Crazy Idea, not sure about it though
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turbo98_240sx
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Crazy Idea, not sure about it though
ok I was sitting in my cubical and thought up something crazy, a turbo that was spooled by the oil flow through the center part. Well it wouldn't be completely spooled by it but for a bigger turbo to help aid in spooling it up. Am I on crack? because I thought some one would have thought of this b4 but I can't find any info to see if its been done/attempted/discussed, My though was that the oil would not only lube the turbo but have groves in the center house shaft of the turbo that would aid in spooling........the only problem I foresee is that it *might* reduce the top end of the turbo by creating a "drag" on the shaft because the shaft is spinning faster then the oil would be "pushing" it, I can think of several ways this could alternately be done and wouldn't have to be on the shaft itself, but would require way more knowledge then I have, the other way was through a gear system that was driven b4 the shaft (by oil) and once the pressure of the exhaust built up enough would "disengage" the oil gear. I realize that oil pressure would be critical but the rewards could be worth the effort. Any comments on this would help as I found nothing, but this seems like it wouldn't be a new Idea and someone somewhere would have thought this up and attempted some thing like it. Let me know what you think.
Re: Crazy Idea, not sure about it though (turbo98_240sx)
I dont think you could get enough oil flow to spin it faster then it already does at idle.
I just had an idea derived from yer idea...
I don’t see why they cant turn the turbo into its own oil pump. Then you could pull off the bottom of the oil pan and return it to the top. It would self liberate as needed. This would also get rid of over pressurizing the oil in the turbo. So less leaking!
You could also add that new and handy electric assisted turbo to help it all spin up with no lag.
Self oiling no lag turbo... Who could beat that? Add water and you got bullet proof performance!
I just had an idea derived from yer idea...
I don’t see why they cant turn the turbo into its own oil pump. Then you could pull off the bottom of the oil pan and return it to the top. It would self liberate as needed. This would also get rid of over pressurizing the oil in the turbo. So less leaking!
You could also add that new and handy electric assisted turbo to help it all spin up with no lag.
Self oiling no lag turbo... Who could beat that? Add water and you got bullet proof performance!
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turbo98_240sx
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I think we might be onto something here, I was thinking that a gearing system would be needed to get the oil flow to actualy build more "force" then the exhaust gas would, I realize after kicking the Idea around with some guys at work that the "groved" shaft would only add effienicy(sp?) and not build any force.
As far as the self oiling turbo, you would I think, lose power from the turbo itself because it would then be driving the oil not being "feed" the oil and in tern create a "drag" from the oil system, In theory though it dose seem like it is feeseable.
As far as the self oiling turbo, you would I think, lose power from the turbo itself because it would then be driving the oil not being "feed" the oil and in tern create a "drag" from the oil system, In theory though it dose seem like it is feeseable.
Two things I can think of right off the bat that would cause problems:
1. As you increase the pressure of the oil to spin the blades, you will also be increasing the temperature of that oil. Engine oil isnt designed to do "work" like this. Seems to me, high pressures and temps like this require special fluid meant to withstand these types of conditions. Overpressurizing and overheating your regular oil, as you can imagine, is not exactly a good idea...
2. Turbos dont work by simply having exhaust gasses physically spin the blades as they exit the exhaust ports. In addition (and where turbos get a lot of their efficiency), turbos are designed to use the energy exerted by the hot gasses cooling as they run through the turbo. Turbine blades use the pressure differentials occuring with the cooling gasses to help spin the turbine-- this is a feature that you would lose completely in tuning the system into an oil-powered pump.
1. As you increase the pressure of the oil to spin the blades, you will also be increasing the temperature of that oil. Engine oil isnt designed to do "work" like this. Seems to me, high pressures and temps like this require special fluid meant to withstand these types of conditions. Overpressurizing and overheating your regular oil, as you can imagine, is not exactly a good idea...
2. Turbos dont work by simply having exhaust gasses physically spin the blades as they exit the exhaust ports. In addition (and where turbos get a lot of their efficiency), turbos are designed to use the energy exerted by the hot gasses cooling as they run through the turbo. Turbine blades use the pressure differentials occuring with the cooling gasses to help spin the turbine-- this is a feature that you would lose completely in tuning the system into an oil-powered pump.
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DRIFTEADOR
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Re: (turbo98_240sx)
i'd go with your first instinct (youre on crack)
there is only a thin sheet of oil between the bearing and the shaft to reduce friction. It's not pressurized and there isn't any significant "flow" that could turn the wheels. only slow it down.
red, funny you mentioned idle cause you'd think for that reason, if not for others, a self oil pumped turbo wouldnt work. the oil fed into it wouldn't be the same in/out of boost. the turbo would starve until presure was built up and flood when fully spooled. with a crank driven pump at least there's pressure at all times.
and i dont think the electric sc/turbo is a good idea. sure, it bumps flow in lower rpms where the turbo cant do it alone but once the turbo surpasses the electric pump's flow capabilities it only serves as a restriction.
there is only a thin sheet of oil between the bearing and the shaft to reduce friction. It's not pressurized and there isn't any significant "flow" that could turn the wheels. only slow it down.
red, funny you mentioned idle cause you'd think for that reason, if not for others, a self oil pumped turbo wouldnt work. the oil fed into it wouldn't be the same in/out of boost. the turbo would starve until presure was built up and flood when fully spooled. with a crank driven pump at least there's pressure at all times.
and i dont think the electric sc/turbo is a good idea. sure, it bumps flow in lower rpms where the turbo cant do it alone but once the turbo surpasses the electric pump's flow capabilities it only serves as a restriction.