CHATROOM: Engine Oil & Filter (schedule, type, etc)

Nissan Rogue forum - Includes Nissan Qashqai and Nissan Dualis as well.
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Beagle_Hauler
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CHATROOM: Engine Oil & Filter (schedule, type, etc)

Postby Beagle_Hauler » Tue Jan 08, 2008 5:16 pm

Am just a few hundred miles from my first oil change and am willing to try synthetic oil. I have never used synthetic in my other cars, but have always heard good things. Am curious if anyone here has filled up with synthetic oil yet and have noticed any changes. I understand older vehicles have oil seals that are not designed for synthetic oil and they breakdown and leak, but our Rogue's engines should be new enough that they have seals that resist both conventional and synthetic oil.


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bill875
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Re: Has anyone changed to synthetic oil yet? (Beagle_Hauler)

Postby bill875 » Tue Jan 08, 2008 6:18 pm

At 700 miles, I switched my oil to synthetic blend Mobil Clean 7500. I still change my oil at about 4000 miles, but on my '03 Impala I noticed I actually got better mileage after switching. I haven't been driving to work for the last three weeks though, so I don't know if it made a difference in the Rogue yet. But I have been happy with the oil.

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flybooey
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Re: Has anyone changed to synthetic oil yet? (Beagle_Hauler)

Postby flybooey » Tue Jan 08, 2008 6:23 pm

I'm coming up on my first oil change too and am planning on switching to full synthetic oil. I've used full synthetic in my turbo diesel VW and have had no problems, VW recomends 10k miles for their oil changes using that quality of oil. Those oil cooled/lubricated turbos get into the 1200deg and synthetic can handle that heat. I've always used full synthetic as opposed to blends. I used Motul in my oil cooled motorcycle and found the temps to be lower.Not sure what brand yet.....anyone else?????

Dave

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Re: Has anyone changed to synthetic oil yet? (Beagle_Hauler)

Postby REDDOG » Tue Jan 08, 2008 6:30 pm

I just did my first oil change with 890 miles on the clock. I used "dino juice" (conventional oil), which I will use until 7500 miles. I prefer to do several shorter drains earlier in an engines life to remove the contaminants that accompany the break in of a new engine. I will then go to semi-synthetic.

Your seals will be fine using synthetic. The problems people generally encounter with synthetics is using synthetics in higher mileage vehicles with sludge covered/dried out seals. The high detergency of synthetic base stocks tends to clear away the sludge, exposing dried out seals to the oil. Sometimes these leaks are temporary, but sometimes they are permanent. One of the best ways I have found to keep seals healthy is to begin using synthetic oil early in a vehicles life and continue to use it.

I have used synthetics for years in vehicles with up to 25,000 mile drain intervals routinely, with no leakage issues and excellent engine longevity. In my opinion synthetics make leakage less likely in the longterm, because they tend to keep seals cleaner and not allow them to dry out.

Which brand of synthetic are you considering, and with what type of drain interval?

REDDOG
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Re: Has anyone changed to synthetic oil yet? (REDDOG)

Postby REDDOG » Tue Jan 08, 2008 6:38 pm

As a side note I should have mentioned my Rogue engine seemed even smoother and quieter after the oil change, which is amazing because I thought it was pretty darn smooth and quiet to begin with. The oil I drained out looked pretty beat up, I don't think dealer parking lot life is easy for a vehicle in the winter, if you know what I mean.

I sent out a sample of the oil for analysis. I'll post the results here when I get them back, if anyone is interested.

REDDOG

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Re: Has anyone changed to synthetic oil yet? (REDDOG)

Postby Lightforce18 » Tue Jan 08, 2008 7:14 pm

I used synthetic oil on my g35 but it got costly it was 65 a change at the dealer. I dont wanna pay for that everytime again.

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Re: Has anyone changed to synthetic oil yet? (Lightforce18)

Postby vox » Wed Jan 09, 2008 6:21 am

I've never heard of or used synthetic oil in a vehicle. Would anyone mind briefly listing some pros & cons of switching? Is this something you can request at service if you don't change oil yourself yet?

thanks for the help

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Beagle_Hauler
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Re: Has anyone changed to synthetic oil yet? (vox)

Postby Beagle_Hauler » Wed Jan 09, 2008 7:51 am

Synthetic has been in fairly widespread use for oh, around five or six years now. I think many drivers of higher end cars are the primary users of synthetic (ie sports cars, expensive sedans, etc). In fact I think the Germans in WWII first came up with synthetic but I doubt it's the same chemical makeup as what we use now. Anway, I just called the dealer where I purchased my Rogue and they are using a semi-synthetic (Quaker State). I put in an appointment for this Friday and will have them do the first oil change (1st change based on normal use is at 3750 miles, it's in the service book that comes with our cars). I want to see how the semi synthetic works as I have already changed the oil @1200 miles using standard dino juice (in fact I'm the guy who wrote the "how to" oil change article..). I think I'll transition into full synthetic this summer at around 7000 miles based on all the comments I've received so far. By the way, thanks guys for replying to my post. For those that are sending oil samples out, I'm very curious what numbers comes back, perhaps we should start a thread charting that so others can judge for themselves? I wonder too, if the first sample you send in is used as a baseline for other samples or if they compare it to all people who've sent in oil samples for that engine series, or if they already know how many parts per million of different metals should be in the oil...I am aware of these type of samples as my father was an NDI (Non Destructive Inspector) for the Air National Guard and did these same types of oil samples for F4's and F15's. They could quite literally tell what engine component was about to fail based on those oil samples. Which is the primary benefit of synthetic, it supposedly leaves better lubrication on the parts for better cold starts (the most wear and tear on any engine is when it's stone cold and you are redlining it down the street..engines are designed and are engineered to operate at a certain temperature, ususally around 200 to 250 F) and for longer change intervals (a guy at work here has a 350Z with synthetic and he goes 10,000 miles between changes). From what I've read the main benefit is that it doesn't break down as quickly and distributes the heat more efficiently than dino oil.

~Mark


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Re: Has anyone changed to synthetic oil yet? (Beagle_Hauler)

Postby Derango » Wed Jan 09, 2008 8:31 am

Beagle_Hauler wrote: (1st change based on normal use is at 3750 miles, it's in the service book that comes with our cars).
Actually, Schedule A is the heavy use/extreme conditions schedule. Schedule B is normal driving and it's 7500 miles.

At least in my book it is

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Beagle_Hauler
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Re: Has anyone changed to synthetic oil yet? (Derango)

Postby Beagle_Hauler » Wed Jan 09, 2008 8:50 am

Aha! I should pay more attention to the schedule...I simply saw the big 3750 listed on the page and assumed that was the normal interval since I'm "old school" and have always changed my oil every 3,000... Good catch, thanks for the update! ~Mark

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exeunt
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Re: Has anyone changed to synthetic oil yet? (Beagle_Hauler)

Postby exeunt » Wed Jan 09, 2008 8:57 am

Except that their definition of "normal" vs "extreme" use is somewhat vague. I live in Toronto, Canada, where winters range from -20C to +10C (-5 to 50F), but the summers are great, at 25C. So should I adhere to the extreme schedule during the winter and the normal schedule during the summer? My drives are usually around 30mins to 1 hour long, so does that provide enough time in a "warmed up" state to be normal?

I switched to synthetic during my last change, and I have to admit that I really didn't notice a difference. I'm a fairly particular driver who generally pays attention to small details too.

jlsatt00
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Re: Has anyone changed to synthetic oil yet? (Beagle_Hauler)

Postby jlsatt00 » Wed Jan 09, 2008 12:19 pm

I will be switching at my next oil change. Those of you who have switched or will be switching, let me know if you notice any differences!

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Re: Has anyone changed to synthetic oil yet? (jlsatt00)

Postby Etch » Wed Jan 09, 2008 5:09 pm

All of my vehicles get Mobil 1 synethetic oil and I've been using it for years. The only vehicle I don't put it in is the 73 Mach 1. As mentioned, high mileage cars risk leaking if it's always used conventional oil.

The Rogue will soon join the Mobil 1 club.

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Kirk in Iowa
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Re: Has anyone changed to synthetic oil yet? (Beagle_Hauler)

Postby Kirk in Iowa » Wed Jan 09, 2008 5:14 pm

I switched to FULLY synthetic oil some time ago. Use it in my wife's Murano too. I used to change the oil at 3,000 miles with dino oil, but changed that to 6,000 with fully synthetic. I use Mobil 1 fully synthetic. And yes, oil sellers are allowed to say "synthetic" even if it isn't fully synthetic, so be careful.

I always change oil myself...been doing that for the last 35 years, so paying big bucks to have the oil changed isn't a issue. Mobil 1 is about twice as much as a good dino oil, but a double the mileage, who cares.

A good (not necessairly popular, but good) oil filter is necessary regardless of what oil you are putting in.

Check out this web site for more info, and be sure to check out the post above in the stuck thread area about changing your own oil...it is very well done.

Kirk

http://neptune.spacebears.com/....html


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Re: Has anyone changed to synthetic oil yet? (Kirk in Iowa)

Postby BrianV » Thu Jan 10, 2008 8:03 am

Kirk in Iowa wrote:I switched to FULLY synthetic oil some time ago. Use it in my wife's Murano too. I used to change the oil at 3,000 miles with dino oil, but changed that to 6,000 with fully synthetic. I use Mobil 1 fully synthetic. And yes, oil sellers are allowed to say "synthetic" even if it isn't fully synthetic, so be careful.

I always change oil myself...been doing that for the last 35 years, so paying big bucks to have the oil changed isn't a issue. Mobil 1 is about twice as much as a good dino oil, but a double the mileage, who cares.

A good (not necessairly popular, but good) oil filter is necessary regardless of what oil you are putting in.

Check out this web site for more info, and be sure to check out the post above in the stuck thread area about changing your own oil...it is very well done.

Kirk

http://neptune.spacebears.com/....html
I used to use synthetic in all my engines, but a lot of testing from Blackstone shows that Castrol GTX DINO in many engines (VQ series Nissan for one) outperforms the Mobile-1 Synthetic. That's the regular synthetic, not the 7500+ ones. For the record, I just switched to Castrol about 7 months ago, prior I was using Amsoil or Castrol Syntec European Formula, but I still got nervous running much past 4k miles so I'd change it anyways, and that's not cost effective.

At any rate, I just change my DINO oil every 2,500-3,000 miles. I know people who run synthetic and go 10k miles, but I worry more about the oil filter in those cases.

Plus after a year you may need to add more oil, etc.

Anyways, I say save your money and get Castrol GTX and just change it every 3-4k miles.

On a final note, any of you who claim it "feels" smoother are full of crap. That's just placebo effect and your brain trying to justify 3-4x the price of oil.

If you do want to run synthetic, run AMSOIL as it truly proves itself in oil tests.

REDDOG
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Re: Has anyone changed to synthetic oil yet? (Beagle_Hauler)

Postby REDDOG » Thu Jan 10, 2008 7:53 pm

Beagle Hauler,

I should have mentioned this before but thanks a lot for the oil change piece you did. I read it before the 1st change on my Rogue and it was helpful to see how everything was oriented beforehand.

It would be cool to have an oil analysis thread here where we could look at each others oil reports.

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Postby BrianV » Fri Jan 11, 2008 4:59 pm

It's also worth noting that people should wait a little while before switching to synthetic. Some of the better synthetics can actually prevent the car from fully breaking in. Most camps think you should wait until at least your third oil change before switching (~7,500 miles or so).

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Re: Has anyone changed to synthetic oil yet? (Beagle_Hauler)

Postby Superdave54 » Sun Jan 13, 2008 5:38 am

I am curious about what brand of Synthetic you are using.

I am breaking in a Versa and a Rogue on Amsoil full Synthetic 5W-30. The Rogue has 3500 miles on it and the Versa about 1500. Neither has shown what I would call excessive comsumption for new engines breaking in. Maybe a quarter of a quart in 3000 miles.

I have also been looking very closely at any potential seal leak points and seen no sign of leakage at all. All this despite being told by the dealer only to use a Castrol Synthetic "blend".

By the way, I am an Amsoil dealer and have had many customers and some family members break in engines on full synthetic oils. The break-ins take a little longer, but the eventual results have been excellent.

When I get about 12,000 miles on the vehicles on the 5W-30, I will switch to 0W-30. At that point I will start extending the drain intervals (filter changes will still be sone at 3750 as recommended) and use oil analysis from that point forward to determine when it is time to change the oil. As a side benefit, I will know the "health" of the engine by the presence (or absence of) wear metals.

The reason I will go the the 0W-30 is that it is Amsoils best, and highest mileage, oil. The higher cost of this oil will be more than offset with less oil changes and higher fuel economy.

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Re: Has anyone changed to synthetic oil yet? (Superdave54)

Postby Cotharyus » Mon Jan 14, 2008 8:13 am

I've been running Mobile 1 synthetic in all of my cars for almost 10 years now. Lots of good answers in here too - generally the leaks that people develop on older cars is because the seals have already deteriorated some, but are "plugged" with buildup and sludge, a few rounds of synthetic cleans that up, and the leaks manifest themselves. I've had synthetic in my Altima since last march (first oil change on that) and just did the first oil change on the Rogue this weekend, and put synthetic in that. For what it's worth, I do all of my own oil changes, and change the oil every 12K miles once it's synthetic, and the filter every 4k during those periods. I have some heavy usage engines that have 150K+ miles on them and run like champs, and have never had anything other than preventative maintaining or general upgrades done to them. Come to think of it, my Rogue (purchased in december) is the only thing I own that's "stock".

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Re: Has anyone changed to synthetic oil yet? (Beagle_Hauler)

Postby Oniko » Sat Feb 16, 2008 7:10 pm

I've used synthetic for years on my Honda Civic and went 200K+ miles on the engine with never any problems, I was getting 33 mpg combined city and highway. Just bought the Rogue and hope the same applies. BTW, Never pay the dealer or a shop for synthetic. If you don't want to change your own oil (I don't) then just buy your own oil and bring it to the shop of your choice and they will just charge you the regular price. I've done this for years and never had a problem.

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Re: Has anyone changed to synthetic oil yet? (Beagle_Hauler)

Postby Superdave54 » Sun Feb 17, 2008 5:38 am

I have always changed my own oil and used synthetic (Amsoil) for years.

I decided to start letting the Honda dealer service my wife's CRV because the filter is a real pain, and I like the service work they do. They check everything over each time, and I have done my own mechanic work for years, so I know they have been honest.

They have always gladly put in the Amsoil and not charged me for the Honda oil part of the bill.

I changed to Amsoil at 700 miles, I now have 4500 and the engine is breaking in nicely. Just about done using oil. I have not used the Service department at the Nissan dealer yet, but have had several conversations with them and talked to people who have used them, and they seem terrific. Goes for both local dealerships. Hope this is a "general" situation.

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flybooey
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Re: Has anyone changed to synthetic oil yet? (Superdave54)

Postby flybooey » Sun Feb 17, 2008 9:14 pm

So what's the deal with warranty and documentation when doing my own oil changes???Just receipts for the oil and oem filters?? Maybe a little excel spreadsheet

tksDave

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Re: Has anyone changed to synthetic oil yet? (flybooey)

Postby REDDOG » Mon Feb 18, 2008 1:43 am

Documentation and receipts should be plenty sufficient. By law the burden of proof lies with the dealer, but we know how legal stuff can go!

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flybooey
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Re: Has anyone changed to synthetic oil yet? (REDDOG)

Postby flybooey » Mon Feb 18, 2008 8:25 am

Fitting little yellow guys

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Re: Has anyone changed to synthetic oil yet? (flybooey)

Postby BrianV » Mon Feb 18, 2008 10:44 am

flybooey wrote:So what's the deal with warranty and documentation when doing my own oil changes???Just receipts for the oil and oem filters?? Maybe a little excel spreadsheet

tksDave
I always change my own oil and have never been questioned about a warranty at a Nissan or Infiniti dealer. However, I've never had an engine failure or anything like that.

As mentioned, by law, they need to prove that XYZ item broke because of user error. I keep a mileage log and try to keep most receipts. The dealer usually uses crap oil like Pennzoil anyways.

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Re: Has anyone changed to synthetic oil yet? (BrianV)

Postby Msdarkdiva » Tue Feb 19, 2008 10:09 am

Sooo… I’m at about 1600 miles with my Rogue would it be a good time to switch to synthetic now or should I wait until the third oil change as mentioned earlier? In the end does it really matter?

REDDOG
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Re: Has anyone changed to synthetic oil yet? (Msdarkdiva)

Postby REDDOG » Tue Feb 19, 2008 4:17 pm

There is no harm in switching to synthetic at any time, however I personally prefer to keep my drain intervals short for the first several thousand miles, and this can be cost prohibitive with synthetics. Therefore I am going to use conventional oil until the 7500 mile mark.

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Re: Has anyone changed to synthetic oil yet? (REDDOG)

Postby 92hatchattack » Mon Feb 25, 2008 7:48 am

I just bought my Rogue SL AWD 2 days ago, and apon purchase i extended the waranty for an extra $18 a month. This bumped my warranty to 6 years/100K bumper to bumper. Included in this is free oil changes every 3750 miles. I belive i will break in on whatever oil nissan uses until around 12,00 miles, and then switch to a full synthetic. Im gusing at that point all i will have to do is purchase and bring in my oil of choise, and the dealer will do the change free of charge within the 3 year time frame.


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Re: Has anyone changed to synthetic oil yet?

Postby XbRogue » Fri Mar 28, 2008 2:51 am

I'm past 3500 miles in less than 2 months... So i'm due for a oil change... I talked to the service rep and said just buy your 5W-30 case and bring it in as its cheaper and all you pay is for labor.. And since its my first oil change i can eve do the synthetic free of cost... I want to know which brand is good? Nissan uses Mobil 1 here…

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Re: Has anyone changed to synthetic oil yet? (XbRogue)

Postby philipa_240sx » Fri Mar 28, 2008 3:10 am

My preferences for oil:

- Castrol Syntec 0W30 (red label, made in Germany printed on back)- Mobil1 is ok, some Nissan VQ (V6) owners report increased valve train noise, but it seemed to work fine on the QR25DE in my Altima.


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