Hey guys so I needed to do an EGR delete, plate is on, and the hole is plugged. Finally got the car to turn on and idle for a while, but it's idling around 2,000 now rather than 1,000. After letting it sit for about 2 minutes it drops down to like 600rpms and sounds like it's about to die. I can give it some gas and it'll save it but still, that's not supposed to be happening. There are no leaks as far as i can tell, i had a few but i fixed them. The hoses are connected, the plugs are all the way tight and there is no air seeping from the egr plate blockoff. There is a slight exhaust leak at the beginning of my cat delete that i will worry about later, but i know that shouldn't be the issue considering last week i was running the car with not even a downpipe on it and had no idle issues.
Before you try to link me to a EGR Delete thread/guide, I have looked at multiple different guides and i have double checked the leaks it had told me to check - that fixed the other problems i was having, i'm having different ones now I believe.
Thank you
EGR Delete, High idle and drops
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centralcoaster33
- Posts: 2634
- Joined: Tue Apr 05, 2005 10:41 am
- Car: 1997 Nissan 240SX #5
- Location: Central Coast, CA
Re: EGR Delete, High idle and drops
I would guess you introduced a vacuum leak. Did you re-route the BPT hoses? There should be no capped off vacuum hoses is my understanding, just re-routed. Incorrect re-routing will cause idle issues. Basically the vacuum line that had a "T" in it will be done the same but without the "T" I believe. Did you block off at the intake side and exhaust side of the EGR pipe and valve? Once that is resolved, you may have to adjust your idle and check your timing, but I don't know for sure.
I'm curious why you "needed to do and EGR delete"?
I'm curious why you "needed to do and EGR delete"?
Re: EGR Delete, High idle and drops
to my understanding i have the hoses rerouted correctly, we tried 2 different ways and the other way seemed to run worse so we swapped 'em back. and yes both sides are blocked off.
The old piping was stuck on the old headers and we just ended up cutting it off because i had found in research that doing the delete was okay. but the nut holding it on was extremely rusty and stripped, and sealed on there after 20 years of heating up and getting cold repeatedly. so i took the easy way out lol
The old piping was stuck on the old headers and we just ended up cutting it off because i had found in research that doing the delete was okay. but the nut holding it on was extremely rusty and stripped, and sealed on there after 20 years of heating up and getting cold repeatedly. so i took the easy way out lol
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centralcoaster33
- Posts: 2634
- Joined: Tue Apr 05, 2005 10:41 am
- Car: 1997 Nissan 240SX #5
- Location: Central Coast, CA
Re: EGR Delete, High idle and drops
I see. It took me two days of PB blaster and a pipe wrench to finally get that EGR nut off for my headers. One option could be to replace the cut pipe and run the EGR again. I know, that's less than desirable.
Can you get us a few photos of your hose routing? I still suspect that is your issue. Also, for a vacuum leak, you can do the old carb cleaner trick and see if your revs climb or not. I suppose it is also possible that your EGR solenoid could be malfunctioning. I don't know, but it sounds like vacuum leak on the intake somewhere.
Can you get us a few photos of your hose routing? I still suspect that is your issue. Also, for a vacuum leak, you can do the old carb cleaner trick and see if your revs climb or not. I suppose it is also possible that your EGR solenoid could be malfunctioning. I don't know, but it sounds like vacuum leak on the intake somewhere.
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centralcoaster33
- Posts: 2634
- Joined: Tue Apr 05, 2005 10:41 am
- Car: 1997 Nissan 240SX #5
- Location: Central Coast, CA
Re: EGR Delete, High idle and drops
Could this be related to changes you made to your O2 sensors? Do you have any codes from the ECU to help?
Re: EGR Delete, High idle and drops
I guess that's a possibility.. The car is running pretty good as far as i know besides the idling issue when i'm at a stop. Didn't notice anything last night when i drove it out to dinner. Should I avoid driving it around?
And sure, here are some pictures
In the first picture i'm trying to show that this hose is curving up and it is connected to this little nipple under this circular plate thing. (sorry i'm new)
In the next 2 pictures i'm trying to show that this hose goes all the way down and connects to what i think is the IAC line?
I labeled it "1" so that you can see what it's actually connecting to.
I have sprayed intake cleaner into that line while the car was running. everything happened that the guide said would, however it didn't fix the problem. I had the 2 hoses connecting into the opposite tubes, but it seemed to run/idle even worse so we switched them around.
I'm thinking the next thing i will try is spark plugs, then maybe o2 censor. If i can't find much more information, but in the meantime should i avoid driving around?
And sure, here are some pictures
In the first picture i'm trying to show that this hose is curving up and it is connected to this little nipple under this circular plate thing. (sorry i'm new)
In the next 2 pictures i'm trying to show that this hose goes all the way down and connects to what i think is the IAC line?
I labeled it "1" so that you can see what it's actually connecting to.
I have sprayed intake cleaner into that line while the car was running. everything happened that the guide said would, however it didn't fix the problem. I had the 2 hoses connecting into the opposite tubes, but it seemed to run/idle even worse so we switched them around.
I'm thinking the next thing i will try is spark plugs, then maybe o2 censor. If i can't find much more information, but in the meantime should i avoid driving around?
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centralcoaster33
- Posts: 2634
- Joined: Tue Apr 05, 2005 10:41 am
- Car: 1997 Nissan 240SX #5
- Location: Central Coast, CA
Re: EGR Delete, High idle and drops
I wouldn't take it for long trips or joy rides, but you're driving it here and there, so it seems okay, maybe a bit of throttle at the stop lights to maintain idle. It's not missing when in gear right?
I'm not sure what carb cleaner guide you used. Just so I understand, did the RPMs raise with spray (leaks detected) or stayed the same (no leaks).
Good photos. I'll have to take a comparison look at my car. I hope to be able to do that tonight. I might have some notes somewhere at home also (I did some EGR stuff in the past, but not a delete).
I'm not sure what carb cleaner guide you used. Just so I understand, did the RPMs raise with spray (leaks detected) or stayed the same (no leaks).
Good photos. I'll have to take a comparison look at my car. I hope to be able to do that tonight. I might have some notes somewhere at home also (I did some EGR stuff in the past, but not a delete).
Re: EGR Delete, High idle and drops
Okay, and yeah it seems like everything is perfectly fine while i'm driving along.
And when i was spraying the motor would stumble as if it were about to die, had my girlfriend stay on the gas a tad while i was doing so. the guide said that I can expect that while spraying
And when i was spraying the motor would stumble as if it were about to die, had my girlfriend stay on the gas a tad while i was doing so. the guide said that I can expect that while spraying
Re: EGR Delete, High idle and drops
**Update** I found a hose with 2 cracks in, I had my buddy feel for air. he opened it up a bit more to feel for the air and the car started to die, closed it and it went back to normal for the most part. and did it a few times. I got the hose off and i'm going to get a new one here pretty soon, will post pictures later.
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centralcoaster33
- Posts: 2634
- Joined: Tue Apr 05, 2005 10:41 am
- Car: 1997 Nissan 240SX #5
- Location: Central Coast, CA
Re: EGR Delete, High idle and drops
Sorry for the late reply. Yesterday was garbage day and I got distracted and forgot.
I read your update and that's progress maybe depending on what hose. If it's the hose in the first picture, forget about it and read on.
I looked at my vacuum lines and I also looked at my photos from when it was apart. I have some ideas based on what I see in your photos.
1. That hose you took two photos of (the second two), well that's not even EGR related and should be left alone. It goes from the intake (you have a #1 by it) to the fuel pressure regulator on your fuel rail. If this is the cracked hose you found, definitely replace it.
2. I see in your photos you still have the EGR control valve ("circular plate thing") connected and you've run the upper exit hose down to the bottom hose. This you show in the first photo and appears to be your mistake to me. You've introduced you leak to atmosphere here if that's what I'm looking at. The leak only comes on when it wants to run the EGR. This also tells me your EGR solenoid is probably working fine, so that is good.
3. What you should do is remove the EGR control valve. When removing it you will also be removing the hose that goes from the exit to the bottom as I mentioned in item 2. You will now have one hose sticking out. The one that ran into the top of the EGR control valve and comes from the backside of the engine.
4. You have two options. Plug that hose is the first. As long as there are no breaks, cracks or leaks in your hoses, you are now good to go. Done. Test drive a bit.
4b. The second option is cleaner and you need to get to the end of that hose where it is on a "T". Remove the hose you followed and connect the remaining two hoses together to bypass the "T". This is tough if you aren't removing your intake and it sure looks like you aren't. So I say skip it for now.
I read your update and that's progress maybe depending on what hose. If it's the hose in the first picture, forget about it and read on.
I looked at my vacuum lines and I also looked at my photos from when it was apart. I have some ideas based on what I see in your photos.
1. That hose you took two photos of (the second two), well that's not even EGR related and should be left alone. It goes from the intake (you have a #1 by it) to the fuel pressure regulator on your fuel rail. If this is the cracked hose you found, definitely replace it.
2. I see in your photos you still have the EGR control valve ("circular plate thing") connected and you've run the upper exit hose down to the bottom hose. This you show in the first photo and appears to be your mistake to me. You've introduced you leak to atmosphere here if that's what I'm looking at. The leak only comes on when it wants to run the EGR. This also tells me your EGR solenoid is probably working fine, so that is good.
3. What you should do is remove the EGR control valve. When removing it you will also be removing the hose that goes from the exit to the bottom as I mentioned in item 2. You will now have one hose sticking out. The one that ran into the top of the EGR control valve and comes from the backside of the engine.
4. You have two options. Plug that hose is the first. As long as there are no breaks, cracks or leaks in your hoses, you are now good to go. Done. Test drive a bit.
4b. The second option is cleaner and you need to get to the end of that hose where it is on a "T". Remove the hose you followed and connect the remaining two hoses together to bypass the "T". This is tough if you aren't removing your intake and it sure looks like you aren't. So I say skip it for now.
Re: EGR Delete, High idle and drops
**Update** I'm wondering if i should try any of that now because I think i fixed it!!! I had a pretty badly cracked hose and i guess it just got worse to the point where it let the leak out, The car idle's decently now and will drop down to about 7-800 RPM's but it won't bog and die out, it'll just chill there for a sec. apparently it was my brake booster ?
so it starts here, on the driver side
and then travels over here to the passenger side, and you can start to see the 2 cracks
as you can see they're pretty big
It runs all the way down, right in front of the smaller hose i showed earlier
I got a new hose on there now, and like i said, so far i haven't had any issues
so it starts here, on the driver side
and then travels over here to the passenger side, and you can start to see the 2 cracks
as you can see they're pretty big
It runs all the way down, right in front of the smaller hose i showed earlier
I got a new hose on there now, and like i said, so far i haven't had any issues
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centralcoaster33
- Posts: 2634
- Joined: Tue Apr 05, 2005 10:41 am
- Car: 1997 Nissan 240SX #5
- Location: Central Coast, CA
Re: EGR Delete, High idle and drops
Okay, I fixed your image embedding.
It's good you replaced that hose. That was the majority of your vacuum leak issue. I like being right about the vacuum leak diagnoses in my first post.
But, you did an EGR delete. You do still have a tiny vacuum leak that will be turned on whenever the EGR would have been activated. It won't be enough to cause your significant idle issues and will be barely noticeable, but it is still a leak and you should fix it. It is a leak about the size of the small vacuum line hose and not the size of your broken brake booster, so it's small and hard to notice.
Anyway, to finish off your EGR delete and address that tiny leak (again, it's only leaking when EGR valve should have been activated) you need to do step 3 and 4 as I mentioned above. Remove the valve, plug or cap off that hose. The hose that remains and gets capped or plugged goes to the top of the valve where there are two hoses up there and the one on the drivers side stays and gets capped or plugged while the one on the passenger side (that you re-routed) goes away with the valve.
I don't know what you can cap or plug the hose with, but you can figure it out. So you want to drive it around and thinks it's fine. Sure. Do what I directed and drive it around. If after that you seem to think something is wrong, put it back on and test it. It's a barely noticeable difference, but one is right and the other is a small and intermittent leak.
BTW - I benefited from this! As I was inspecting my hoses and parts to compare to yours, I found one hose had rubbed into the firewall edge and had a leak! So I fixed it. The leak was in the hose I'm telling you to plug. I test drove it and didn't notice a difference. That's how small of a leak I'm talking about above. You won't notice it, but it's a leak and should be fixed.
It's good you replaced that hose. That was the majority of your vacuum leak issue. I like being right about the vacuum leak diagnoses in my first post.
But, you did an EGR delete. You do still have a tiny vacuum leak that will be turned on whenever the EGR would have been activated. It won't be enough to cause your significant idle issues and will be barely noticeable, but it is still a leak and you should fix it. It is a leak about the size of the small vacuum line hose and not the size of your broken brake booster, so it's small and hard to notice.
Anyway, to finish off your EGR delete and address that tiny leak (again, it's only leaking when EGR valve should have been activated) you need to do step 3 and 4 as I mentioned above. Remove the valve, plug or cap off that hose. The hose that remains and gets capped or plugged goes to the top of the valve where there are two hoses up there and the one on the drivers side stays and gets capped or plugged while the one on the passenger side (that you re-routed) goes away with the valve.
I don't know what you can cap or plug the hose with, but you can figure it out. So you want to drive it around and thinks it's fine. Sure. Do what I directed and drive it around. If after that you seem to think something is wrong, put it back on and test it. It's a barely noticeable difference, but one is right and the other is a small and intermittent leak.
BTW - I benefited from this! As I was inspecting my hoses and parts to compare to yours, I found one hose had rubbed into the firewall edge and had a leak! So I fixed it. The leak was in the hose I'm telling you to plug. I test drove it and didn't notice a difference. That's how small of a leak I'm talking about above. You won't notice it, but it's a leak and should be fixed.
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centralcoaster33
- Posts: 2634
- Joined: Tue Apr 05, 2005 10:41 am
- Car: 1997 Nissan 240SX #5
- Location: Central Coast, CA
Re: EGR Delete, High idle and drops
Upon further thinking about how the EGR valve works (needs two vacuum sources to deliver one vacuum) it is possible that you've essentially plugged the one hose I'm asking you to plug by using the valve assembly as the plug... anyway, it could be cleaner by pulling it out and plugging the hose as described.
How are the new headers feeling? How about having nice brakes again?
How are the new headers feeling? How about having nice brakes again?
Re: EGR Delete, High idle and drops
Okay, I will definitely keep this in mind. I'm going to save it for another day because it's a little confusing - not sure if i'm just being an idiot or if it actually is lol. I appreciate your walk through and your help, it means a lot. \
So far everything is running well, headers are nice and it's nice to be able to have a conversation in the car while driving. I have a very small exhaust leak where my cat delete connects to my downpipe because the gasket came with the cat delete and it's just a tad bigger than the downpipe connection.. if you understand what i'm getting at.
so i just have that to deal with for now, kinda thinking about just getting a smaller gasket - about the same size as the downpipe connection and throwing it on there, which will probably take a centimeter or so off the diameter inside the cat delete. Is that confusing? lol - but that's a problem for another day too lol
Thanks again man!
So far everything is running well, headers are nice and it's nice to be able to have a conversation in the car while driving. I have a very small exhaust leak where my cat delete connects to my downpipe because the gasket came with the cat delete and it's just a tad bigger than the downpipe connection.. if you understand what i'm getting at.
so i just have that to deal with for now, kinda thinking about just getting a smaller gasket - about the same size as the downpipe connection and throwing it on there, which will probably take a centimeter or so off the diameter inside the cat delete. Is that confusing? lol - but that's a problem for another day too lol
Thanks again man!
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centralcoaster33
- Posts: 2634
- Joined: Tue Apr 05, 2005 10:41 am
- Car: 1997 Nissan 240SX #5
- Location: Central Coast, CA
Re: EGR Delete, High idle and drops
Hey, most parts stores have gasket material that you can cut to shape. I wouldn't want to reduce the inside diameter of my exhaust, especially for something silly like a gasket. The also often just have a bunch on a rack and you can measure them and get the one closest to what you want.
So, I have an EGR BPT extra on my work bench. I put the hoses like you have them and put my vacuum pump on there. I got no vacuum because it leaks in that configuration. As I suspected, you are sucking in from Atmosphere with your current setup through the BPT. It's because the top doesn't deliver vacuum unless the bottom has vacuum.
So I still say take off your BPT and plug it. My advice here is based upon the "240sx EGR delete" google search results at 240sxOne Tech, step 5 is what you're not completing.
Maybe you just like how the BPT looks and don't want to plug the remaining hose? Well, re-arrange your BPT hoses a bit as follows. Take the hose from top to bottom and make it go top to top. Take the hose that was on the top and move that to the bottom. That will make your EGR solenoid send vacuum to the bottom of the valve which is just like any normal vacuum valve and it won't leak anymore (ie it won't suck air in from the atmosphere).
It sounds like it's running nicer and quieter. I'm glad your car is coming along nicely.
So, I have an EGR BPT extra on my work bench. I put the hoses like you have them and put my vacuum pump on there. I got no vacuum because it leaks in that configuration. As I suspected, you are sucking in from Atmosphere with your current setup through the BPT. It's because the top doesn't deliver vacuum unless the bottom has vacuum.
So I still say take off your BPT and plug it. My advice here is based upon the "240sx EGR delete" google search results at 240sxOne Tech, step 5 is what you're not completing.
Maybe you just like how the BPT looks and don't want to plug the remaining hose? Well, re-arrange your BPT hoses a bit as follows. Take the hose from top to bottom and make it go top to top. Take the hose that was on the top and move that to the bottom. That will make your EGR solenoid send vacuum to the bottom of the valve which is just like any normal vacuum valve and it won't leak anymore (ie it won't suck air in from the atmosphere).
It sounds like it's running nicer and quieter. I'm glad your car is coming along nicely.