Cracking The OBD 1 ECU

[I am Technoman]

I have an extra 95-240sx ECU and I have charted every chip, clock and basically made my own schematic of the ECU. I work around many electrical engineers that can help me crack the ECU. I have access to a lab as well. I am going to take the ECU I have installed In my car which was reprogrammed by JWT and compare the two boards. I will post my findings….

[I am Technoman]

cool... firmware is what I was thinking...

[bruinbear714]

Hey technoman, I'm starting to work on cracking the 240 ECUs. I know the KA24E ecus uses a 27C256 EPROM, and most likely the DE engine uses the same eproms, or maybe a 27C512.

Anyhoo, all your fuel/timing/ignition information is stored on that EPROM, so if you have access to an EPROM reader/writer, just plop that chip off the ecu board and place into the reader to read off the rom.

When anyone remaps the ecu, they change out the data on that EPROM. The problem is that you will need to know what the addresses on the EPROM does. I have the software that's needed to produce the file to be burned into the EPROM. I also have the SR20DET address map and ROM data, so I can remap the SR20 ecu if I wanted.

If you manage to get the data off the JWT and the stock EPROM, email it to me and I'll see what I can do.

Oh yeah, that 27Cxxx eprom is a 28-pin IC I think, similar to the size of the BIOS ic on motherboards. It should have a sticker on it covering the window.

[stash420sx]

hey, if you are able to upload the eprom data i would also be very intrested in seeing that.

[bruinbear714]

hey, if you are able to upload the eprom data i would also be very intrested in seeing that.

The eprom data is just a bin file like any other eprom data. Its not going to make any sense unless you know what each address on the data does, hence, that's what I'm trying to figure out with the KA ecu's.

[Dattebayo]

you guys might want to be more careful about shouting that out so loud. If you copy jwt's .BIN file that could constitute some legal action (maybe, i dont really care but you should watch it any way). I mean they would have to catch you first but thats my thought anyway.

[bruinbear714]

you guys might want to be more careful about shouting that out so loud. If you copy jwt's .BIN file that could constitute some legal action (maybe, i dont really care but you should watch it any way). I mean they would have to catch you first but thats my thought anyway.

As long as the person is not making any profit from ripping off the JWT rom data then it is not illegal.

[bruinbear714]

Originally posted by bruinbear714 "]As long as the person is not making any profit from ripping off the JWT rom data then it is not illegal.

This is incorrect. A noncommercial violation of copyright is still a violation.

Whether or not tuning data is actually subject to copyright protection is another story.

I don't know too much about law and the legal system, but what I meant was that ripping off a copy of the JWT rom code for personal use shouldn't be a problem, that is if you own a JWT modified cpu. That's almost the same as getting a copy of a CD that you own, right?

[stash420sx]

hey, could you please email me bin files anyway. If the copy right stuff is a problem, dont send me the performance bin files. [email protected]thanks

[bruinbear714]

Any luck on cracking the ecu?

At the very least, I would think you have to build an engine emulator that simulates the voltages and waveforms present in the sensors.

[brage]

Technically JWT could be brought down by NISSAN by illigally copying NISSAN rom data, modifying it, and making a profit off of selling the MODIFIED product... Similar to say deleting Jar Jar Binks from star wars Ep 1 and selling it...

I don't think e-mailing a JWT ROM consitutes a violation of JWT's right, only NISSAN's

(although they could give a **** less)

[I am Technoman]

I’m going to see if the programmer/reader we have here at work will read that chip family. I haven’t had a lot of time because My Company has me doing a new project with GPS tracking systems that we build. If I can get this programmer to read I will up load the code from the jwt eprom.

[C-Kwik]

Technically JWT could be brought down by NISSAN by illigally copying NISSAN rom data, modifying it, and making a profit off of selling the MODIFIED product... Similar to say deleting Jar Jar Binks from star wars Ep 1 and selling it...

I don't think e-mailing a JWT ROM consitutes a violation of JWT's right, only NISSAN's

(although they could give a **** less)

I disagree. JWT is taking a product that is already on the market. Then they are modifying the program. Then selling it as a modified ECU. Once you buy a product, you can do what you want to it(with the exception of non-copyright law infringements). There was a thread on the XBox forum a while back that is similar. It is not illegal to mod the XBox by rechipping it. It is illegal to make copies of the software. It's like saying if I buy a movie on VHS, I am not allowed to tape over what is on the tape.

As far as JWT's rights, I don't see anything wrong with finding out the programming, so long as you are not copying it. And this is all under the pretense that all this stuff has copyrights on it. Who knows if they have even bothered seeing as it doesn't really hurt them much not to copyright the programming. There is not a lot of relative demand for ECU programs and the ability to modify these programs is limited compared to our everyday media. I don't see Nissan or JWT losing much money over the cost of getting a copyright.

[brage]

Good point... the point also could be made that nissan has probably given JWT permission and info to do ECU hacks...

I disagree. JWT is taking a product that is already on the market. Then they are modifying the program. Then selling it as a modified ECU. Once you buy a product, you can do what you want to it(with the exception of non-copyright law infringements). There was a thread on the XBox forum a while back that is similar. It is not illegal to mod the XBox by rechipping it. It is illegal to make copies of the software. It's like saying if I buy a movie on VHS, I am not allowed to tape over what is on the tape.

As far as JWT's rights, I don't see anything wrong with finding out the programming, so long as you are not copying it. And this is all under the pretense that all this stuff has copyrights on it. Who knows if they have even bothered seeing as it doesn't really hurt them much not to copyright the programming. There is not a lot of relative demand for ECU programs and the ability to modify these programs is limited compared to our everyday media. I don't see Nissan or JWT losing much money over the cost of getting a copyright.

[Queamore]

I found some people that sell software and plugs to access the ODB I it's http://www.rinda.com I haven't tried them yet but I called them and they say that they can be used on the ODB I's to retrieve the information.

[brage]

Did you ask them if it would work for NISSAN?! OBD I is non-standard between manufacturers unlike OBD II