Finally we have VVEL tables in Uprev!!!

Forum for Infiniti M37, M56 M35h Hybrid and Q70 owners.
DFW2011M56S
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So I downloaded the newest version of the Uprev software updates today. We now have VVEL tables. I compared our engine to the FX50 V8. The VVeL angle maximum is 68° on our stock cars. The FX50 gets 80°. I hope I do not do damage but I brought the VVEL angle to 75° above 6,000 rpm and increased the angle from 2,000+. I have not driven the car but just blipping the throttle it sounds different and responds way differently. Definately sounds like it is giving more lift and duration. With the breathing help I have given my car I hope to notice improved mid-range and top-end HP. Will let you guys know how it turns out. I hope given the fact the FX50 shares very similar head design to our car that the M56 tolerates 75*. I guess time will tell.


DFW2011M56S
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Well I drove it across town now! It made an nearly unbelievable difference from the minimal changes I made. Basically I added 7° of VVEL angle at 7,000 rpm, brought full 75* angle in by 6,000 rpm and interpolated the rest of the table down to 2,000 rpm adding nearly 20* everywhere above 2,000 rpm. Down low it feels the same but hit 2,500+ and it is a monster. 2nd gear roll about 40 mph and 3,000 rpm broke the tires loose so bad I had to let off it.

DFW2011M56S
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So I have to say I have not noticed much more power at high rpm if any but the midrange power is way up. So I backed it back down to 68° by 6,000 rpm. I did leave a sizeable bump from 2,500 to 6,000. WOT is pointless in 1st gear and 2nd gear still skates around ALOT and that is on a P275/40R20. It has definately never made the kind of torque it is now making.

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Ilya
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Hmm interesting. Curious as to what the possible long term ramifications could be on an older M like mine (103kmi - also a 2011).

DFW2011M56S
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Ilya wrote:
Sun Sep 10, 2017 4:54 pm
Hmm interesting. Curious as to what the possible long term ramifications could be on an older M like mine (103kmi - also a 2011).
My guess is the added power could smoke the trans but mine needs to be rebuilt or replaced as it sits. Slips badly going into 4th at heavy throttle. I still run the car hard in 1st, 2nd and 3rd though.

knelson
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DFW, I'm in the DFw area too and would love to see your ride. Let me know if you ever want to meet up to talk M's. I'm in the Grapevine area but can meet about anywhere.
-K

DFW2011M56S
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I work in Richardson, live in North Dallas and rent a hobby shop in Haltom city. I drive through Grapevine 3-4 nights a week.

My car is nothing special just a well worn daily driver with over 100K on it.

But it does still have some get up and go!

knelson
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Crazy, I was born and raised in Haltom city. Angelo Hobbies right by Denton hwy? I live at 121 and Glade.

DFW2011M56S
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knelson wrote:
Mon Sep 11, 2017 8:05 pm
Crazy, I was born and raised in Haltom city. Angelo Hobbies right by Denton hwy? I live at 121 and Glade.
I was born in Bedford and grew up in Hurst. Lived in Euless off Midway/Ector. Close enough to throw a rock at Trinity High School and hit it up until a year ago.

DFW2011M56S
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On a different note I cannot get over how much adding a little cam lift and duration in the midrange opened up the responsiveness of this setup. Part-throttle kickdown in Normal mode at about 1/2 pedal at 70-80 mph to pass aggressively in the 3,500 rpm range does not lag it all, pushes you back in the seat and takes off. It wants to run triple digits in a matter of seconds.

I know if I put some sticky drag radials on the back and a fresh transmission in the car it feels like a low 12 second/high 11 second car. The car has already run between 88 and 92 mph in the 1/8 before I touched the VVEL and it runs the strongest it has ever run up to the point I have to let off and baby the 3-4 shift. I actually heard the car chirp 3rd gear last night. I have actually considered looking into what changes would be necessary to convert the car to AWD since 1st and most of 2nd gear are practucally useless on the street on street tires.

I may see if I can get it on Joetech's dyno someday and see about doing some VVEL fine tuning with the help of the dyno. I am SURE it has more in it than my menial changes based on looking at STOCK QX56 and FX50 rom tables unleashed. Both of those SUVs run higher VVEL angle values across the board than I am currently running. I would not be surprised at all if a finely tuned stock engine could get to 480-500 hp without even lifting a valve cover or unbolting the stock exhaust manifolds. Then again the QX56 gains nearly 50 HP at the wheels untuned with the ARH headers, high flow cats, and exhaust. I actually talked with ARH about building us long tubes and a full exhaust system but I would have to drive or ship my car to their shop and let them keep it for 2-3 weeks for development and prototyping. If I suddenly hit the Lottery I would probably send the car to ARH then to Level10 and then pickup another VK56VD to turn into a 6.0L before finally sending the car to Uprev to get it dialed in. When I got it back I would put adjustable coilovers all around, lower the car and put a 2017+ front clip on it. Yea that is dreamland what can I say.

vr4z06gt
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Interesting...it is my understanding that exhaust manifold removal is a motor out operation on the V8's

DFW2011M56S
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vr4z06gt wrote:
Thu Sep 14, 2017 4:14 am
Interesting...it is my understanding that exhaust manifold removal is a motor out operation on the V8's
One of the guys I work with was an Infiniti master tech and claims you can get both manifolds out without removing the motor if you unbolt the motor mounts and jack the engine up.

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Ilya
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DFW2011M56S wrote:
Wed Sep 13, 2017 6:23 pm
If I suddenly hit the Lottery I would probably send the car to ARH then to Level10 and then pickup another VK56VD to turn into a 6.0L before finally sending the car to Uprev to get it dialed in. When I got it back I would put adjustable coilovers all around, lower the car and put a 2017+ front clip on it. Yea that is dreamland what can I say.
Seriously. If I won the lotto, first car I'd buy is a brand new Q70L 5.6 and do all I dreamed of doing to my car (top end wheels, coilovers, exhaust, etc.). I love these cars.

With ya on that.

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adeedpb
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DFW2011M56S I am going to be experimenting with this over the weekend. Which VVEL tables were you editing? Do you have anymore feedback from your experimenting? I also noticed they changed the way the ETC tables are read/adjusted have you experimented with those at all yet?

I spoke with Joe, our UpRev guy and he said UpRev didn't give much explanation to any of the changes so there wasn't much info he could give me.

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armybrat
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adeedpb wrote:
Fri Sep 22, 2017 11:04 am
DFW2011M56S I am going to be experimenting with this over the weekend. Which VVEL tables were you editing? Do you have anymore feedback from your experimenting? I also noticed they changed the way the ETC tables are read/adjusted have you experimented with those at all yet?

I spoke with Joe, our UpRev guy and he said UpRev didn't give much explanation to any of the changes so there wasn't much info he could give me.
I also spoke with Joe about editing the tables. He wasn't comfortable with messing with it for the reason stated above. He offered to unlock my tune if I upgraded but I passed. I trust his judgement and experience, plus I'm not willing to risk tearing my engine and/or transmission up since mine is a daily driver. For the VK56VD, this is new territory right now; maybe once the trial and error phase is over and a reliable VVEL adjustment is available I will reconsider. Good luck with it though!

Malbec 56 Beast
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DFW, what modifications have you made to your car to do this?

Andy

DFW2011M56S
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Malbec 56 Beast wrote:
Sun Sep 24, 2017 1:55 pm
DFW, what modifications have you made to your car to do this?

Andy
Uprev tuning makes the VVEL adjustment possible.

After a couple of weeks of playing with these new settings.

I have found you can make the engine idle like it has big cams. Off-idle throttle response is touchy and it has a low rpm surge if you do. It starts up like normal and as the VVEL system comes on line it starts loping like crazy.

I discovered by setting the minimum angle tables to a higher value than stock I can get much better throttle response and better off-idle torque. The throttle plates respond faster than the VVEL. VVEL minimum angle from the factory is about 4°. I have played with as much as 40° at idle and 40° lopes like crazy. I ended up finding a sweet spot around 20°. The car has a very noticeable, MEAN sounding idle but is still smooth. With the VVEL minimum angle at 20° the annoying engine breaking is cut down to a minimum. The car coasts much better when you are off the throttle. I find myself downshifting or stepping on the brakes much more often because the car wants to keep on going when traffic starts to slow down. My fuel mileage has had a 3-4 mpg jump in daily driving. I am pulling a steady 23-24 mpg on my daily commute and I am not light on the go pedal by any means. By adjusting the maximum angle table to allow for more lift/duration and increased cam overlap at lower rpms I have found a very noticeable low-midrange torque increase. 20-30 mph roll in 2nd gear brakes the P275/40R20s loose with relative ease. I have found the torque increase so substantial that I am rarely running the engine past 3,500 rpm even when I am wanting to get up and go. The engine just pushes the car around so much more easily than it did before. The torque difference is night and day different. Finally I raised the maximum angle from 68° to 75° from 6,000 rpm to 7,000 rpm and the top-end pull is also noticeably stronger. In Drive the car has a habit of wanting to peg the 7,000 rpm rev-limit before it will upshift out of 1st or 2nd gear. You can feel the throttle plate shut during the shifts to keep the engine from over-reving during the shift. I have raced a couple of newer 5.0 Mustangs, a kid I work withs moded Ecoboost Mustang running a tune, intake, exhaust, alot of boost and a blow-off valve and a new 5.7 R/T Challenger all from a dig and none were even close.

With traction controll off ALL of 1st gear is useless above 1/2 throttle and at WOT it spins about half way through second before it finally hooks up around 50 mph.

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adeedpb
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DFW, which tables were you making the adjustments in, just the VVEL Max table?

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adeedpb
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Also, can you post a picture of your adjusted tables.

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Debonair
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This is starting to sound super promising. Than you DFW2011M56S for sharing. I only wonder what, if any affect this would have on emissions testing and catalytic converter life.

Cali is great for the weather and bad for emission related mods.

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Ilya
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Does anyone wanna modify my map? :). I don't know if Joe is caught up on these new developments yet.

DFW2011M56S
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Ilya wrote:
Wed Sep 27, 2017 12:38 pm
Does anyone wanna modify my map? :). I don't know if Joe is caught up on these new developments yet.
I will PM you my email. Send your ROM to me. If it is unlocked amd does not require a password to open I can alter it to match what I am running.

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adeedpb
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DFW, can you post some pics of your VVEL tables after adjustment?

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Ilya
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DFW2011M56S wrote:
Wed Sep 27, 2017 2:36 pm
Ilya wrote:
Wed Sep 27, 2017 12:38 pm
Does anyone wanna modify my map? :). I don't know if Joe is caught up on these new developments yet.
I will PM you my email. Send your ROM to me. If it is unlocked amd does not require a password to open I can alter it to match what I am running.
PM sent a few days ago, any luck lookin at it? :gapteeth:

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adeedpb
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Any update on how your M is holding up to the changes? Any tables you can share? Anymore feedback you can share?

Toro72
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DFW2011M56S

Are you still running the VVEL tune and if so, have you run into any issues?

Thanks

Toro72


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