comparison of Q70 to the Q50?

[serickson]

Hello all,

I have a somewhat broad question about the differences between the Infiniti Q50 and Q70 (both V6) besides general dimensions. I recently purchased a 2015 Q70S then subsequently had the opportunity to drive a 2015 Q50 (non-sport) for a couple weeks. I was shocked at how much better (and more fun) the handling and response of the Q50 was over the Q70S, even when the Q70S is in sport mode. I have previously also driven a 2006 Lexus LS430 (V8), 2010 Dodge Charger (V8 hemi), and a 2011 Mercedes E350 (V6), and none of those compare to the stock non-sport Q50 that I tried.

I usually drive hefty sedans (chosen for safety ratings and passenger comfort) and would have thought it unreasonable to expect such response and agility from the Q70S, but it is only 200lbs heavier than the Q50 (plus I'm 5'2" and weigh much less than the average driver). According to the service manuals, the Q50 and Q70 share the share the same 3.7L V6 engine (VQ37VHR).

So what is different about the Q50 that improves the handling and response so drastically? Are the engines simply tuned differently? I found the gear shift points for each car (both non-sport) in the service manuals, and they differ by a couple miles an hr at any shift (Q50 shifts at higher mph than the Q70) at full throttle. At half throttle, the spread is between 5 and 14mph difference between the two. Could that account for the entire difference in performance? Other listed engine specifications are identical. Transmission model and transmission gear ratios are the same. The service manual doesn’t include shift points for sport mode specifically, so I was only able to compare standard to standard mode. But one would think that sport mode on the Q70S would bring the shift points closer to that of the Q50.

I should note that I am not well versed in car. However, I like to tinker with anything mechanical and am rapidly approaching the edge of the car tinkering rabbit hole. If I were faced with the choice of Q models again, I would choose the Q50. But I'd rather not just turn around and sell the Q70S I just got.

So, my main point is - can I get my Q70S to drive like a Q50, or generally improve the performance of the Q70S? I haven't done anything more invasive than reset the ECU in the unlikely event the previous owner (Infiniti dealership owner) drove like a grandma for the existing 3k miles on the car. Didn't make a difference.

Any advice? Is UpRev an option? Am I doomed to become an obsessive car tinkerer as I learn more? (a good but dangerous outcome)

Thanks,
Lin

[Ilya]

Hi Lin. Welcome to the forum.

Sport mode on a Q70 doesn't really do much...it just changes the transmission behavior a little to hold gears longer (such as when downshifting into a corner). It doesn't do anything to the suspension etc.

Personally, I think the Q50, while a nice entry level luxury car, is cheap feeling inside and while it DOES handle better (which could be due to it being 200lb less + smaller...weight isn't everything, wheel base also counts). I'd take a Q70's interior over a Q50 all day and twice on Sunday.

That being said, if you get a RWD Q70 (which the Q70s would be I believe by default)...all you will need to do is get some lowering springs (nothing crazy) or coilovers and you'll feel a HUGE difference in handling (the most you'll need to spend for those is like $1000 tops as BC coilovers and similar go for around $900-950 new) + whatever labor costs you (or if you can do it yourself, great). Add a strut tower bar (which I believe will fit on a V6 Q70 but not my V8) and you'll feel even better handling. You can make your Q70 out handle a stock Q50 with a little work.

UpRev will help with the overall engine performance but it won't be day and night...it'll just smooth out the RPM range, etc. depending on who tunes it. UpRev also has the benefit of storing 5 maps you can prick form on the fly including an anti-theft one and a valet one...so it serves more than one purpose.

As for tinkering...once you get the 'modding bug', it rarely leaves.

[pedsemdoc]

Personally, I think the Q50, while a nice entry level luxury car, is cheap feeling inside and while it DOES handle better (which could be due to it being 200lb less + smaller...weight isn't everything, wheel base also counts). I'd take a Q70's interior over a Q50 all day and twice on Sunday.

I have to agree with Ilya too. It's like comparing my old '06 M45 to a G35. The G is going to handle and accelerate way better, but the interior on the M is hands down the winner and for such a large and heavy car, the M45 is no slouch.

I think the Q50 just feels too small on the inside, the seats felt cheaper and less supportive, and I was annoyed by the touch screen for many of the controls when I wanted the option to have a dedicated button, and the doors seemed less beefy. It kinda boils down to what you want more: luxury with a sporty side or sporty car with a little luxury compared to say a Nissan 350z. Now if you wanted to plunk down more cash for the Q50 Red Sport twin turbo....

You can definitely improve the performance of your M:
many of the G37 bolt ons and aftermarket parts also fit the M since they both have the VQ37VHR engine
you can mod the exhaust, add new headers, add a new intake manifold/plenum, add new intakes, change the suspension/add coilovers, and tune it (+/- dyno, then UpRev or EcuTek)

I haven't lowered mine, but I've (check out the What have you done to your M37/56, Q70 today? thread):
- changed my rotors to the Brakemotive drilled and slotted ones
- changed my interior lighting to LEDs
- changed turn signals to LEDs
- changed fog lights to LEDs
- changed parking lights to LEDs
- added dampening material to all my door panels
- changed by engine cover to carbon fiber
- added some aluminum dress up washers to the engine bay and swapped the engine oil cap to anodized blue
- added the OEM mudguards x 4
- wired up Escort SmartRadar to rearview mirror power with Blendmount under the mirror

Plan to:
- put on a front tower strut bar soon
- add my R2C intakes
- add my oil catch cans
- switch out my start button to a custom one with blue LEDs
- add module so phone can be mirrored on front screen
- get UpRev'd

Would love to:
- add a custom exhaust
- add rear diffuser/different rear panel, ie some expensive JDM sh*t
- add front lip from imported JDM kit
- swap OEM with the Motordyne M370 intake manifold
- vinyl wrap the roof black, vinyl wrap the chrome surround on the windows, swap the front grill for the all black one
- add the side mirror turn signals

There are many things you can do to your ride to make it "yours" - there is a ton of good information on the forums with many knowledgeable folks. Once the mod bug bites you, you might not stop...

Good luck with learning more about cars and your Q70 AND welcome to NICO!

Craig

[armybrat]

They're two different cars...Q50 being a sport sedan vs the Q70 which is a luxury sedan. Having driven both, I prefer the M/Q70 to the G/Q50. MIne is a daily driver, and I just like the overall luxury feel of the M vs the sportier feel of the G. My M56x has plenty of response, performance and agility for me as a daily driver. As previously mentioned, there are plenty of mods that can enhance either ride depending on what you are wanting to get out of your car.

[ibc]

Hmm, really? I had the brand new Q50 as loaner vehicle, and I couldn't wait to get my M56 back from the dealership. The Q50 felt cheap in every way, from lack of power, more road noise, less roomy, plastic everywhere, lousy radio, uncomfortable seats, and so on. Yuck. On the plus side, Q50 had nicer all-around cameras, pretty blue IP lights, but everything else sucked, in comparison. For me, the hands down winner is (M56 or) Q70.

Maybe lowering it would give you that small car handling that you prefer? That would lower the center of gravity, which helps in cornering. Q50 weighs 3600 lbs, the Q70 weighs 3800 lbs, so that's not a big difference.

[LeRoy712]

I can attest to lowering the car to make it feel sportier. My Q70S felt a little "lumbery" around corners and I was ok with that understanding that I have a luxury vehicle. After installing some RS*R down springs my car feels a lot more planted and agile. Plus it got rid of that nasty fender gap that plagues the M37/M56/Q70's. The next things on my list to make it feel a touch sportier is a strut tower brace, ARK GRiP exhaust (on the way soon) and a tune.

[Big_Tone]

I had a Q50 when I owned my M45 and put it in the shop. It was definitely sportier to drive. I actually liked the touchscreen, myself. I still prefer my M56, though. I'm 6' 225 lbs and have a wife + 2 kids. The Q50 wasn't big enough for me long term. Sounds like it may be an option for you, though. As far as the interior quality, M56/Q70 wins hands down in my book. On the performance side, making some adjustments like Ilya and Armybrat recommended will give you exactly what you're looking for in your Q70.

[DFW2011M56S]

Hmm, really? I had the brand new Q50 as loaner vehicle, and I couldn't wait to get my M56 back from the dealership. The Q50 felt cheap in every way, from lack of power, more road noise, less roomy, plastic everywhere, lousy radio, uncomfortable seats, and so on. Yuck. On the plus side, Q50 had nicer all-around cameras, pretty blue IP lights, but everything else sucked, in comparison. For me, the hands down winner is (M56 or) Q70.

Maybe lowering it would give you that small car handling that you prefer? That would lower the center of gravity, which helps in cornering. Q50 weighs 3600 lbs, the Q70 weighs 3800 lbs, so that's not a big difference.

Had the same feeling driving a brand new Q50 for more than a week. Car would only get out of its own way if you floored it in Sport mode and rev'd it to the redline. Engine only pulled well from 4,500-7,500 rpm. Fuel mileage was not much better on the 3.7L either. I was not a fan of the controls either. Finally it had a black leather interior and lacked cooled seats! The A/C in my M56 is also much colder than that car was. The Q50 felt much less stable at 100-120 than the M56 as well. I drove the hell out of that loaner car. The only time the A/C worked reasonably well is when I took it to the casino and had it parked in the parking garage in the shade. After about an hour on the highway it was finally as cool inside as my M56 gets in about 15 minutes. Actually pretty sad considering the Q50 was light blue and my M56 is black. My M56S actually feels like it handles better than the Q50 did as well. The M56 steering is less twitchy and it has wider/lower profile tires. The Q50 felt like it wanted to loose traction in the rear a few times in corners I take 10-15 mph faster in the M. The Ms extra weight and wider tires definately keeps it planted better.

[InfinitiAce]

My dealership let me borrow a QX60 all last week. Now, my M37 feels like I am driving a Ferrari. It's all relative.

[k67p67]

I've got a 2015 Q70 3.7 RWD Premium while the wife has a 2014 Q50 3.7 RWD Premium. The two are equipped similarly except that the 70 has the Tech Package with the extra safety features. The 70 is more-or-less my daily. It obviously has a more luxurious interior. It's a little longer, a little heavier, and a little quieter.

I previously owned a 2006 G35 6MT coupe. The 70 has a soft, comfortable ride but IMO provides little excitement when driven spiritedly in stock form. I lowered it, added aftermarket 20s with 30/35 series rubber and a nice exhaust. Made it a LOT more fun to drive. However, I still enjoy driving her 50, which is bone stock minus the aftermarket wheels with 35 series tires, waaaayyyyyyy more than my 70. Even without being lowered, boosted, or otherwise modified, the throttle response and handling are much better. I imagine that the 50 would beat the 70 pretty handily on road course (my speculation). I hate the throttle response in my 70.

I've subsequently returned the 70 to stock form in preparation to sell and am awaiting the Q60 Red Sport coupe.

[ArmedAviator]

My dealership let me borrow a QX60 all last week. Now, my M37 feels like I am driving a Ferrari. It's all relative.

This is correct.

In regards to the OP's observations, it is most likely a subjective comparison. The Q50 will feel sportier because it has less insulation and is in a smaller package so it can whip around corners a little easier. The speed and acceleration difference is most likely negligible as the weights are very similar.

The greater insulation and despite being the "Sport" model Q70 you're using in the comparison, it's still a premium trim vehicle, probably has a gentler suspension for the "elite."

[Larz]

These are two completely different cars because they were designed that way from the tires up. The Q50 is NOT luxurious by any standard. It is better crafted and uses higher quality materials than a cheaper sedan of it's size, but it stops there. I've enjoyed every q50 loaned to me by my dealer, but not enough to actually live with it every day. It is light years better than any G35 C37 in every way but it doesn't even get within miles of the larger M / Q series. The Q50 doesn't really feel "cheaper" to me in any way, just smaller and lighter and that's because, well, it is. I fail to see the need for two screens. I get that it might come in handy at the rare times, but whenever I've driven it, one screen just has a big fake clock face because I never use it. I also dislike any car with a console that has two gaping holes for cups. Cup holders should be under a door or on a slide so you don't see them until you use them. The interior materials are less luxurious than the Q70, but not cheap like so many other cars in the Q50 size. It's a less expensive interior in a less expensive car. Basically, the Q50 to me is like a Q70 that has been shrunk with a lower cost interior. I am not the average driver (I'm a 6'3 215 pound rugby player) so I need more space in a daily driver than the Q50 allows. I can fit in it and drive it all day long with no trouble, but why would I when I can get a higher class interior and more room in a Q70.

[M37xfan]

..I fail to see the need for two screens. I get that it might come in handy at the rare times, but whenever I've driven it, one screen just has a big fake clock face because I never use it..

I agree, like you, I don't see the need or use for two screens..