Dreaded catalytic engine killer...

[kingjust627]

Ok, we all know that the cats in the altimas go bad and destroys engines. Nissan will not cover so what is the alternative? Well, I changed out the engine (engine swap) and i'm having issues. After swapping the motor and putting everything back in place, pluggin everything back in the right places, I get a no start. Not even a click of any sorts. Here are some other things that I noticed. When in side the car and turning the key from the on all the way to the off position, the dash cluster starts to flicker. That goes away only when I reinsert the key and the turn to on then off again. Strange. I was thinking it was the IPDM, but i'm reading somethings about a "lock out". Please fellow altima owners help a brotha out before nissan a** rapes my wallet!

Thanks,

KJ

[SlateSER1788]

Not sure what that could be but IMO it sounds like a grounding/electrical issue, but I could be wrong.

So you actually took your whole engine out and put it back in?

[kingjust627]

Yep, took the engine out and put a rebuilt one in. It was actually pretty easy except for the power steering pump that had a bolt that was in an awkward place and was a b**** to get to so that leverage can be applied to break it loose. Besides that, s***, I put the engine on my own with no help. That was an ego boosting day! LOL Anyways, yep, just did the swap, plugged everything back in, and it turned over like 2 times from the ignition key (so I don't think it's a grounding issue) but then after that nada. So i'm like wtf... Then I come here, to the forums of all nissan forums LOL. Hope you guys can help.

[Darius]

For clarification, did you just undo the wiring harness from the old engine and drop the rebuilt engine in its place and reuse the same ECU?

I can't see that being an issue. Are you sure you didn't miss any grounding wires or leave any plugs disconnected? I realize this would be the easiest "swap" possible, but stupid little stuff like that gets overlooked sometimes.

[kingjust627]

Yes, I just undid the wiring harness, took the engine out, swapped out what I needed so that the new engine would drop right in. And that's where it stands now. I just reinserted the new IPDM, and nada... which pisses me off because that means the old one was fine. I double and triple checked all of the connections. I'm at a lost and will let nissan figure that s*** out! Thanks, but if anyone has run into this please lend your advice, it will greatly be appreciated.

KJ

[Darius]

How long did it take you to perform the swap? Did your battery die in the mean time?

I know this is a dumb question, but I'm trying to help rule out all of the simple and free things first.

[kingjust627]

It took about 2 days to make the swap happend. The batter has been dead, I had to go get a new one. Don't mind the questions, if it get's me to an end point that fixes the issue, i'll any all of the dumb questions, or so called dumb questions that may arise.

KJ

[Darius]

So currently, when the key is turned to START, there is not even a click and the engine doesn't turn at all? Correct?

And when you turn the key to ON, does the dash light up correctly or is it still irregular since you've replaced the battery?

It sounds like it may be a starter issue where it is not getting a signal to ground the solenoid valve and engage the flywheel.

[kingjust627]

So currently, when the key is turned to START, there is not even a click and the engine doesn't turn at all? Correct?

The engine does not, nope, not even a click.

Quote »And when you turn the key to ON, does the dash light up correctly or is it still irregular since you've replaced the battery? [/quote]Yes, it lights up correctly all of the accessories work and all. It's only irrecgular when I try to take the key out the dash lights sometime flicker like a relay isn't cutting over all the way, but you don't here the relay.

Quote »It sounds like it may be a starter issue where it is not getting a signal to ground the solenoid valve and engage the flywheel. [/quote]I don't think it's the starter because of the voltage test I did on the wire that goes to it. It doesn't recieve anything from the IPDM and the IPDM recieves the signal from the ECU. It might be the ecu since the IPDM is brand new. I don't know...

[Darius]

Is it an auto or manual and did you replace the old transmission with a new transmission or take your old one off of the block and place it on the new block? I'm wondering if the PNP switch is functioning properly. It could be interrupting the start signal if that switch is not closed.

OR it could have to do with the NATS system.

When the key is in the OFF or ACC position, the light on the dash near the windshield should blink. With the key in the ON position, is that light on or off? If it turns on, that means the NATS system has "detected trouble" and we can go from there. But I thought it only mattered that you had the right key to match the BCM module in the car that would allow the ECU to fire up. Could the BCM module be freaking out or not functional??

[SlateSER1788]

When the key is in the OFF or ACC position, the light on the dash near the windshield should blink. With the key in the ON position, is that light on or off? If it turns on, that means the NATS system has "detected trouble" and we can go from there. But I thought it only mattered that you had the right key to match the BCM module in the car that would allow the ECU to fire up. Could the BCM module be freaking out or not functional??

That's true; sounds like it could have something to do with a security device somewhere. My VW GTI had an "immobilization" feature where if the key inserted into the ignition wasn't programmed correctly (or battery died) the car would start and shut off like 2 seconds later.

But if he's using the same ignition and ECU then I don't know where the computer would have detected an issue unless there's some type of module or something on the actual engine

[kingjust627]

Auto, I just put the old transmission on the new block. I read about the PNP switch, unsure of how to test it.

The light near the windshield, i'm going to have to check that out.

BCM, refresh my memory again... I read alot on that but that was about 3 weeks ago.

[kingjust627]

The immobilizer is where i'm headed to in an answer for why it's not starting. I just don't know how to reset it, or if nissan has to do that.

[Darius]

The BCM is the Body Control Module. It receives the signal from the NATS antenna which receives the signal from the chip in the key inserted into the ignition. If the key doesn't have the chip, the NATS has no "go" signal to the BCM to allow the ECU to send a start signal to the starter. I'm assuming that the starter circuit now goes through the ECU, but I can confirm that later.

BTW, do you have a pdf of the full service manual (FSM)?I have it in pdf format but it is 112MB. I could probably e-mail you the electrical section since that is the likely cause. Let me know either way.

[kingjust627]

Yes I do, can you point me to the correct page on troubleshooting that, and do you think that I will be able to fix it, or is it something that has to be done at the dealership?

Thanks!

Ismael

[Darius]

I'd say stay away from the dealership unless your vehicle is under warranty. The labor rate is ridiculous compared to a reputable universal mechanic. They will proclaim that they are all ASE certified blah blah blah, but what it boils down to is whether they care about actually resolving your problem or if they will just keep throwing overpriced OEM parts at it until it remedies the issue. You probably have to go in there with some kind of idea as to what the problem is to point them in the right direction.

With that said, see page EC-52, EC-97 to EC-100, EC-108 (wiring diagram), EC-148 (IPDM wiring diagram), and EC-443 (PNP switch).

See BL-108+ for the NATS immobilizer system.