50 mpg if they didn't rust to the ground first. I also knew a guy who owned an '80 Oldsmobile diesel station wagon. Every time I'd go over to his house, the engine was in some state of disassembly. Usually the heads were laying on the work bench. I drove it many times, nice car when it was running.

I believe GM's Oldsmobile diesel's debacle is the very reason that diesels never took off here. Just poor design at the time. No one trusted them after that.

Now, VW wants almost $30,000 for that little diesel wagon of theirs. With gasoline engines now getting 200,000 miles with proper maintenance, it just doesn't make sense to pay the price premium.

How's your Cube running? You guys liking it?

[srellim234]

Interesting read! It seems logical that neutral uses less gas in the long run than staying in gear, assuming that the revolutions & throttle input are higher in gear. Sure, for neutral, there may be an initial burst of gas to keep the engine from stalling, but after that would it not use less?

I think the answer is in this question and answer exchange from October 2009 in Popular Mechanics:

"Q: In regard to your answer to the question on gas mileage in Neutral vs. Drive in the Dec. 2007 issue, I notice that in my 2007 Toyota Camry (4,000 miles) in going downhill the car "freewheels" better in Neutral than it does in Drive (even in 6th gear, which is supposedly "overdrive"). This indicates to me that in Drive the wheels are still connected to the drive train and thus friction holds the car back somewhat.

In Neutral the drive train is presumably disconnected from the wheels and the car freewheels better. It therefore seems to me that much better mileage should result in Neutral (although I have heard arguments that you should not normally do this for safety reasons.) I am probably wrong but there are probably many others out here in the boonies that are likewise confused.

A: Read my column again: Your car uses zero fuel when coasting in gear because the fuel injection isn’t injecting any into the engine. Your car uses some fuel when coasting in neutral because the engine basically is idling. The “friction” from idling in drive is very small, not enough to let the car gain enough speed to compensate for the fuel burned at idle. And besides, coasting in neutral isn’t really safe."

So although it sounds strange a fuel injected engine uses more gas coasting in neutral than it does coasting in high gears.

[AZhitman]

^ That.

[AZhitman]

Now, VW wants almost $30,000 for that little diesel wagon of theirs. With gasoline engines now getting 200,000 miles with proper maintenance, it just doesn't make sense to pay the price premium.

How's your Cube running? You guys liking it?

Even more than that in some cases.

BTW, diesel is almost $ .20/gal more than unleaded right now in my area.

I lost a TON of money on my Golf TDI. My own stupidity, but I'll NEVER own another VW again. Screw them.

Cube is awesome. Getting 30+ mpg and costing me nothing in maintenance. Haven't paid for an oil change yet, and she's had nine oil changes.