Engine swap, I think im good, but wont start

[PhaneSoul]

Well I bought a 93 Vert shell, i put a 95 engine into it along with the 95 5spd transmission. Got everything that I could hooked up. I followed the instructions to hook up the reverse sensor on the transmission and I jumpered the neutral switch wires. But the car wont turn over. I think it might be a grounding problem, the alternator is grounded and the back of the valve cover is as well as the battery also, not too sure where the other grounds are but im searching for that now. Would there be any other reason why the engine wouldnt turn over? I know there isnt a problem with the engine, it was running strong before I pulled it. Any help is apprieciated.

[compactfean]

The main ground should go battery to chassis, chassis to intake mani....all one cable.

[moso]

the ecu should ground out on the front of the intake manifold/head area, near the coolant temp sensor.

[PhaneSoul]

Thanks im gonna look at the grounds tomorrow when I work on it

[PhaneSoul]

Alright so ive fixed the groundings but its still not starting. When I go to crank it i get a single metallic sounding click, sometimes two or three of them but with a second or two inbetween clicks. Any ideas?

[compactfean]

Poor connection from battery to starter our corroded starter cable. Possibly battery not having enough cca.

[lebgangstah]

Can't the starter be a problom also?? , cuz my buddy had a nissan pathfinder that would do that but not turn over replaced the starter and worked , but befor doing that check if the wires r right ,

[PhaneSoul]

and cca meaning? but i will check the starter cables

[lebgangstah]

cca (cold cranking amps) and alright

[PhaneSoul]

Ahh, well i went as far as to jump it becaused I noticed the interior lights being low but that didnt work. Im gonna check the cables as soon as I have time off work and it isnt cold as hell, colardo sucks lol

[PhaneSoul]

Alright new update. I added in a new ground at the back of the intake manifold, after that I tried to start it and behold it went to crank over. Still wont start but im guessing my timig is most likely off. Some negitive things i noticed and the negitive cable comin of the battery is getting pretty hot. also a set of wires coming from the fuse box goin to the top 3-wire plug on the fuse box's side started burning the tape it was wrapped up in. I took off the tape to find nothing besides melted tape. No freyed wires or wires touching ect. I have a feeling the negitive battery cable is getting hot from lack of grounds, or a bad ground connection. I will add in one or two random ground the next time I get out there. THe wire that I unwrapped seemed like it was a ground as well. It was a black wire with silver paint dots on it coming from a plug that wouldve linked into the automatic transmission and the black wire ran back into the tape & was professionally spliced into a bare wire that looked much like a ground wire.

Can anyone tell me the FSM ground points so I can check these?

[compactfean]

Intake manifold, chassis, then battery. Your ground cable should be as large as the power cable in all those areas.

[PhaneSoul]

yeap, got those so the groundings should be fine. What about the plug that wouldve ran back to the automatic transmision? That does look like its a ground wire from what I found underneath the slightly melted but still melted tape. Should I put a ground on the transmision? Im going to check for wire that might be causing a small short next to try and eliminate this negitive battery cable heat issue.

[compactfean]

Maybe a picture of the wire your talking about? If you have the large ground that goes from intake manifold to chassis, then from chassis to negative battery terminal you should be fine. Id you are cranking in that starter in longer than 15 second bursts, any ground write will get hot, especially the small ground wires. Also if you have a starter going out, it can cause the same problem because its drawing to many amps.

[PhaneSoul]

never kept it cranking for more then like 10 secs. I dont think its any part of the engine, it started & ran fine before I swapped it. my intake ground is diff then my battery ground & alot smaller but grounded in around the same location.

[compactfean]

Bingo! When you crank the car the starters ground is the transmission bell housing. So from everything bolted together, the main ground for the starter is through that manifold ground. ...it needs to be as large as the main ground (maybe even larger) for the starter to crank properly.

[moso]

the big ground goes from the battery to the frame rail to the intake manifold, the small ground goes to the back of the alternator!!

[PhaneSoul]

Sweetness, I got the motor started, previously it was cranking and wouldnt start, turns out i just needed to spend some time cranking it getting the fuel circulated. Now my problem is the engine idles REALLY rough (the motors jumping around, it backfires like a b****, spits fire like a dragon when its revved up and wont go past 3500 rpm's), timing does nothing to help it and just kills it. Im assuming it is because I dont have the MAF hooked up, which in my stupidity, i have grabbed the wrong box (intake box from the 96 chassis not the 93) and the connector will not fit. Does anyone know if I can just use the 96 intake box and rewire the connector to it or am I going to have to find a new MAF sensor? Any other ideas on whats up with the motor, or if im missing a key item is much apprieciated. Thanks again for all your guys' help

[moso]

you need the maf, cant do much without it. definitely cant rev past 3500 rpms without it.

[PhaneSoul]

so ive figured, so if there any way to make the 96 maf work on the 93 chassis?

[moso]

so ive figured, so if there any way to make the 96 maf work on the 93 chassis?

I believe the mafs have different voltages, i believe it will make you run rich. most likely will not work with stock ecu.

[night_krawlers]

agreeed

[PhaneSoul]

Well then im glad a just found the maf from the 93' chassis, ill let ya guys know what happens the next time i get to work on it

[PhaneSoul]

alright so i put the maf on, started it back up and its still wrestling around in the engine bay like two sumo wrestlers. I can however rev past 3500 rpm's now. Next step is to actually get a timing light out and check the timing that way instead of just spinning the distributor a lil. A friend also told me to check the tps, any other suggestions?

[compactfean]

Those are very goods starts. Also check for vacuum leaks.

[PhaneSoul]

Well after messing with a timing for 2 days im not sure whats goin on. ill get the car started and running wellish for a few seconds then itll cut out and wont wanna start again. it idled by itelf for about 20 seconds and thats the best i get out of it. i put the #1 cylinder at tdc, put the dizzy in at tdc and it still doesnt wanna start like that, itll only start and run for a few seconds after i mess with the distributor for a little. any other ideas lol

[moso]

looking back I see you have a 95 motor in a 93 chassis, what did you do about an ecu and wiring? when you got that shell, did you check the fuel pump, replace it? have you flushed the tank? how about a tune up on that motor? try checking your ecu for codes too, may give you some insight on whats wrong. just some things to think about.

[lexcrob]

When you put the dizzy in it will face the wire before #1. That helped me quite a bit as i always struggle getting the dizzy in right in the past. Also verify x3 your firing order (plug wires in right spots) You said it ran fine before pulled so dont go checking anything you dont have to. Remember Fuel/spark(at the right time) /air easy! Like mos said chekc the codes they are a life safer sometimes. Try and get it running for as long as you can then check the codes. < even tho its actually kind of hard to check codes good job to nissan!

Im gonna put money on distributor timing im a pretty seasoned mechanic and it threw me for a loop like epic fail.

[PhaneSoul]

Heh well I'm stupid, after all the attempts to get her runnin I've dirtied up the spark plugs horribly, I did a spark test since I could see and smell the gas being injected into the cylinders from manually cranking the engine, so I scrubbed down all four plugs with a wire brush, reset the engine to tdc, dizzy also and it started right up! Idles at 1200 tho, but that could also be a ecu/ engine conflict from it being swapped. Now I just need to finish bleeding the clutch and fix an oil leak at the oil pan gasket that developed from the swap and besides a few minor things like my brake lights staying on after the car is turned off as well as the lights and the ebrake isn't engaging on the driver side and a nice interior cleaning we should be all ready to go! Thanks for all the help guys I do appreciate it and in a year or two I hope to make this one of the nicer looking verts on the forum!! I plan on swapping in a Silvia front end cuz I think those headlights are just dead sexy. Thanks again everyone!!