complete timing chain replacement/ head removal really necessary

[slyedog240sx]

i'm gettin ready to replace the complete timing set on my 93 ka24de. The fsm and my chiltons say to remove the head and i am wondering if it is really necessary to do it. If i do then i may as well get a valve job and the stem seals replaced. My compression is 171 to 170 on all cylinders so the removal of the cylinder head seems like it shouldn't need done if at all possible. I have done head gaskets a few times so i am comfortable doing the job but don't want to spend the $$$$ if it all possible. The head gasket kit i can get is only 60$ for the ishino oem from worldpac (nice to run a parts store). I am figuring around $250 est for the machine work.The search results on this is slim and not descriptive or what i can find is not answered by a reliable source. Any input appreciated.

[datsun2401972]

On my single cam, all I had to do was drop the pan. Just remember to pull out the dowel pins before trying to reinstall the front cover(don't ask me why)...

[jasonsan]

you do not need to pull head /// put RTV gasket at front cover to head gasket areas /// be careful around headgasket /// if you tear it you will need to pull head (it will stick out like a tongue)

[datsun2401972]

if you tear it you will need to pull head (it will stick out like a tongue)

Or, you could just put a quart of oil in it once a week...

[slyedog240sx]

can anyone explain any further in a technical aspect on this. I would like to find out the exact reason the fsm calls for the head removal. I understand the head gasket is all the way to the timing cover but will my compression be compromised or will the cover leak even with rtv around the head gasket in the timing cover area or what?

[datsun2401972]

well, as far as the gasket surface between the timing cover and head goes, it sees a little pressure built by the combustion process(bottom of pistons going up and down in the crankcase area). Your PCV is supposed to take care of that. But if you ever try to take off your oil cap while running(don't btw) you'll feel a pretty good amount of air spewing it's way around the oil cap(along with oil if your not careful).

That's the force that part of the HG has to put up with...which is miniscule compaired to the pressures the rest of the HG sees...

In addition to that your timing chain is whipping all the excess oil around in the front cover/head area.

The reason the FSM probably states that is because it's easier to work with, with the head off. But like Jason said, just rub a little silicone on the bottom of the HG. More importantly, be careful when putting the front cover back so that you don't make too much of a mess of the front of block/timing cover gasket surface. Once you get it lined up, it's just a matter of tapping in the dowel pins, and your set!

[slyedog240sx]

well, as far as the gasket surface between the timing cover and head goes, it sees a little pressure built by the combustion process(bottom of pistons going up and down in the crankcase area). Your PCV is supposed to take care of that. But if you ever try to take off your oil cap while running(don't btw) you'll feel a pretty good amount of air spewing it's way around the oil cap(along with oil if your not careful).

That's the force that part of the HG has to put up with...which is miniscule compaired to the pressures the rest of the HG sees...

In addition to that your timing chain is whipping all the excess oil around in the front cover/head area.

The reason the FSM probably states that is because it's easier to work with, with the head off. But like Jason said, just rub a little silicone on the bottom of the HG. More importantly, be careful when putting the front cover back so that you don't make too much of a mess of the front of block/timing cover gasket surface. Once you get it lined up, it's just a matter of tapping in the dowel pins, and your set!

my fear w/o the h.g. removed is that the slightest bend on it may screw up the seal to the cylinder head as well as the dummy sprocket being hard to remove. I have this laying around so for now i am removing the upper twp guides and replacing the front crank seal. Then when i get the rest of the parts i wan't to put on saved up i'll do the complete job h.g. and all and just pull the engine to do it.

[datsun2401972]

iono about the dummy sprocket thing, once again, i've only worked on my single cam.

If you don't bend it, you won't have to worry. I've done it once, so I know I can do it without bending it np...just have a little faith.

But if you have all those parts just sitting, why wouldn't you just take the engine out and redo all those things anyways?

I guess, if it's your DD don't screw with the head, if not, then pull that *****!

[slyedog240sx]

iono about the dummy sprocket thing, once again, i've only worked on my single cam.

If you don't bend it, you won't have to worry. I've done it once, so I know I can do it without bending it np...just have a little faith.

But if you have all those parts just sitting, why wouldn't you just take the engine out and redo all those things anyways?

I guess, if it's your DD don't screw with the head, if not, then pull that *****!

well it isn't my dd but it is the only dependable vehicle i have to go very far out of town other than the wifes car. If it take the wifes car i have to take the kids cause i won't leave her w/o reliable trans in case something happens. I have a 20month old and a 4 month old so you never know. Plus i am the type of person i will repair anything i can while it is apart so i would need a rear main seal, MAy as well do the iav, the knock sensor is in my glovebox waitin, Do machinework to head,replace rack bushings while motor out,do the clutch and flywheel again, put on header and catback so i am thinking of waiting till i got what i need. I have had the car for 8 years and put 100,000 miles on it. It had 56,000 on it when i got in in feb 00 and it made the tin cna noise then but i wan't it to be the way it needs to be.

[datsun2401972]

Yah, I feel ya, I have a 7month old girl...just said dada today as a matter of fact!

And the rack bushings are pretty easy to replace with the engine in...did mine a couple months ago.

And I like your compressed can of silicone. I did my timing chain at my cousins house...his silicone gun was a POS!@#! Had my arms all shakin and **** tryin to put down a uniform bead...geez what a pain, prolly just old silicone iono...

I bought my s13 in 00...didn't run at the time. It had 76,000 miles on it. Now it has 108,000 I think. Pretty sure I blew a radiator hose over the weekend while in line at wendy's drive thru, so I haven't driven it...

[jasonsan]

even if you replace head gasket , the timing cover procedure is same

when you replace head gasket - gasket will still stick out due to you have to put head on block to do timing chain - i will say again, ive done t-chains on plenty of ka's (mostly altima's) and have not removed head - just dont mess up gasket and you'll be fine. just put a slight coating of rtv on head gasket (both sides).

i wouldnt pull head unless you have an issue or veh is high milage and you want to do preventive maint.