Engine build question (killing time/building dream list)

[plainzwalker]

So I've been thinking of what I am going to do when the time comes to building/upgrade the engine. I have a general idea of what I want.

So here is my list so far:

Turbo with boots controller (probably will go top mount for larger turbo selection and debating GT30/35)Stand alone ECU (looking at apexi or aem right now)Deatschworks injectorsEither 265/272 or 272/272 cams (not sure of the brand yet, maybe tomei or cower)Z32 or Cobra MAFHead gasket (given)

And what I'm wanting to do, depending on costs and all is rebuild the top end with solid lifters and a few other goodies.

Since I've been bitten with the tuner bug, I am can't stop thinking of what to do next really. So any suggestions? I've been reading a lot of posts and it seems like everyone goes with mostly the same setup, but I want something a little more unique. My goals are to have fun, and learn. Since it's not a daily driver I'm not as worried as down time and all that bad stuff.

I'm looking at 6-7k for the engine (this is a ways off, but like the title says I'm killing a little bit of time and building a dream sheet). I want to try and keep the HP under 550 or around there, unless I decide to build the bottom end as well (possibility has crossed my mind).

So suggestions/recommendations?

Thanks

[SpeedRacer1]

The power goal seems too high, but its your choice. With those turbo's the engine will be a lag monster.

If you are getting a standalone ECU the forget wasting time with a MAFS. The ApexI Power FC D Jetro will allow you to use a MAP sensor and the AEM lets you use one of many MAP sensors available. As for cams thats your own choice, I go for brand name because its simply better quality (for the most part). Same goes with injectors, some have had problems with the company you described, getting a set of Nismo, or other reputable companies (preferably made by Denso) should do fine.

The build you want to do really requires another block because of the downtime. It also requires a lot of skill and mechanical inclination because the problems with slapping a bunch of parts together and hoping the engine will run good if at all.

Your skipping all sorts of areas such as headwork, bottom end work (or even increasing displacement), other turbo parts, clutches that will hold the power, etc. But I guess that is what brainstorming is for.

[plainzwalker]

The power goal seems too high, but its your choice. With those turbo's the engine will be a lag monster.

If you are getting a standalone ECU the forget wasting time with a MAFS. The ApexI Power FC D Jetro will allow you to use a MAP sensor and the AEM lets you use one of many MAP sensors available. As for cams thats your own choice, I go for brand name because its simply better quality (for the most part). Same goes with injectors, some have had problems with the company you described, getting a set of Nismo, or other reputable companies (preferably made by Denso) should do fine.

The build you want to do really requires another block because of the downtime. It also requires a lot of skill and mechanical inclination because the problems with slapping a bunch of parts together and hoping the engine will run good if at all.

Your skipping all sorts of areas such as headwork, bottom end work (or even increasing displacement), other turbo parts, clutches that will hold the power, etc. But I guess that is what brainstorming is for.

Well let me start with the easiest part first I guess. I already have a exedy stage 3 clutch. The reason why I wanted to keep it under/around 550 is because I've read that the bottom end can hold on to 600hp, if this is false then I guess I can look into doing bottom end work as well. I was looking at a few posts/articles about making it a 2.2l engine (can't remember were I saw it but I should prolly start bookmarking these things).

As for other work, I was debating doing a complete overhaul of the head anyways. If/when I redo the engine I wanted to try and make it bullet proof. I've been reading about cryo treatment and a few other treatments for engine parts. Maybe a P&P as well. I know it's all going to be expensive, but I was aware of that before I ever bought the car.

The lag issue is something that I've been thinking about though. I like the turbo response of the stock turbo, but to get the power output that I want I'm going to have to look at the bigger turbos even if that means more lag. Considering I don't plan on doing full boost unless I'm at the track anyways lag really wouldn't be that big of a deal anyways would it? (Actually now that I think about it, more lag would be worse since I won't be able to hit full boost when I wanted it at the track anyways)

(Once again too many things going through my head)

As for the standalone ECU, I haven't heard of the Jetro one. I will definitely have to look into that. I knew about the Power FC. I'm a little mixed on the cams still, after reading the cam sticky it seems people like to run the 264 for lower end power and the 272 for higher end.. I guess I would need to settle on a turbo before I decide the cams.

But yes, this is why I posted, to get some brainstorming going on and point out stuff that either I didn't know, or didn't realize. I am still learning, and remarkable I've learned a lot about the 240 in the last couple months from reading on here. What I do know, is that it's good that I'm not married, because one I start on the engine thing, my dining room area will no longer be a dining room (sucks not having a garage).

[SpeedRacer1]

As far as I can tell Exedy only makes a stage one and two before they jump to single and multiplate clutch kits. I would suggest moving up to a multidisc clutch on a higher hp application.

The bottom end can take 500 hp is tuning is done really well, but that doesnt mean that it will support it well for a long time or lots of track abuse. Building the bottom end is meant to prevent or handle the problems that can come with the higher hp, it allows for more leniancy with the tuning.

To get an idea of what might be involved in building an engine you can check out what some of the other companies do to make reliable higher hp SR's. Tomei sells completely built, race-ready SR's that will cost a lot. Generally they will make you a great SR with the proper engine management for approximately $13,000, this is the info on their engines http://www.tomei-p.co.jp/_2003...t.htm

I am sure you could find a turbo that will suit both the lag and power issues. 500 hp on an S13 is kind of rediculous because over a certain amount the power is almost useless and is just spent spinning tires. A GT30 series turbo will get you to your goals most likely, but anything above that and you will probably be disappointed. Something like an HKS GT-RS which should be able to get you to 400 hp would be a better choice for power and less lag. But there are plenty of choices and opinions on turbo's. By track and the high hp I assume you are refering to drag racing in which case the lag may be bearable to you. But it would make the car a slug for daily driving, or at least less fun except at higher rpm, full throttle driving.

Cryo treatment may be better suited for the transmission componants that you could possibly break at 500 hp, a company like ATS was known to do them but I am not sure of the exact status of ATS at the moment.

D Jetro is a version of the Power FC. There are tons of engine management systems out there that are probably better for that high horsepower application, but the Power FC is affordable.

I understand its brainstorming, do I really believe you will ever achieve your goal? Not really, I cant even count the amount of people who have floated over the forums and said they wanted 400, 500, or even 600 hp and never got close before they gave up and sold the car. But its still fun to talk about.

[plainzwalker]

Well, maybe its not a stage 3 clutch, but its an exedy heavy duty street strip clutch, 3 puck. Maybe thats an equivalent to stage 3?

This is a long term project car, I'm don't really plan on finishing it any time soon. But I would like to be near completion within 4 years (I think thats a reasonable time frame). Since this is also my first project car I do want to learn what will and won't work (preferably before something breaks). That way when I move onto other things (already planning my next car in 4-5 years) I will have more experience/knowledge.

I don't like giving up on things because it's too expensive or too hard. I know somethings are not worth the money, like a complete conversion to AWD or something crazy along those lines. But I don't see why 500hp isn't possible with a little patience and help.

Considering I started this project with only aiming to get 350whp, and was going to be happy with mid 13"s (haven't taken to the track yet, maybe Saturday but its supposed to snow again tomorrow). After driving the SR20det around for a couple weeks, I have a thirst for more. Mid-life crisis? Maybe, but I'm still a lil young for that. Need a hobby to consume my spare time? Definitely.

You did point out another thing that I didn't think about though, was the transmission. I was planning on upgrading the drive shaft, but I didn't think about the transmission itself. I read somewhere that the Z32 (or 300zx) transmission was compatible with the SR/240.

I guess I should just sit and do a lot of research and see what really works and what doesn't, then come back do another brainstorming. Maybe my imagination is getting a little carried away.

[SpeedRacer1]

You'd be suprised how doable an AWD 240SX is. The boss at my last job did one. Its really only a possibility with an RB26DETT or AWD RB20DET because it requires cutting out the 240SX shock towers and welding in the AWD Skyline shock towers. You can even put the R32 shock towers into an S13 and use the R32 front suspension which is nice because those coilovers are abundant and in much lower demand.

As for transmission's, if you dont think the SR transmission will cut it then you can get an adapter plate and put on a Chevy/GM transmission, I remember that there was a kit for that swap a while back. The Z32 transmission is not really an option.