Engine Management

[kalescio]

Just wondering if anyone knows of a good engine management system and datalogger for a ka24e engine. I wanna put a turbo, bigger injectors, and a cam on but want something good to control all my mods.

[3rD GeAr]

You have the sohc KA and plan on turboing it! what turbo, injector size and cam do you plan to use? I have a ka24et with a t3/t04e 60 trim .82A/R, 550 cc injectors and stock cam. I use the JWT ecu along with the Apexi SAFC with no problems. You could use a standalone like the one offered by ka24de.com/.. good luck.

[fiznat]

or the greddy e-manage, which is what I plan on using.

[3rD GeAr]

you could use e-manage... but dont know much of its capabilitys... much like an safc with more adjustibility to my understanding... the stock computer is able to handle low boost, 300-400cc injectors just fine, but if you plan on going any bigger than a 550cc injector then i would suggest standalone... good luck

[kalescio]

You have the sohc KA and plan on turboing it! what turbo, injector size and cam do you plan to use? I have a ka24et with a t3/t04e 60 trim .82A/R, 550 cc injectors and stock cam. I use the JWT ecu along with the Apexi SAFC with no problems. You could use a standalone like the one offered by ka24de.com/.. good luck.

Thats the exact set up i wanna run. Do you have any numbers on power

[3rD GeAr]

i have yet to dyno the setup but it is pretty fast at 15psi.. at 11psi i ran a 13.6 with street tires and an open diff. good luck

[Chuck Hanlon]

I've got a '93 240sx with the ka24de and have been thinking seriuosly about an engine swap. But, if the ka can turn 13's with a turbo, it looks a lot simpler to go that route. What is the down side? Are they fragile under boost, say 12-13 pounds? What will the power band be? The engine is supposed to be a rugged truck motor, will it hold up or will I blow it if it gets run a few times? The engine has 85K on it and seems real tight. Any voices of experience out there? Thanks.

[Nathan]

For most people, 85k is practically new I would run a compression or leak down test to see how its doing, if that checks out fine then I wouldn't hesitate to boost 12-13lbs. on a stock KA...BUT I would use good engine management, upgrade injectors, maf etc. I also wouldn't just cobble together a junkyard setup for 13psi, it deserves to be done right if you want it to last.

[Chuck Hanlon]

It's the engine management that concerns me the most. I can fab most anything, but those damn electrons scare me. I'm sure that much help is available through the TRULY wonderful folks here, so it is not insurmountable. I learned a long time ago that any engine modification program has to be done in a well thought out plan. I will need info on ECU, intercooler, plumbing requirements, injector sizes, fuel pump requirements, exhaust and much more. As I have said before, I have more time than money, so thorough planning is the cheap part. If I do this, it will be done the right way. Thanks guys!

[02_silver_wagon]

I've got a '93 240sx with the ka24de and have been thinking seriuosly about an engine swap. But, if the ka can turn 13's with a turbo, it looks a lot simpler to go that route. What is the down side? Are they fragile under boost, say 12-13 pounds? What will the power band be? The engine is supposed to be a rugged truck motor, will it hold up or will I blow it if it gets run a few times? The engine has 85K on it and seems real tight. Any voices of experience out there? Thanks.

Check out these numbers on 8psi I think the only think I would spend a whole lot of money on is the engine management. People are always saying tuning is key. I don't think engine management is a place to cut costs.

[WDRacing]

Chuck, The KA, SR, RB and CA are all fantastic motors to boost up. The same principals are applied to all of the engines though. Simply add fuel in proportion to boost and retard ignition timing under boost. If you can do that then your stock block KA will easily put out 350WHP.

Easy recipe, Don't wanna do any tuning yourself. Grab a JWT ECU and the 72lb injector program...then add boost.

WD

[Nathan]

Easy recipe, Don't wanna do any tuning yourself. Grab a JWT ECU and the 72lb injector program...then add boost.

WD

Amen, its the mostly idiot proof method (hence the reason a tool such as myself chose that setup).

[Chuck Hanlon]

Gotcha. Thanks a bunch. This will take a lot of the mystery out of the project. Where does one find these magical black boxes?

[02_silver_wagon]

Check out these numbers on 8psi I think the only think I would spend a whole lot of money on is the engine management. People are always saying tuning is key. I don't think engine management is a place to cut costs.

Sorry to jack the thread, but do you guys think it would be freasable run up to 15 psi on fuel upgrades, SAFC 2, MSD BTM, t3/t4 50 trim, intercooler and everything else needed? Or would emanage be better? How do you datalog with piggybacks? I guess I'm sold on the whole standalone thing and want someone to argue with me as to why piggybacks would be better with the above setup.

[BoyWonder]

Gotcha. Thanks a bunch. This will take a lot of the mystery out of the project. Where does one find these magical black boxes?

http://www.jimwolftechnology.com/

[Nathan]

Sorry to jack the thread, but do you guys think it would be freasable run up to 15 psi on fuel upgrades, SAFC 2, MSD BTM, t3/t4 50 trim, intercooler and everything else needed?

I have issues with an S-AFC II as a higher boost fuel management system. My issues come from it only being able to be modified at a "high" and "low" throttle setting that you specify. IMO, thats just not enough. Maybe for 6 or 7 psi, not not for 15.

[WDRacing]

You can however boost up to 15 lbs with fuel and ignition retard. I think the SAFC or SAFR from HKS would be able to tune a set of 550's pretty well. Again, not the best, but certainly not the worst either.

WD

[huguetpj]

My issues come from it only being able to be modified at a "high" and "low" throttle setting that you specify. IMO, thats just not enough.

Why?

[Chuck Hanlon]

Hey Pedro- What kind of racing do you have in Costa Rica? What is Costa Rica style?

[huguetpj]

Hey Pedro- What kind of racing do you have in Costa Rica? What is Costa Rica style?

Mainly drag races every Monday night. Unfortunately the track wasn't built for drag racing so it ain't a 1/4 mile and it's uphill.

There are also some amateur events, which me and some friends have to put together cause the owners of the track don't give a rats *** about amateur racing if it ain't about them driving their porsches and ferraris.

Last year a new 1/4 mile track was built but it is about a 1:30 drive from home. It still has some issues but we are working with the owners to sort them out. If they only would work faster.

There is also the "professional" circuit racing. But the championship won't start until later this year (when it starts raining, go figure).

Costa Rica style? Ghetto all the way... hehe. May I submit you to the clutch thread?

[Chuck Hanlon]

Sure- I like to learn. Mi espanol no es muy bueno, pero es posible para me a leer y aprender. We used to see quite a few South and Central American teams at the Grand Prix of Miami, so I know there is a lot of action down there. Ghetto is not my style. Nobody will ever know what I have unless I open the hood. No decals. no fart can, just a supertrapp. Thanks.

[Nathan]

Why?

Well, in my understanding of it (someone correct me if I'm wrong), the S-AFC can only be adjusted at two throttle points that you can choose. So say for instance you want to tune for 35% throttle and full, or 100% throttle. Well you make your little map, you know adding fuel one place, taking it out in another etc. Then, if your driving down the road and you go to pass someone and use 75% throttle, the S-AFC just uses that crazy math crap to find the right average between the corresponding 35% and 100% map points that you selected. I just cant trust a 3000 dollar motor to a 300 dollar piece of plastic adding the fuel according to its best guess. You see, I had originally planned to go with an S-AFC II but after thinking about this problem and talking to some people I heard about subies having a problem that could be very well tied to what I just spoke of. They would go lean at part throttle but full boost times. This worried me enough to sell the S-AFC II that I had bought and just shell out the extra 200 bucks for a JWT ecu.

[huguetpj]

Sure- I like to learn. Mi espanol no es muy bueno, pero es posible para me a leer y aprender. We used to see quite a few South and Central American teams at the Grand Prix of Miami, so I know there is a lot of action down there. Ghetto is not my style. Nobody will ever know what I have unless I open the hood. No decals. no fart can, just a supertrapp. Thanks.

Well, you got most of that sentece right

Anyway, by ghetto I meant getting by with what I've got down here without having to spend lots and lots of cash to buy stuff from the US. My car hasn't got a single sticker... never will. Well actually it has just one... the CR Nismo Club sticker, but I fought alot not to have to put it on.

[huguetpj]

Well, in my understanding of it (someone correct me if I'm wrong), the S-AFC can only be adjusted at two throttle points that you can choose. So say for instance you want to tune for 35% throttle and full, or 100% throttle. Well you make your little map, you know adding fuel one place, taking it out in another etc. Then, if your driving down the road and you go to pass someone and use 75% throttle, the S-AFC just uses that crazy math crap to find the right average between the corresponding 35% and 100% map points that you selected. I just cant trust a 3000 dollar motor to a 300 dollar piece of plastic adding the fuel according to its best guess. You see, I had originally planned to go with an S-AFC II but after thinking about this problem and talking to some people I heard about subies having a problem that could be very well tied to what I just spoke of. They would go lean at part throttle but full boost times. This worried me enough to sell the S-AFC II that I had bought and just shell out the extra 200 bucks for a JWT ecu.

It's not quite a guess. It uses linear extrapolation to get the correct value at part throttle. It ain't the best, I know, but with a little patience and some Excel graphing you can get it pretty well. You still have complete control over the rpm axis, you just have to play a little with the high-low values to get the load function slope right.

[Chuck Hanlon]

[QUOTE]Originally posted by huguetpj "]Well, you got most of that sentece right

I TOLD you my Spanish is bad! My Cuban-born son-in-law always laughs at me when I speak it to him. The Puerto Ricans here in Tampa seem to get a kick out of an old Anglo trying to communicate. Oh well.

[huguetpj]

[WDRacing]

I speak just enough foreign languages to start a bar fight in 8 different countries...heh

[Chuck Hanlon]

In a lot of bars in Miami, just speaking English will get you into a fight!

[huguetpj]

[Chuck Hanlon]

Not like that in San Jose, right? My son-in-law's dad keeps telling me to stay away from Costa Rica because those Beautiful Women really like old anglos. Tell me it ain't so!