fmic mounting

[xjon]

Any body has any good links for pics regarding fmic (21x12x3) mounting in an S13? Specifically, what needs to be trimmed on the bumper?

I notice the opening on the front bumper is 4-5". Would the top 7" of the intercooler be a pool of hot air since it does not really get a direct air flow? Would a 21x5x3 IC be better?

Am I just not understanding/missing something here?

Logicize me because I can't see it.

thanks

[Nathan]

Well, I can tell you that you CAN fit a 20x10.5x3 core without cutting the bumper support itself and without it hanging out the bottom. Most likely you could get a 12 inch high in there as well, just with more modifications to the supports in front of the radiator. Also, a 21x5x3 IC is really going to limit you to about 350-375hp max, kinda depending on its design. In comparison, a 20x10.5x3 is good up to about 530hp

Edit: actually, I forgot...I did have to cut the little lip on the bottom of the bumper support...but it wasn't anything difficult

[xjon]

I understand that bigger IC gets more HP, but what if only a portion of it gets the fresh air to cool the air inside? Sorry, but I really don't know if there is more to the design of the IC than my understanding.

Okay, lets take the above as an example(hypothetical). The big IC can go up to 600hp according to the test they've done at the factory until it can't flow any more air. But that test was done with the IC being 100% open, full flow of air going through the fins. What happens when you limit the amount of air going through the fins? If you limit it, then the temp of air in the IC is hotter which will limit your hp anyways. And possibly a false sense of security which leads to detonation.

Looking at the front of my car, and other pics of these big fmic, looks like 2/3 of the IC is hidden. Are there holes/ ducts made for the rest of the IC that is not in plain view?

[Nathan]

Well, truth is that its almost impossible to know for sure, besides...the hp # is really nothing more than a rough guesstimate, you can always push it a bit harder or do other things to bring intake temps down (alky injection etc). Ultimately, as long as the intercooler isn't keeping the amount of air necessary for the motor to make a certain amount of power from getting into the motor, it can support power levels outside its efficiency range if something else is bring temps down or the engine is tuned a bit different etc. Some people run vents, most dont though. Personally, I'm going to try to hack away some part of the bumper cover and put in some mesh in hopes of allowing better airflow to the intercooler and radiator. Also, one more thing to think about is that if the intercooler is relatively cool but not in the flow of the air and all of a sudden you stomp the throttle and go blasting up through 4th gear redline, its of course going to heat the intercooler up. However, for a certain period of time the intercooler will still act as a heat sink to draw the heat out of the air but without ambient airflow it will become heat soaked sooner. There really are so many variables that its hard to say whether the bit thats covered is going to be a big problem for you or not, all you can do is try your hardest to give it some airflow and make sure everything in the system is as efficient as you can make it. Certainly though, for higher hp, the bigger the intercooler the better, whether it is in the ambient air flow or not. Well, at least I think it is

[xjon]

alky injection is in my future not for speed or hugh hp. My goal is 400hp. It is pretty much just for cooling and running low octane gas (91). Double whammy in Cali.

I was already thinking of air ducts to go between the IC and the pusher fans so I guess I will do the same for the IC if possible.

[NISMO_RB25]

I will be installing a FMIC, Koyo Radiator, and a VLSD and axles. I will do a write up and take pics when I do the FMIC. Just waiting on the piping and the Radiator, so I only have to take the nose off of my S13 once.

[Wulfgang]

NISMO_RB25, what kind of fan setup will you use with that Koyo?

[NISMO_RB25]

I currently have the Flex-a-lite dual fan setup. I think the part number is 220. It is a puller setup. My plan is to put the Koyo on, and then move the fans to the opposite side and reverse the wires to make them pusher fans. once the koyo goes in, there is no way I will have room in the engine bay. I had to modify the current setup to clear it with the stock radiator.

http://rsmoore.home.texas.net/giz17.jpg

I really like the fans, and have had 0 cooling issues (I live in Texas)I got them at summitracing.com, but I am sure you could find them from one of the NICO sponsor sites.

[xjon]

Nismo- looks like a dual 12" fan. Check to see if you can reverse the fan blades also because when I looked to order those fans it specifies "pusher or puller", but doesn't say reversible. It might be inefficient if you just reverse the wires. I know with perma-cool fans it specifies to reverse polarity and the blades.

Also what IC piping did you decide to go with?

[Wulfgang]

Ok, I remember your setup now. Yeah, no way for pullers with the Koyo... do you have an A/C condenser in there too?

xjon, my Permacool instructions only say to reverse the blades. If you do the polarity and the blades you will end up with a puller again.

[NISMO_RB25]

I had a hole thread going about if it would work and no one really seemed to know, so I am just going try it. It it works great, if it doesn't then I will buy the pusher fans.

The condenser is coming out when I pull of the nose.

For IC piping I plan to get the Hybrid kit from NSR, since they seem to be the only ones who I can find that have it in the US.If you know of anyone else, please let me know.

wga posted pics of his car in another thread, and it looks like it fits really well.

[xjon]

Can somebody tell me pieces to get for piping? I tried looking at pics but it is really not clear how/what bends to get. I just need to know what degree the bends are and the length.

thanks

[NISMO_RB25]

I think I have finally figured out what I am going to do for piping.After I mount the Intercooler I am going to make all the piping out of PVC. It is cheap and easy to work with. (I know ghetto, but keep reading)

Then I am going to mark all the pieces so I know how they go together. Then I can take all the pieces apart and take it to a custom shop. That way they can weld up the piping so it is all one solid piece instead of a bunch of joints and clamps that could leak over time.

You could also use this method to figure out what pieces you need to buy. PVC is cheap, so you can buy extra bends without spending a fortune on aluminum bends that you may not even use.

I may even use PVC on the car temporarily, while I wait for the hard pipe to be made.

I will take pics when I do the instal.

[xjon]

Good idea but I need to have mine done in 4-5 days max. So I really can't mess around with the PVC pipes. I can't weld and bend so I wouldn't mind paying for extra pieces.