Change of Spark plugs that turned into a 7 hour ordeal!

[redmanfx]

Today I changed my plugs and replaced the Airbox. Along with that I cleaned the MAF, Throttle body and as it turned out alot more. First off, I have to congratulate anyone who has changed the plugs on a Q because it's a pain in the rear, at least for me anyway!! My hats off to you. Wes, your not the only one whose back can't handle all the bending over and I'm not tall. Turns out 6 of 8 plugs were covered in oil, at least half way up the plug. 1 was completely submersed in oil. The drivers side closest to the firewall didn't even have the coil on tight. I hand loosened the bolts all the way off. A piece of rubber vacuum line was wedge underneath so the oil was over everything. The last person who did this sucks big donkey grits!! How can you miss the fact that you can't tighten the bolts down??

Anyway that had to be cleaned good along with all the rest. The inside of the throttle body was as black as yesterdays burnt toast!! Took forever to clean!! Wes, in the change the sprk plgs section of your site your throttle body in small. I have an extra three inches or so which makes cleaning it a small chore. The MAF cleaned real good. The black screen now glistens and the inside is spotless! The intake hose is clean and the airbox is not broken anymore and can be closed all the way.

A 2 1/2 hour job turned into 7 hours, but all is done and cleaned! Glad it's over with to be honest!! The old Densen plugs looked to be all burnt on the drivers side where most of the oil was over the plugs from not being tightened down properly by the last person who did them.

The Q sounds meaner with the closed airbox and surprised me by the improved growl!! Just had to get that off my chest as I'm now medicating myself and my back!!

red:D

[rsiwicki]

damn....that was a long day. Glad to hear it is all back together. I bet she runs a lot better now with new plugs.

[redmanfx]

New plugs, Cleaned and tightened coils, Clean intake.....etc,etc... It certainly does run better with no misfire anymore. Old engines give you alot of dirty things to clean and reseal. More HP!!

red

[ScottJackson]

It took me probably 5 hours to do the plugs on my 92 Q back in february. It sat until day before yesterday because the chain guides weren't done. Well, I did the chain guides in probably 8-9 hours total. Taking it apart and paying close attention to everything as it came apart took 6 hours. From the point of putting in the first chain guide to having it ready to start was only 2-2.5 hours. At the rate I'm going doing supposedly difficult jobs on the Q, I'll be revamping the whole active suspension and adding a blower or turbo by the time I hit 24 (I'm 23 now and 24 in september). Well.... maybe not, funding is somewhat thin with the BMW 540i project and the 69 twin turbo mach1. And the ninja 750 and the BMW 635CSi and the 67 galaxie and.... I've got too many projects that's for sure. congrats on getting the plugs changed. When I did my plugs 3 of them had oil. I cleaned the top of the inside of the spark plug hole and wiped on a thin layer of black RTV silicone to hopefully seal it up somewhat.

[HeavyDuty]

Dennis or anyone else in the business should save this post for the next time someone complains about quotes for various services.

A friend of the shop took 36hrs for a B series swap into a Civic. It would have only cost him $975 to have us do it.

Was it worth it?

[Q451990]

The old Densen plugs looked to be all burnt on the drivers side where most of the oil was over the plugs from not being tightened down properly by the last person who did them.

The oil you found is coming from leaking rocker covers, not loosly tightened plugs or coil packs. The rocker cover seals around the spark plug wells that go down into head. A leak around that seal causes the problems you describe.

I'd go ahead and plan on re-sealing the rocker covers and replacing the coil pack boots (they're only a few $$ each) since that oil can cause an intermittant miss from corrosion.

Heath

[elwesso]

Wow redman, I cant believe yours was so dirty... My TB was spotless except the back of the plate...!

Glad you got it done, and do the plenum and Ill do the plugs with one hand!! Its a definite learning experience, I think I could do the plugs in 3 hours next time.....

[redmanfx]

The oil you found is coming from leaking rocker covers, not loosly tightened plugs or coil packs. The rocker cover seals around the spark plug wells that go down into head. A leak around that seal causes the problems you describe.

I'd go ahead and plan on re-sealing the rocker covers and replacing the coil pack boots (they're only a few $$ each) since that oil can cause an intermittant miss from corrosion.

I couldn't figure out where the oil was coming from or rather how it got there. Head was on tight. It seemed the plugs where the rubber boot coil seal was loose had the most oil. How much trouble is it to go back in there and re-seal the rocker covers? I would want the problem to be corrected. Would I have to take the heads off to do it?

I figure it would have cost me alot of cash to have someone else do the plug work because of all the extra work that had to be done. Money I don't really have. Again, I give all the shop people out there cudos for what you have to put up with and with all the belly aching you get. I just wish I had the cash to get you all to do it, trust me!!

I spent $55.00 for the plugs, $2.20 for the the brake cleaner, $5.00 for the Sea Foam deep creep and .90 cents for the tooth brush. Another $50.00 for the Airbox and 7 hours of my time. I probably saved $150 to $200 bucks, which right now will go to help revamp my active suspension. Now I have the experience and know how. Had to be done so I did it. I will be getting T-3 to do some work later on so I'm not a complete DIY'er.

red

[elwesso]

You just have to reseal the valve covers, its not a real hard job, but too bad youll have to basically do all the same labor as you did with the plugs.....

[redmanfx]

Joe sells those rubber boot coil seals right? I thought Valve covers were different from rocker covers. To be honest I haven't heard of "rocker covers" before. I also need that 1" Air hose attached to the bottom of the the intake tube as mine is old and showing signs of cracking. Don't you just love 251K engines?

red

[elwesso]

LOL... Gotta love it!!!

You need to bring up your Q to smalltown indiana and we'll make that thing as new!

[DAEDALUS]

I probably saved $150 to $200 bucks,

I think you saved more than that! Book time is around 4-5 hours IIRC, so if your local shop charges $70/hr, plus parts mark-up... Money better spent on tools IMO, but I think the general public disagrees with me. I estimate that only 5% of the guys at work DIY beyond just changing the oil, and they're all engineers!

[Q451990]

The term rocker cover and valve cover are interchangable... At some point Q45Tech pointed out the symantic difference - sort of like "plenum" vs. "intake manifold"

My first time of resealing the rocker covers took 2 days. You'll remove everything you pulled before, plus the covers and EGR tube. You'll also need to remove the trottle body again.

One trick I learned from watching Byron at T3 is to get an air driven angle dye grinder with a fine coarse pad attachment to remove the old RTV. Scraping that stuff by hand takes hours and you still don't get the same results.

I think most dealerships charge $500-600 for a rocker cover reseal. Since I had mine in for new timing chain guides, I went ahead and had them replace the rocker seals at the same time. Not sure of the exact charge at T3, since it was all part of a bigger project.

Heath

[redmanfx]

Thanks Heath. I'm sitting here, racking my brain about rocker covers, remembering back when I changed the head gasket on my old 79 Firebird and wound up tearing the whole engine apart because I wanted it to be spotless and clean. Couldn't recall seeing or reading about rocker covers. Valve covers on the other hand I know about.

My friend has two angle dye grinders, but I've never used one. Guess there's a first time for everything. I don't relish the fact that I've got to go back in there, but if that's what it takes I guess I have to. I should replace some of those old hoses as well. I'm just happy I have a place to go and all the tools needed to do this!

I'll most certainly have to take two days to do this, about 3200 mg of Motrine and a punching bag. I still consider the car a blessing and will bring her all the way back!

red

[psychic_mechanic]

Be very careful using power tools to clean surfaces on a partially dissasemled engine, you will get crap down in the engine where it doesn't belong.

You can use air tools to clean the valve covers once they are off the car, but you need to be very careful not to stay in one spot too long or you will ruin the sealing surface. Especially with aluminium.

You should use plastic putty knives to clean the surfaces.

[Q451990]

That's why I recommended the "scrub pad" type attachment - definately not sanding discs!

Heath