Fresh Rebuild Nistune Questions!

[brando132]

Questions start near the bottom this is just backstory and introduction.

Hey all, I have recently made some of the final steps in this 2 year journey to get my Zed the power it deserves. Last weekend I put the engine in and am waiting for nicer weather(-20'c right now!) to finish the transmission install and etc. I should have it done and ready for breakin by the end of the month. I have put a lot of time and money into rebuilding this engine with many upgrades, so it is nowhere close to what it was prior to this ordeal, including;

• -Wiseco 88mm piston kit
  -Eagle rods
  -Short block put together by a trusted race engine builder with 35+ yr.s experience
  -Long Block assembled by me over winter with very careful research and building. I've built several motors by myself before.
  -Short block clearanced and blueprinted
  -Kevlar Timing belt
  -Valve Job
  -Port and polish on the heads
  -intake manifold matching
  -Cometic MLS HG
  -ARP head and main studs, as well as rod bolts
  -740cc Injectors
  -Dual intake with selin translator
  -Custom FMIC
  -TD05H-16G kit (11psi wastegate springs)
  -Z1 flywheel and uprated clutch combo with 350z clutch fork
  -SFI lightweight Crank pulley
  -10 Point roll cage
  -GReddy EBC
  -Turbo timer
  -AEM UEGO
  -Nistune
  -EGR, AIV, and many other deletes
  -Full OEM gasket kit
  -etc. etc. I have many more I can't think of at the moment.
  -Will be running 94 octane in the city and C12 on the strip

But enough bragging, the car was pretty much stock with 11psi boost jets and a mild chip tune when I started with it. It ran a 13.25 at 109mph for those curious. I'm thinking I will use the motoman method (http://www.mototuneusa.com/break_in_secrets.htm) for the break in based on my research, however I'm scared to break it in, having never done this before. I have done a ton of research, including basic things for first startup, but would like someone with more experience to chime in.

But now to the questions!:
1. Will a rough tune in nistune based off a stock map with the necessary changes made(injectors, maf, etc) be sufficient for the light-medium load required to properly break in the engine? I will make changes as needed before the road trip break in.

2. I will be taking some timing out across the map for safety reasons but will this be safe enough?

3. Is it safe to hit boost while breaking it in, never mind the possibility of burning a cylinder or detonation but merely for seating the rings? I'm trying to avoid boost for the breakin if possible.

4.If it's a good idea to hit boost, will the 11psi springs in the wastegate be too much? I feel like that would be fairly scary on a fresh engine.

5. To anyone that has broken their engine in before, Should I just trailer it to the nearest dyno tuner and have the first start and break-in done at the dyno shop or would it be better to do the first 100km myself so as to save time and headache for the dyno-ers, plus they ain't cheap!

6. Any other tips or suggestions of things I should be aware of for this process?

Questions welcome!

Thank you for your time and answers! I'm looking forward to having fun with the car this summer!

[DCaff300ZX]

Welcome!
Sorry I can't help here as I've never had a new VG to play with, me jelly...
Hopefully others who have done so will chime in, but the one thing I'm fairly sure of is to not break it in with boost as best possible but I'm also not familiar with the procedure you mentioned using. My thinking is the extra heat isn't working in your favor with the ring seating, but as also mentioned I am NOT anywhere near a pro there.

Good Luck with everything and be sure to post up your Baby when this is all a memory!

[brando132]

Based off the many more hours of research I have done, most of it agrees with you on boost, and I will be making 100% sure to not go positive on the gauge. Still a little fuzzy on what I want to do for the break-in so still looking for advice! I will definitely be posting many pics of the car when she's done. Keep a look out for it in the next few months!

[NolimitZ32]

1. Will a rough tune in nistune based off a stock map with the necessary changes made(injectors, maf, etc) be sufficient for the light-medium load required to properly break in the engine? I will make changes as needed before the road trip break in. Yes, with the caveat that you have quality injectors so that the fuel atomization is not greatly varied from factory parameters.

2. I will be taking some timing out across the map for safety reasons but will this be safe enough? Probably could keep the timing as stock, would recommend to lower boost to factory setting or lower for break-in.

3. Is it safe to hit boost while breaking it in, never mind the possibility of burning a cylinder or detonation but merely for seating the rings? I'm trying to avoid boost for the breakin if possible. See answer to #2.

4.If it's a good idea to hit boost, will the 11psi springs in the wastegate be too much? I feel like that would be fairly scary on a fresh engine. See answer to #2, high boost during break-in does have the potential to create issues, this doesn't mean that it will but why risk it. Turn the boost down. I ran my break-in at wastegate pressure by lowering all the settings on my AVCR.

5. To anyone that has broken their engine in before, Should I just trailer it to the nearest dyno tuner and have the first start and break-in done at the dyno shop or would it be better to do the first 100km myself so as to save time and headache for the dyno-ers, plus they ain't cheap! As long as you are diligent and don't do anything dumb I would say break it in yourself.

6. Any other tips or suggestions of things I should be aware of for this process?
All that said you need to be mindful of what you are doing and how you are doing it, the "motoman" method is not the "motoman" method but rather the accepted, calculated, and engineered way to break in a fresh built engine which has been so for decades (since we started using better alloys in engine construction). The most important thing to understand is that you need to give the engine a lot of variation during break-in, just getting out on the interstate and going balls to the wall for 300 miles will do more bad than good. So in short set the boost to wastegate pressure, adjust the K-factor, don't touch any of the timing, log your first drive at 1/2 and 3/4 throttle, confirm your AFRs are good, and then have yourself the time of your life.

[DCaff300ZX]

^^^Kind of what I knew but without the "motoman" name to it- basically a race break in where you are not "easy" on the engine, but are mindful as mentioned of varying the engine usage pattern as often and differently as possible to create the most consistent pattern as the engine parts seat- especially as I've been told decellerating and varying your speed constantly, up/downshifting often, high/low rpm pulls, cruising, etc.
Also, a number of oil changes within the first 500 miles has also been mentioned often, and I am a fan of high end extra lubricants as well for the "later".

[brando132]

Yes, with the caveat that you have quality injectors so that the fuel atomization is not greatly varied from factory parameters.

Good to know. I installed new-style NISMO 740cc injectors with a variance of 1-3 cc/min based on the included spec sheet.

Probably could keep the timing as stock, would recommend to lower boost to factory setting or lower for break-in.

With the springs currently in the wastegates the lowest they will go is around 11psi. looks like I'll have to watch and make sure it doesn't go to full boost for a little while.

high boost during break-in does have the potential to create issues, this doesn't mean that it will but why risk it. Turn the boost down. I ran my break-in at wastegate pressure by lowering all the settings on my AVCR.

I plan to use my Profec to have the boost turned all the way down, what was your wastegate pressure for your break-in?

As long as you are diligent and don't do anything dumb I would say break it in yourself.

I will most definately try not to do anything dumb! Looks like none of the shops my side of the country will let me do a dyno break-in anyways so I will most likely end up doing it myself.

[...]The most important thing to understand is that you need to give the engine a lot of variation during break-in, just getting out on the interstate and going balls to the wall for 300 miles will do more bad than good. So in short set the boost to wastegate pressure, adjust the K-factor, don't touch any of the timing, log your first drive at 1/2 and 3/4 throttle, confirm your AFRs are good, and then have yourself the time of your life.

For the variation I plan to drive the the next city about 250kms away while constantly changing the rpms and load level throughout the trip.

[...]Also, a number of oil changes within the first 500 miles has also been mentioned often, and I am a fan of high end extra lubricants as well for the "later".

I plan to be using high quality dinosaur squeezings of the species Penzoil or Castrol with a weight of 10w-40 and a ZDDP additive for the first ~1500kms changed 3-4 times in that timeframe, switching to Royal Purple after that.

Thanks everyone for the info! Looks forward to hearing from others!

[NolimitZ32]

For break-in its recommended to drive twisty roads of varying grades (if available) and widths so the road forces you to accelerate, decelerate and engine break. My waste-gate pressure was on the stock WGs so I believe it was somewhere in the neighborhood of 7psi. As for oil, I would recommend going with a quality dino or syn blend, you said you were using the ZDDP but I will note again. MAKE DAMN SURE YOU ADD THE ZINC ADDITIVE at minimum to the first start up but preferably to the next few changes as well until you are on regular schedule. Overall it sounds like you've done your research which gives me the warm and fuzzies, nice to see people actually going out and reading before asking questions.

[brando132]

For break-in its recommended to drive twisty roads of varying grades (if available) and widths so the road forces you to accelerate, decelerate and engine break. My waste-gate pressure was on the stock WGs so I believe it was somewhere in the neighborhood of 7psi. As for oil, I would recommend going with a quality dino or syn blend, you said you were using the ZDDP but I will note again. MAKE DAMN SURE YOU ADD THE ZINC ADDITIVE at minimum to the first start up but preferably to the next few changes as well until you are on regular schedule. Overall it sounds like you've done your research which gives me the warm and fuzzies, nice to see people actually going out and reading before asking questions.

Unfortunately I live in Saskatchewan, where it's so flat you could watch your dog run away for several days. and all the roads are straight as an arrow. I will be forcing myself to accelerate and engine brake but this should be sufficient. I've already bought enough ZDDP for 3 changes. I view asking a question in a forum as something that should be done only if you can't find the answer yourself. I don't want to be the guy asking if I put too much oil in so that's why it was burning oil when I got "teh mad boostz by cuttin my turbo thingy hose bro! must have been gettin rid of the xtra oil!"

[NolimitZ32]

hahaha teh mad boost!!! hahaha.

[DCaff300ZX]

"teh mad boostz by cuttin my turbo thingy hose bro! must have been gettin rid of the xtra oil!"